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“This book of the law shall not depart out of thy mouth; but thou shalt meditate therein day and night, that thou mayest observe to do according to all that is written therein: for then thou shalt make thy way prosperous, and then thou shalt have good success.”
Joshua 1:8
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Pray for NHWM. She needs our prayers right now.

I hope you all are doing well.

 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Matthew 5:4
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Praying for dear NHWM.💞💞
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You know every time I see the question on this thread come up it irritates me. Scripture says to put God first and to love our neighbours as ourselves, there is nothing there about putting others needs ahead of our own. There is a lot of religious tradition that is accepted as biblical that really isn't, another one that drives me wild is the saying "God only gives you what you can bear".

Sorry, I just had to get that off my chest.
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Cwillie- I am very sorry it irritates you. If I could revise the question I would.
We all differ in opinions and thoughts.
And the thread was not meant for those who have alternative beliefs about said question.
Those who understand the question that was originally asked, understand why it was asked.
Never meant to be irritating or offensive.
We all seek others in similar situations for love and support that is why we congregate here.
Again I am sorry it irritates you.
There are other threads that maybe I don't agree with, I just stay away. Because it is not for me. But I never tell them I don't like their thread, they have their right to talk about what they wish, and all who want to talk with them, not my business.
I love everyone here and do not want to cause conflict.
I love you Cwillie. Sorry.

And there is no scripture that says God doesn't give you more than you can bear, that only is in regards to temptations. So I too don't agree with that statement.
God is our strength so therefore we can bear more than we think we are able.
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I'm not anti faith, I'm not trying to shut down this thread or diss anybody here, I just wanted to put that out there. It seems to me too many people who come to the forum already feel as though they can't meet expectations and adding in religious admonishments, implied or otherwise, isn't helpful.
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All of us come here for support.
For believers, the joy of the Lord is our strength. We encourage one another with God's word, prayer and because as believers it is balm for the weary.
God is a very present help in times of trouble for His children.
So if newcomers see there is hope beyond themselves and beyond another human, what joy.
They may get the help they truly need.
And if it is not for them, they can ignore it, it will mean nothing to them good nor bad.
That is all I will say on this matter. I do not want conflict.
Everyone is allowed to believe as they choose, that means me too.
I hope one day you also find encouragement from some of the words posted here.

🤗
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👐🤗👍
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Hello friends, glad to see CW here:) I sent u a new PM....CW.
And we appreciate your candor, cuz we are interested in how you & others feel about God & how we present Him to others. Thank you:) tiger.
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To my brethren here on this thread, I'm hoping u don't mind my two cents about "rightly dividing the Word".
It can be confusing to unbelievers when we present scripture that doesn't belong in our present day (age of Grace) dispensation.
I realize most believers think New Testamnt started with the gospels: (mt,mrk,lk,jn). However the new testament did not begin until well after the death, burial, & res of our Lord...when Paul was saved by Grace on the road to Damascus. He was the first one saved without the law & sacrifices, (he was the pattern for our salv). Paul was chosen to be the apostle to the Gentiles...(us), & only Paul's epistles have doctrine specific to the Body of Christ...(us). (P.S. the whole Word of God has value to us, it's just that OUR commandments come from Paul's epistles). That's what God laid out for us 2follow in this present-day dispensation.
No offense, Just sayin'.
For help go to: Lesfeldick.org
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James 1:5" If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."


I can see how posting scripture from the old bible may be confusing to some, so I will not do it anymore. I apply those verses such as the last OT verse I posted to secure my heart in the laws I live by under Jesus. Not to hold to the old laws, as that covenant was done away with the blood of Christ.
But you are right it can cause confusion and God is not the author of confusion so I will refrain from doing so.
And this is a good discussion that you have brought up Tiger, iron sharpening iron. And now here is my two cents.
The new covenant did begin after the death of Jesus. Absolutely. I believe on the day of Pentecost in Acts 2.
However Paul was not the first to be saved without the law and sacrifice. There were many before him such as the 3000 in Acts 2:37-40, the Samaritans in Acts 8:12-13,27-40 and Simon the Sorcerer, the Ethiopian eunuch, so you see there were others under the preaching of the apostles, taught by Jesus who were saved without law and sacrifice before Paul.
And Paul did not go to the gentiles first, he went to the Jews first, Acts 13. Peter went to the Gentiles before Paul as you can read in Acts 10 when Cornelius and his household were converted.
My point being that as said in Timothy who was mentored by Paul, "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Timothy 3:16, 1 Timothy 6:3-"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness...;"
Jesus says if you love me keep my commandments. So understanding that Jesus was alive under the old covenant, he still taught and gave commandments that we are to obey and follow. The apostle were taught what Jesus wanted us to know, so that they could go and teach the world, Jews, Greeks, everyone. Of which Jesus commanded them after He was resurrected in, Matthew 28:18-20, "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen."
So they had the gospel of Christ which is also what Paul preaches. But to dismiss the commands of Jesus, the teachings of Peter, James, and others to say that only Paul preached the gospel necessary for our salvation would be false. Even Paul states 1 Corinthians 11:1 
"Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ."
So therefore we are to follow Christ which is the word of God, which is truth and light, and he gave his apostles the gospel necessary for our salvation.

