My mom has been a miserable, nasty, and hateful person all her life. As a mother she has dominated every aspect of her children's life.

I understand what you’re going through. I’ve had to distance myself from my mom for similar reasons. She now is recovering from chemo and radiation but she should be stronger by now. She is manipulating everyone in order to get attention and she thinks it’s perfectly fine for someone to totally give up their own family to take complete care of her. She is verbally abusive , complains about everything and nothing is enough for her. She’s even jealous that my stepfather is sicker than her. She doesn’t want anyone to help him. She says that he needs to be in a nursing home. And yet she refuses to get up out of bed , do her rehab, listen to Dr orders,or even use her walker. She can walk by herself but just needs the support of the walker. She’d rather make one of us live with her and wait on her hand and foot. I’m at the end if my rope. I wish you all the best because I’m right there with you. I don’t know who to turn to. She will not accept any help unless they do everything she wants including sleeping. She wants to control when you sleep and what time you go to sleep. No one can get through to her. I’m ready to walk out of her life but I’m scared. I have no answers yet but hoping God will work this out for you and me. Take care

You are in control of your own boundaries. You're mother isn't. Do what you feel is best for you and your family. Your mother made her bed years ago. Now she can lay in it. I have a mother the same way. I refuse to let her cross those boundaries. Good luck

hello. the same. what a ball of sh*t, right. I do for my mom alone, while my dead beat half witted stoned siblings ignore every responsibliity. Yet she gets along with them. Me I am the *sshole. I just keep telling myself, you'd do this for any human. Nonetheless I long for her passing. She's miserable. I've only recently stopped supplementing what my dead beat siblings take from her every month. I tell myself when she is finally dead if that is even a possibility I am free from them all. Thank God for friends and chosen family and travel and curiousity. That saved me.

Omg I think we have the same mother!!!!

Are you my sister?

Im so sorry Helen...it's a really tough spot to be in. I feel your pain. These mothers of ours want to be the driving force in everything we do. It's maddening !! Nothing satisfies them. They suck the air out of the room...an American saying. The neediest people on the planet...its worse than a 2 yr old. My Mother has always preferred the men in our family...females will always take a backseat....but take all crap !! Men can do no wrong. Your husband has to be on your side in this. My sister banded together with me & has had 2 very long & upfront conversations about her behavior towards me & my ending all contact with her & why I had to do it. It's a tug-of-war situation with these narcissistic mothers. We can't change them. If you can...please try to have a calm, straightforward discussion about your concerns. It right help. Please continue to update us on your situation. Venting here...to people who walk in the same shoes as you will hopefully help ease some of your burdens. Hang in there Helen :)

I am at my wits' end today; my brother decided - on my birthday - to tell me that Mum has now noticed we are not going round as much and, as expected, objects to it; she says she misses my husband (the compliant one who usually does her bidding; not me, of course!) and that I am always either ill or working (this from the woman who once said I shouldn't waste my degree). She told him she had left her carer bill for my husband to take to the office even though she passes it on her way to the cafe, and admitted she had sat in a cold draught all day because she 'couldn't be bothered' to get up and close the window. When I told my husband, who moaned that he is 'pig in the middle' and can't please both of us, that he should really put me first, we practically had a fight. I can't get a doctor's appointment easily because of coronavirus; we are sure Mum is depressed and may have early dementia, but if we suggest going to the GP she will accuse us of 'wanting her taken away by the men in white coats' and probably refuse to go. I am desperate; I don't know where to turn for help.

Piper,

Fantastic news! I wish you and your family all the best. You handled that perfectly! We really do have to be direct when going through transitional times.

We also have to put ourselves first, which can be difficult due to being made to feel so damn guilty all of the time.

You took charge and succeeded! Wonderful news! I am pulling for you. 💗

Good for you Piper ! You've made some headway. That must a huge relief for you. Speaking calmly & keeping control the conversation...when it's possible...are key elements to getting your point across to Mother's like we all seem to have. My sister has been somewhat successful in this approach. Our Mother seems to listen to her & responds better to her than me. I'm too low on her Totem Pole to deserve the same respect & acknowledgement. Our whole family realizes who & what she is. She's not fooling anyone. We see now that we've let it go on far too long. My brother's widow called me after being at my Mother's house. No telling what all she was told...we didn't discuss the particulars...but she asked me point blank..."Why did you wait sooo long to do this ? " She's seen how I've been treated for the 30 yrs she's been my sister-in-law. She told my Mother how wrong she is & to make amends with me. I'm not interested any time soon. She told me to stay away from her for now...it as long as I need to. Her support & acknowledgment have told me I'm right in what I'm doing.

