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elmo - let her go ballistic. She will get over it. Tell her you are not living with her anywhere, and it is not open for discussion and then talk about something else. If she starts getting abusive over the phone - yelling etc - tell her you won't speak with her unless she is civil, and hang up and don't answer the rest of the day or however long you think it will take her to settle down, She is using her anger to manipulate you. She is changing her mind - so let her. You are not moving there - period, end of discussion. It doesn't have to impact you. Once she starts to pressure you on the phone, tell her you have to go and hang up. She is abusive and you don't have to put up with it. My mother is too and uses anger to try to get her way. I have earned to not even pick up the phone sometimes, or to hang up when she gets abusive and to distance myself more and more from her for my own survival. You need to apply boundaries and to detach from your mother. It s the only way to deal with someone like her.
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And then after telling me last week me moving to Arizona is NOT a good idea after all? Now she is pressuring me to move there again.
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HELP! My mom calls me today to thank me for the flowers I sent for Mother's Day. I was fine. Then she tells me she got in trouble at her job(though with my mom its hard to tell what really happened). Yet she didn't get fired and they gave her a mother's day plant the next day thanking her for what she does for them! Anyways, she is now pressuring me to make a decision about living with her and where. She tells me "You are an adult and it's your decision" but then goes on to say "I just don't want you to end up like your Aunt Peggy(her sister) who never does anything or goes anywhere! OMG. I am literally shaking since getting off the phone with her. I love my mother but I don't want to live with her and I know when I tell her that she is going to go ballistic!
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I relate to this very much it has been this way most off my life my mom is 76 she is a very negative and unhappy person and lives in the pass and repeat her story's from the pass over and over again it has been that way all my life I don't think I can really remember her being truly happy !she has always wanted to kill herself or wishes she would die,she always finding something wrong with herself it's one thing or another ,she dose suffer from mentally illness ,she has 6 kids including me everyone lives in another state she has always mainly dependent on me , I have depression myself I have Spent many years and a lot of money going to canceling to be a more healthy person ! I have had to stop contact with some of my siblings because it's just to unhealthy for me! My mom lives around the block from me I have somewhat a relationship with her it's very hard I think it makes me depressed ,I can only be around her maybe one day a week and sometime none at all ! Sometime I think the only peace she is going to have is when she passes away, it make me very very sad what a waste of life she very smart and intelligent she could of done so much with her life!!! I'm just trying not to lose myself with all the craziness in my family!!!
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Elmapalooza- She does not sound like much of a friend, she certainly is not listening to you. I am amazed when people are so free with telling others what they "should" do.
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What really gets me is then whenever I try and tell people about my mom they think I am either exaggerating or that she is just "lonely"! My mother is far from lonely. A friend of mine when I first told her about my mom was pretty suprised and she was very supportive and shocked at how my mom treated me. Even heard my mom call me mentally disabled. But now she thinks she is just "lonely" and that I should just move in with her! It's hard to make people understand what she is like because when people DO meet her she is on her best behavior!
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ELMOPALOOZA - DO NOT - I repeat - DO NOT EVER move in with a controlling person. Be it parent, friend, or significant other. Life will be a level of Hades that Dante forgot to write about. Add dementia to personality disorders and you may get yourself into a pickle that is very hard to get out of.

You are an adult who does not owe anyone any kind of explanation about your boundaries and choices. Write that out 100 times a day until it sticks. You get to own your choices and decisions. You don't owe mom.

There are a lot of us on this site who have lived with a narcissistic parent to do old age caregiving. Safe to say it will darn near kill you. A lot of people come to this site in a real crisis because they let mom/dad move in and reality is not matching with the Disney movie that was in everyone's head. It never does.

Dementia gets worse in spurts nobody can predict. Whatever the state of things "today", it may not be like this in 2 weeks, 6 weeks, or who knows. My mother compared to a year ago is much, much, much worse and needs an extremely high level of care. It takes 2-3 people to transfer her.

When you do finally talk to your mom, be prepared for fireworks. If she gets ugly, tell her that you will have to talk about it later when she isn't upset and hang up. We can talk when you aren't upset (which is code for being mean and terrible).

Tell your mom what I told mine. Use what you can:
- My home is not safe for you. You will fall and I can't pick you up.
- My bathrooms can't be modified for rails and other safety equipment.
- I won't give up my cats and they are a fall hazard as much as the stairs
- I will not quit my job to stay home with you all day.
- My home is not a dementia ward. I didn't say it so plainly, but that's what I meant. I will not live in a dementia ward and neither will my family.
- I don't have staff to cover 24/7/365 like they do in assisted living
- I don't have a commercial washer
- I don't have a commercial kitchen
- I don't have cleaners and janitors
- I don't have an activities director
- I can't lift you or help you transfer
- I will absolutely not do her butt wiping.
- I can't afford to replace carpet and furniture when bodily accidents happen. And they will a lot more than you think with dementia.
- I don't have enough time off work to run you to various doctor appointments. A one hour appointment was never less than a 5 hour ordeal with her. The doctors go to her in the nursing home.
- I can't keep you from wandering out of my home and getting lost.