Just my two cents.
It is great to compare notes.
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IMHO, the old English of the bible, words like doth, thee and others (or the Latin et al) can be confusing to those who are not writers. I do write odes and poetry so it comes easier to me to understand. I do realize that some may have a difficult time with it. Thank you, Smeshque for your postings and all the rest of you, Tiger and cwillie.
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Smesque, I think that your testimony has been a blessing to many and I don't agree that this thread creates any confusion.

I believe that people telling posters that they have to take in their parents, after the poster has shared how abusive the parents are and they use scripture to make others guilty is the only problem I have ever seen. And you have never done that, you fulfill the commandment to "love one another, thereby people will know you are my disciples. " there is no doubt that you belong to The Lord Jesus.

I wish that you would reconsider changing your forum. I believe that others are encouraged to do as they want on their thread, I think that you should be encouraged to continue to be the light here. It is your thread.

God has used you to touch lives and hearts, to shine HIS light in the darkness of this caregiving journey. The Holy Ghost will reveal the word to those it was meant for.

I always look forward to your scripture verses, I love the KJV, it has been proven that it is the same word as the original translation. That to me proves that it is the inspired word of God, every word.

Pray about continuing this ministry. I think it is important.

God bless you and guide your decision.
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Agreed-of course this thread does not contain any confusion.
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Hi, I differ on the point made about the "3000 saved in Acts2" (cuz there was at that time a transition going on between the kingdom Gospel: [believe on His Name & be baptised for rem of sins] & the Gospel of Grace: [believe on Christs death, burial & res (only) 4salvation].)
Acts is a place where dispensational study is essential, & I'm sure all our teachers mean well & do their best for us. I will refrain from making any further comment about it, to preserve peace for all.
My duty is to defend the Gospel of Grace & the Christ's DBR as the only way of salv. Thank u 4 tolerating my presence here Smeshque, I meant no insult to ur great faith.
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Tiger- we have good discussions here. And no one should get upset when discussing the Word or spirituality.
This is a good discussion.
First I would like to say I have no teacher, but the Holy Spirit. No man has taught me, only God's word with understanding from the Holy Spirit.
My question to you is why were the 3000 added to the church and not a synogogue? Why was Paul baptized if it is not necessary for salvation? All conversions in Acts baptism followed their belief, and repentence. It is super important to get to the truth if this matter.
The gospel is all in one there is no separation of belief, baptism for remission of sins, and showing your faith by your work, as James speaks, vs. saved by grace only believing and doing nothing else. The grace is the fact that Jesus came as sacrificed himself for us, not given us a free pass, we must show our faith by our life in our conversation(lifestyle)
Paul even spoke of baptism, Romans 6:4, Ephesians 4:5,Colossians 2:12, 1 Peter 3:21.
Baptism is a part of salvation as that is how we are buried and risen with Christ. That is how we obtain remission of sins. The Bible is very clear and all can understand it. But never take anyone's word for anything pertaining to your salvation. We must search the scriptures ourselves to find truth and asking for the wisdom to understand. No man has an interpretation of the Bible, because no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. Everyone must search it themselves to find truth, others cannot do the work for us and give us the answers.
But my friend, I ask you to dive deep into this study, because there is some misinformation that you have been given.
I enjoy discussing scripture it is my absolute favorite thing to do. And I also contend for the faith. There is only one gospel, The gospel of Jesus Christ. The answers are all there for whosoever will.
I love you Tiger. There are no I'll feelings here only love, love for Jesus and my fellow man.
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Not to get too involved here in this discussion because I am not as biblically knowledgeable as you guys but I've always understood that our salvation comes purely from our faith and belief in God. No actions we take (such as baptism) will get us into heaven. Baptism is a public confession of our faith but it isn't necessary to be saved.