Thanks so much to this community of good people...all of in situations we never deserved to be in. Support during bad times is invaluable. You all have so much to offer. Maybe someday we'll all get a better outcome...just like Piper has :)

All

Well done Piper! It probably went well because you'd prepared yourself well and you stayed firm in outlining your difficulties. I hope this is making you feel a bit better in yourself. Hoping it will all continue to go well for you.

Piper, I am SOOOOOO proud of you!!!!

Good job getting the dialogue started and keeping hold of the reins!

I also want to thank the people on this forum. Without all the wisdom that has been shared with me, the emotional support and bonding over so many similar stories I would NOT have been able to have the conversation I had with my mom yesterday.

I'm not going anywhere because this journey is far from over but I want you all to know I will FOREVER be grateful for what you all have given me. I hope as time goes on I can do the same in return as new people come in from the trenches ready to lose their freaking minds.

Thank you.

Ladies, thank you all for the support. I want to give you a shocking update.

First I didn't have the talk on Saturday. I didn't feel prepared enough, so I didn't call or text and my mom didn't either. I texted her Sunday morning and said I wasn't "mad" at her but I did want to talk to her about how I have been feeling, and was 11:30 okay, she said that it was.

I actually took a propranolol so my heart wouldn't beat through my chest. Didn't want a xanax because I wanted a completely clear head. Keep in mind having a conversation with this woman about anything she doesn't want to discuss is like trying to ride a wild bull.

I actually wish I could have recorded the conversation. It went shockingly well! I'm STILL in shock. I was there for over three hours. I kept control of the reins the entire time which is a miracle in and of itself. I think what made this different than any other conversation we've had in decades (at least) is that the first thing I did was go into great detail explaining my crippling depression to her. I gave some back story about how I've struggled with managing depression all of my adult life and reminded her that I've had a psychiatrist for over 20 years. I told her I learned ways to manage things and managed to live pretty happily. Then I told her how all that changed two years ago when she moved here. I told her about trying different meds and enduring terrible side effects, my lack of self care and how some days I could not even get out of bed. I told her ALL last summer I was in therapy. I laid it all out.

A few times she tried to interrupt but after I acknowledged what she said I kept the reins and kept going. I said I felt she didn't like it here, and that I regretted buying the condo, and that we could sell it. I said I would have done things differently.

Then I told her the worst part was that I couldn't talk to her about any of this. I don't know if some kind of mother instinct kicked in for once in her life or she was just glad I came down talking about what I mess I am, but she listened with concern.

That's when I told her being unable to talk about her diagnosis was extremely hard on me. This part got a little touchy at times because she did have some push back, but I chose my words carefully and respectfully so she would understand I wanted to be an advocate. I asked what she expected of me in terms of care and she said she did not want any of her kids taking care of her if she got bad. I WAS SHOCKED. Right then I met her half way by telling her I've done a lot of research and that there would be many things to try before she would need professional care. I said the biggest thing would be safety, like wondering out in the middle of the night. I assured her she is not even close to that yet (she isn't) and that there were many things that could be done to help the situation.

I then moved to the lack of socialization, and how being with peers and keeping her mind stimulated is something she needs. She agreed and we talked about some of her concerns in this area, but I maintained it needed to be done because isolating in her condo was the worst thing she could do. Somewhere in all of the socialization talk I got it out that I could not fill those social voids and that I needed my own life too with my husband. Again she shockingly agreed.

She told me she didn't want to go to the senior center and said something about not liking the building. Then I remembered it is in a big county building with lots of other stuff so she probably didn't feel like she could navigate it, and she also said she didn't like big groups (I already knew this). So I mentioned the senior day care- not using those words (they call it something else) and she agreed to try it!! I was again shocked!

We agreed to try & communicate better & to plan our get togethers (unless emergency) and she was fine with all of it.

I'm still in shock. No joke. Was this really my mother?

Now, the test will be the follow through.

I would rearrange it and tell her that the appointment has been moved because both you and your husband are already busy that day and thus are not available as taxi service - you don't have to explain why. My husband is wonderful but it's the sort of thing he'd do as he's hopeless at multi tasking and would easily double book something else. Book something that you want to do for your birthday and put your carer duties aside for your one special day.