Go explore assisted living or if she needs more care, a memory care community where they can handle her changing needs, any kind of crisis that will come up, and you get to keep your home as a safe haven from her stress.
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Well without my help, my mom finally realized that me moving to Arizona is a bad idea! So at least I can skip that conversation with her. But she still wants us to live together! The thought of that makes me cringe. I love my mom but she can be mean and nasty and the thought of living with her just fills me with dread because I know she will harp on me for things. She treats me like I am 4 not 41. Good thing is that she can't really do anything about moving here until next Spring. So in that time things could change and she might decide it's not a good idea. But if not then I am going to have to tell her how I feel and with my mom and the way she can act I am not looking forward to that.
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You are so smart!
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This site is great and has given me comfort in knowing I'm not the only one going through a difficult situation with my parents. I grew up with a narcisistic self centered dad and my mom was co-dependent. I often compare their relationship to the Stockholm Syndrome. I'm now 62 y.o. but all my life I hid behind my dad's verbal and emotional abuse. I was actually very afraid of him. As he got older he got nastier; which didn't surprise me. When I wanted to help, he pushed me totally out of his life. I ended up not seeing him the last year of his life. In fact, when he died I was notified by their attorney three months later that he had passed. A very dysfunctional family. Now my mom is 83 with dementia and acts just like my father. When I tried to help her, she locked me out of the house & pushed me out of her life as well. It's been eight months since I've visited or spoken with her. I had to separate myself from the toxic situation, it was destroying me. Thank you for this website. I no longer feel alone.
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You are not alone. My mother has been very self-focused and hyperbolic her entire life. I visualize her as a gaping sucking pit into which you can throw your entire self to be completely consumed, after which she would complain that you were completely inadequate. Our family does one of two things - walk away entirely and have nothing to do with her, or give in to her constant demands and insults because it is easier than fighting. Doctors have refused to treat her anymore. I believe she suffers from something called Borderline Personality Disorder. If you do a web search of the term, you will find lots of information on children of Borderline parents.

I've come to realize she can't give to me (love, gratitude, acceptance) what she can't give to herself. Her issues are not my fault. I can't fix her. It is not reasonable for her to take over my life. I try to focus on hating the illness, and not the person. It's hard.
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rovan, I hear your point, but I would add that the other side of the coin for many mentally ill is often how expensive their meds are, how limited many of those with more severe mental illness are when it comes to gaining income by keeping a steady job.

Another part of the problem is that the limited safety net that use to be there has been dismantled by state governments to save money. This has increased the number of homeless people with a mental illness and has changed many of our prisons into modern mental health hospitals.
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VeryTired, mentally ill people who refuse to take medications/get treatment are perhaps the biggest problem in our society - ask the police who have to deal with them, their children who are abused by them, and on and on. This idea of hands off started because of serious abuses in mental hospitals, etc. Commitments by relatives wanting to get their hands on money, etc. But the pendulum has swung way too far! We have carried this to extremes here in the United States. Ask any law enforcement officer - dealing with mentally ill people is a nightmare they did not sign up for. For now, you have done as much as you reasonably can, far more really than any obligation you might have. You cannot fix her broken brain yourself so now the wise thing to do is to take care of yourself. You need to be strong and healthy for you, and that is the best course to follow now. Beating your head against a wall will help neither your head nor the wall.
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Don't do it! I did the same thing. 14 months later I have lost $50,000 and endured unimaginable stress. I left the situation basically with the shirt on my back and barely enough money to start over. I look back on the situation now and wonder why.....
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Just say no. If she gets mad and starts saying things like you WILL do it or that you owe her, come right back on her. Just say no until she either hears it or you block her phone number. I have a feeling that living with her would be so much worse than talking to her on the phone. And you know how bad that can be.
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Unfortunately for her it's all about money. I really don't think she wants to live with me either. But she wants to quit her job(which she chose to get on her own mind you) and mooch off me.
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elmo, no matter what, don't do it. Just say no. I can already tell from what you wrote that she will take control and bully you. Ask her if she lived with her mother when she was your age. I think anyone could understand you when you say, "I don't want to live with my mother." I don't think many people do. (And I also think that most mothers don't want to live their adult children, especially if they can still do things on their own.)
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Mom STILL harassing me to move in with her. She wants me to move to Arizona. She doesn't get that I am 41 year old woman and I don't WANT to live with my mommy. If she were not a hypocritcal person and someone who constantly attacks me when I do or say something she doesn't like? I might think about it. I get that she can't make me move to Arizona But she said "Well then I will just have to move to Washington and we will live together there"! She keeps saying "This is GOING to happen". I can't take it anymore! I don't know what else to do. The last thing I want to do is live with my mother again. She kicked me out of the house when dad died and told me to go live on my own. I have lived on my own for 14 years and I love it. And now she wants me to go backwards? Yeah no. She says "We could get a big enough house that you could have your own space" but that is NOT the point!
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Thanks for your comment, this is not an emotionally healthy family - there is a lot of dysfunction, huge egos and the situation is just too complicated. Many lies, no one trusting the other person, broken promises, accusations being made, mom wants to be the head of every decision being made. When we were looking at assisted living places, mom was the only parent in the room, everyone was there for thier parent. Mom thought that they were the residents looking for places. She said "they are way to young to be here".. we had to break it to her that they are the children of the parents. I wanted to ask about a bariatric room, how do you do that in front of your mother, who doesnt believe she is over weight?
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AdultChild - The person with the durable power of attorney or court-appointed guardianship is the decision maker. Others just have opinions. I think you're going to have to hold a family meeting to talk about how this kind of thing is undermining even if it's well meant.