If I've misunderstood this discussion, please forgive me. And by all means enlighten me if I need to be enlightened.
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😳I wish I cud read as fast as u can write Smeshque, but so far I got the first 2 sentences answered: they were to added to the 'church'=ecclesia, or 'assembly' which were believing Jews.
Yes they were saved, BUT by the same Gospel Jesus preached to the Jews: believe on His Name, (that Jesus was the Christ sent by God), confess sins & be baptized, for the remission of ur sins. (Recall john the Baptist saying that).
This was not the "by Grace" salvation that Paul instructed the Gentiles to believe on for salvation: which is death,burial&res of Christ alone- for sins, not: believe on His Name, but believe on the sacrificial death atonemnt. (No confess sins & baptism".) Christ alone. No works added.
There were many saved & believing Jews but they never associated with Gentiles until after Paul instructed them that God had sent salv to the Gentiles also & commanded there is no more difference, in God's eyes.
(Paul baptised few, but did so to be as a Jew: to win some to Christ".) But Paul states frequently that his salvation is a new way: & the pattern for the Gentiles was Paul being the first one saved by the DBR Gospel, not the kingdom Gospel. That's the " revelation of the mystery" (hidden until Paul revealed it), that the Gentiles wud be heirs by Grace... Not partially by works: like the Jewish believers.
Our "baptism" is a spiritual one, into Christ. Just as our circumcision is not outward (like Jews), but our circumcision is of the heart. I wud provide verses here, but my browser 'logs me out' every 5 minutes lately & it's awfully hard to keep up. Have told tech about it & maybe fixed tomorrow. Remember Paul was the most devout Jew, killing Christians until Jesus gave him revelation of Himself & a mission to the Gentiles, (who formerly were treated as scum by Jews). Paul love his Jewish people fervently & at first did not obey God's instructions to go to the Gentiles. Shalom.
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Hi 2Gershun! We're glad you're here:) and you're 100% correct (about faith in God's Grace [ Christ's atonement] for salvation). Nothing added by man.
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Hi 2all, it's good to edify each other, but debate is not wise among believers. I can only "instruct in meekness", and that part seems finished, so please carry on with things "as you were" friends. I will go about my business elsewhere. Thanks Smeshque for inviting me to stay tho, very gracious of you. Special greeting to Gershun, & CW for joining in. Thanks to Llamalover47 for your courtesy,...much appreciated.
Goodwill to all:)
P.S. Hope you enjoy the earlier post I made to answer some of the questions asked. ✌.
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A broken person can be of no service to others.
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The truth is in the word of God. It is up to each individual to ask for that wisdom and seek and search the truth, take no ones word for your salvation. Get to the truth, it is there. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light.

Tiger- we will discontinue this discussion and agree to disagree. But there is no malice here only a discussion. No ill will intended. You do not have to stay away.

So moving on.......
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https://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/do-you-have-to-be-baptized-to-go-to-heaven.html

A very good article that explains this subject quite clearly.
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I will take the word of God over a man's article any day.

I have a question.
Why would one fight so hard against baptism, when the scripture clearly states it is for the remission of sins?

Because the devils also believe and tremble, are they saved? They even confessed Jesus as the Son of God.

So what separates us from them?


The word and is so very important in the following verse. We can choose to ignore it or we can believe it.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Mark 16:16
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Tiger: You're welcome. Smeshque is EXTREMELY knowledgeable about God's word, the Holy Bible, much more than me.
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I personally believe the verse in Mark 16 refers to the baptism of the Holy Spirit, the renewing of our souls that happens when we place our faith in Christ as Savior. But I have been baptized in water as an outward sign of what was for me a life-changing inward reality, a symbol of what Jesus did on the cross. That's my experience, though I realize there are different viewpoints. I'm just really thankful for His amazing grace, in so many ways, especially the grace that sustains through trials and the hope that one day He will eliminate sin and pain forever.
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While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
Acts 10:44-48
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This is a mute point. There are many contradictory scriptures in the Bible as well that if you were to take them literally would confuse the point even more.

While I respect you a great deal Smeshque, I asked Jesus into my heart to be my Lord and Savior. I believe I am going to Heaven. Why have I not been Baptized? It was never presented to me as a serious option. I went to a Baptist Church till I was fourteen. I stopped going to Church but never stopped believing.

I'm not choosing an article over the Bible. There are a lot of good Christian articles written by good Christian people who have a great faith in the almighty God. Numerous scriptures were quoted in that article.

I'm done debating this. Peace and Love to you all! No ill will here for anyone or what they choose to believe.
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"Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others." Philippians 2:4 English Standard Version

"Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others." Philippians 2:4 KJV

The world says look out only for yourself. The Word says to look out for others as well as look after yourself.

Peace
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Mark 1:9-11 “And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.”

Nothing in the bible is a moot point.
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