Am I being unreasonable to feel a little fed up that my husband made a dentist appointment for my mother at midday on my birthday, so we can't have a whole day out together? There are local volunteer drivers who would take her for a very small fee, but he hasn't suggested this. I know it's petty, but it's yet another instance of her needs coming first because my husband is too weak to risk a nasty scene with her if he objects to being her errand boy. I don't want to suggest it either, for the same reason and because he would probably have a go at me for being silly or selfish. Sometimes I think he might as well be her husband not mine now, as her being here has affected our relationship quite badly.

Aleta1961, sorry to hear you are still suffering the fallout from a week ago. I too had a panic attack after an outburst from my mum. I’d never had one before and had always thought of myself as a fairly resilient person. They are scary when they happen, but in reality are a perfectly understandable reaction to an abnormal situation. They are also telling you that this relationship is toxic and really bad for your health, so do keep telling yourself that putting distance between you and your mum is essential for the good of your own health. Your mother is using whatever weapons she has in order to try to undermine you, including lying to your cousins about you. Thankfully it sounds like they know the real you and that she is just trying to alienate other family members from you, which is wicked and unforgivable. When I found out that just a few months after my mother moved in with us she started lying about me and trying to present me in a poor way to people in my neighbourhood who I’d known for years, I felt sick with shock and just couldn’t understand what I’d done to deserve it. She would tell them that she did all the housework, suggested that I was lazy and did nothing, when in actual fact I did everything while she went clothes shopping every day! What she failed to realise is that they saw me doing everything in the home and garden, and saw her dressed up at the bus stop every day, so it was quite clear who was lying. It still lead to a lot of anxiety, as I was worried about what was being said about me, and what people would think of me. I’ve since learned that I cannot do anything about the lies my mother tells, and that it’s pointless worrying about it. Instead I believe that over time, people see the real you from your actions and behaviours, and that applies to my mother as well as to me. I’ve also decided that if anyone should mention these lies to me, I’m going to invite them round for coffee with me and my mother, and ask them to repeat what they’ve told me, for her to explain. I know this would end in rage and tears, but my mother would be exposed for what she is. There’s also a danger that you can go over and over the bad things that have been said over the years, and that too is not good for your health. When I find myself doing this, I try to remember a few more healthy and positive thoughts, such as reminding myself that there are other people who love me, and that I have a right to a happy life and to look after myself. A health professional once told me to be kind to myself. I thought that sounded like a cliche but I can now see that it is a very simple and straightforward way of putting things, and absolutely right.

ExhaustePiper....I so feel your pain. It's like we have the same mother. Mine has refused socialization...or alienated every person her age that she could have been friends with. She has depended on me & my sister to form her life for her. It's an impossible situation. I have absolutely no desire to spend any extended period of time with her. She is so in denial about her life & physical limitations. She's always saying how independent she is !!! It's insane...she's stopped driving years ago...just stopped....so that makes her dependent...just one of 100 things that has to be done for her. She's hijacked my life for most of my adult life...while I married...raised a son...tended to our home & worked a very demanding full-time job in Finance. None of that matters to her as long as her every need has been met. God forbid you don't meet her demands in HER timeframe !! Her attitude & nasty comments will be dumped all over you. My ex-husband couldn't stand her. He hated how she treated me.

Being free of her rath has still not really hit me yet. That horrible blowup happened 1 week ago tomorrow. I had anxiety attacks for 2 days after that....& I'm not prone to those at all. She's called me but I ignore it...thank God she doesn't text. I found-out she's called 2 of my cousins recently & told them all kinds of crazy...thru me under the bus !! They know none of it's true.

I hope you can steel yourself up & talk with her. I've been in your shoes so many times. My conversations have never...ever gone well. I'm thinking good thoughts for you. This crazy has to end. Your health & wellbeing should be your main concerns now. I'm happy you have your husband to lean on. My sister, cousin & assorted friends have been my rock. You are not alone in this fight :)

I’m glad my own experiences and how I’m coping are helping others. I can see I’ve made a lot of progress as 6 months ago I wouldn’t have been able to give advice to others as I was so lost and distressed. Tomorrow would have been my dad’s birthday, the first since he died last year. I know my mother won’t give me any support or kindness for this (they divorced decades ago) if I mention it tomorrow. She won’t remember it anyway even though they were married for nearly 20 years. In the past I would have been angry and upset about her lack of compassion but I’ve learned to just accept it and instead spend time with people who do care. Tomorrow I will do what feels right for me and without any involvement from her. I shall light a candle, read a poem, plant something in the garden for new life and raise a glass to my dad.

Chriscat, thank you for all your support. It really helps to hear other people put things in perspective. It helps to hear her behavior is not my fault and I can’t change her behavior but I can change how I react to it.

exhausted piper, we are all behind you 100 percent. Stay focused and strong with your mother. Tell her everything you have told us. When she blows up at you, walk away.

Chris, thanks for the support. I'm going to stay strong and get this over with. It's overdue as it is, and even if she does blow up (she will) I will have gotten things off my chest, and set the wheels in motion for change.

The advice you have offered is also good. The mantra you tell yourself about your mother's bad behavior not being your fault is one that I recently started to use too. I had been told that in counseling last summer, but it just kept slipping out of my mind until a poster here (BarbBrooklyn) reminded me again. It's crazy that other people have to tell us that someone else's bad behavior is not our fault!

I also agree with you that talking with others does help. I'm glad you are getting support from your aunt and uncle. I need to be more proactive in that area. I'm able to talk to my sister, and she is supportive but long distance. I did tell her I'm at the end of my rope and if things don't drastically change soon I'll move before I lose my health and mind. She gets it, she knows how my mom is and fully supports the idea that my mom needs to move to assisted living to be around her peers with memory care support for when that time comes. We were even looking at places online together on the phone. I have a feeling we'll be revisiting that conversation after today.

Elaine1962, opening up to other people is very very helpful. I told my aunt and uncle about the problems with my mum a few months ago and since then I’ve had more support form them than I’ve had in my whole life. When you’ve had a lifetime of abuse, at first it’s really hard to believe that people can be kind to you, but accepting their support has helped lighten the burden. Also, the blame culture I can totally relate to. I grew up always getting the blame for everything. As an adult this led to anxiety and a fear of socialising. Through counselling I’ve recognised this in myself, and the more I now involve myself with supportive friends and family, the less I worry about getting blamed for things. Aleta61, well done for walking away. Stay strong and firm about this. You deserve a life without abuse. As a society we expect that mothers love their children, but some mothers are just not capable of this. Accept you can never change their behaviour, and don’t agonise over it for years as I have done. The first lesson my counsellor taught me was that I am not responsible for other people’s behaviour. My husband tells me he has been trying to tell me this for years, but for some reason the message really hit home during early counselling. Now, every time my mother behaves badly, I remind myself that she is at fault for this, not me. I have to keep repeating this to myself like a mantra, as it is hard to turn around a lifetime of thinking in a certain way. I am steadily getting stronger and that is fine. It’s better to make small steps towards a better life for yourself that to expect to change everything instantly. Hope this helps some of you - we are all here on this forum through choice, and writing about your problems is a form of therapy. I am finding that sharing my own experiences of coping is also making me feel better - giving a little is always good for us, but that is something our mothers have never learned.

Exhausted Piper, I was about to post a longer comment here which I’ll do in a moment, but first, for you, stay strong and focused on what you want to say, and when things blow up, which they surely will, just walk away. Good luck and remember you are doing the right thing. You do not deserve such abuse, nor should you put up with it. Block your mothers calls and texts for a while afterwards if you need to.

Aleta it IS mind blowing that we have all this suffering because of our own mothers. It's extremely twisted that we are "groomed" to not only put up with their selfish behavior but to take on their problems. My mom has always been like this, since I was a child. Very dysfunctional.

Well my husband jump started the talk I need to have with my mom. He ran into her in the hallway yesterday on his way to the store and she asked him to pick her up some water. Next thing I know she's texting me asking me to come over for coffee since my husband was gone. I replied - no thanks, I'm busy cleaning.

About 30 mins later she texts me again saying she doesn't know why I am mad and we need to talk.

Then my husband comes in the door. Apparently when he dropped off the water she told him she invited me over for coffee and I "ignored" her. (not true) He then told her "You two need to talk". So that is what prompted her second text.

Initially I was angry with him for making the suggestion, but I had to hear him out and I see why he did it. He sees what I am going through every day and I am constantly telling him about my many frustrations. I've been telling him I need to have a talk with her, and I posted the same thing here yesterday morning. I've just been putting it off over fear of her wrath.

So- I'm going over today. I'm going to cover two things. One is her refusal to discuss her diagnosis in any capacity. Twice I've brought it up wanting to discuss the future and both times she flew into a rage. The other is her refusal to help herself socialize with her peers and her reliance on just me and my husband.

Both of those topics will be difficult to discuss because she hates both topics. But I'm sick to death of ignoring the 9000 lb elephant in the living room. And I'm also sick to death of her hijacking my life instead of trying to carve out one of her own.

I imagine in normal mother/daughter relationships this kind of talk would be easy. Actually it wouldn't even be necessary. But not here. I'm expecting that my mother will get very angry because that is her norm. I told my husband that too, and he said well at least you will know you tried. Then when I say I'm done, I won't feel (as) guilty.

I already have that sick feeling in my stomach. The fact that I physically react to the prospect of ANY conflict with her is also very telling and not normal. The thought of my son feeling physically sick because he has to talk to me is so repulsive it makes me realize how severe the dysfunction is and how I am NOT the person who can be her care giver for the next X number of years.

Thank you struggling for sharing your story. It sounds like my mom.

It's really sad to know there are this many caring, kind, decent people on this forum experiencing so many of the same issues. Never in my life have I mistreated anyone...screamed at anyone...& generally made another person's life miserable. I'm not perfect...but I try to be very aware of how I treat others. How did Mother's not see how they behave...or do & think it's fine to abuse their daughters. My sister calls her diabolical...I've seen this behave since Jan 1st....& it's shocking to me. Her serious lack of mobility will put her in a Nursing Home...& it's her own fault. My sister sees how a long afternoon can be with her...after a recent Drs Appt. Since I've cut-off all contact it will fall on her. She understands why I've had to do this. But...I know I'll eventually had to step back in...in a much more limited way...just to help my sister...NOT to be my Mother's unpaid employee / Punching Bag...never again. Right now....I'm just adjusting to a different life without all the crazy. Guilt creeps in a little...it's only been a few days since I walked away so I know the decompressing from it's still new.

I hope everyone in this situation can find a way to escape it...its like being in prison...without the bars & armed guards. AND...it's our own mothers doing this to us. We probably all need therapy to cope with it. My good thoughts are with all of you.

needhelpwithmon, there is no rhyme or reason why some mothers or grandmother’s are so nice and why some aren’t. Especially in the same family. My mother’s mother was a sweetheart. I just don’t get it.

Elaine,

My husband’s grandma was the opposite of mine. Mine was a doll. She was a witch. She ruined holidays for everyone, especially her husband. He was sweet. Oh, how everyone wished he had divorced her!

My MIL got screwed twice! Her mom and her MIL were awful. She did have a wonderful grandmother. Her mom’s mom who lived to be just shy of 102 was a sweetheart.

My mother ruined many many holidays because of her outbursts. One time many years ago we were going to my aunt and uncles house for Thanksgiving. My husband and I drove our own car and my parent drove their car. I don’t even think we had kids yet. She walks in the door and starts screaming at my father be at SHE forgot the pictures she was going to show my aunt and uncle. SHE forgot the pictures BUT it was my FATHERS fault!! He was blamed for EVERYTHING!!!!! He was the brunt of her abusive the whole time he was alive. My aunt and uncle lived an hour away so she couldn’t just leave and get the pictures. No we had to listen to her rant and rave for hours while my aunt and uncle calmed her down.

Exhausted Piper, I use to keep everything inside and not tell anyone anything. But recently I have opened up to a couple of coworkers and I told my Aunt. It was very liberating!! I also told her family doctor everything!! I told APS everything. It hasn’t changed anything as far as her leaving that house, BUT it has changed me and how I respond to her. I don’t run over there all the time. I don’t run up to the hospital all the time. I actually would rather be at work than go over to my mothers house. I have FMLA and have acquired 880 hours of sick time so I do get paid every time I have to go to my mothers instead of work. But lately I would rather be at work, so I choose to go to work instead.

Exhausted piper. I know what you mean about the competent thing. But as APS explained to me , just because someone makes bad decisions such as hoarding or gambling this doesn’t make them incompetent. My mother has been a hoarder and gambling addict for 20 years. It’s nothing new. But i know she has an undiagnosed, untreated mental illness such as borderline personality disorder, bipolar, or narcissistic disorder. But she is an evil genius and scored high on the mocca competency test. She gets her own food, cooks her own food in microwave, pays her own bills, takes call a bus for her groceries, calls 911 all by herself for help. So in the eyes of the law, she is competent. Chriscat, I am so sorry everything you have gone through also.