So glad I'm an only child! There are a lot of boards & threads here devoted to the struggles of managing a parent with a herd of family & silblings who don't agree.

The out of town sibling might feel helpless and unable to really feel like she's helping, so "Suggesting" is her way to pitch in, even if it is NOT helpful. Can you give her some things to do that are helpful? I don't have siblings, but at work when I get those "super-helpful people" off on the sidelines mouthing off about how things ought to be and we should have done XYZ a different way, etc, I find them work to do. They get tasks and deadlines from my project. It typically shuts them up and I don't hear from them again. Especially anything I can find directly connected to what they were "suggesting" about.

I will call or meet with them specifically about the thing that's bothering them, pointedly ask them what they would do differently and how, brainstorm through the obstacles (which is a nice tricky way of telling them how it's not as simple as they think), and then lay the work on them. "It would really help out if you can manage this part. Our deadlines are this, that, & the other. Will you be able to get that done on time?" It's usually this point they totally back out.
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VeryTired58, out of town sister is visiting my mom now. We are enjoying a time of no drama. My mom refuses to call me when she needs something, and expects me to call her every day to see how she is doing. I am not going to call her, and have her blast me for what ever reason suits her. She is losing control in her life, physically and now mentally... being angry is the only thing left for her.
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AdultChild, my mom accused me of steeling countless times… Later, when she finds "stolen" item under the bed, or in one of the drawers, she would never apologize and turn it into a joke.. Just like in your case, she would ask for my advise or ask me to call some social worker with the question… But then, she would say that some random person that she met once, outside her building, ave her different advise… It ised to hurt…not anymore. I am used to it :(
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I have read many of these replies, and feel connected to all of them. My mother knows how to 1 daughter against the other... Myself and sister have been caring for mom for about 4 years. She still lives in her home, and we would drive her to doc appmts, get groceries etc etc. Mom has severe arthritis and her mobility is very limited, even with a walker. Now... the other sister lives out of town and phones mom every day. She is the one who "suggests" what mom should do, financially etc etc... I would make a decision with mom, then mom would second guess it, call out of town sister... and then half way through the thing would change. My husband would do her income taxes, mom would call sister and she would question how he did it, then mom would doubt his capability. The funny thing is my sister is not a professional of any kind, but seems to convince mom that she is some expert on everything. Mom was in the hospital of UTI and had a cognitive assessment done. The team thought it would be helpful for her to move into assisted living. Sister from out of town did a "I am on the same page as you" - then did an immediate switch against us, and sided with mom to stay in her home. The thing is she is in financial need, and is counting on mom's estate...When mom was in hospital, I went into her home to get toiletries, pj's etc... when she came home, she accused me of stealing.. then called the police, and changed the locks. When I go to her place, I have told her I do not feel comfortable being inside her home, and will take her to appmts and groceries... but will not spend anytime inside. I asked that she revoke the police report.. but she is determined that my sister and I have stolen "things". Sister from outside keeps playing in mom's anxiety about this to keep the fuel going. This happened in Sept. and she still accuses us of it as though it was yesterday. I am at my wits end, for all I care out of town sister can go for it, take it all ... I only hope there is karma. I can not believe that I spent so many nights at moms, so she would not be lonely leaving my husband at home. I would shop for her new wardrobe during hospital stays... I see I did too much. My friends all warned me, but I just couldnt see her for what she was and is... Narcisstic, yes and very mean spirited as well. Out of town sister the same.
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you are so right... all of you. Somehow, what all of you are telling me and I am afraid even think about, makes so much sense. You, my newly found friends, make one big, gigantic sense... Wish I have met you all before. Maybe I would't end up in emergency room with panic attack or go through multitude big and small incidents for the last 40 years...Thank you all, so very much. I have some serious thinking to do...🎭
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I may have said this already, but even so, it bears saying again. You didn't make her that way. You can't control her. You can't fix her. However, you can destroy yourself trying to fix her and or control her. The only one any of us can control and fix is ourselves and even that is a battle at times. The above advice is on target. Good luck!
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Sometimes you have to let Humpty Dumpty fall off the wall. This meant I had to let embarrassing go to bad to worse to dangerous with my mom. No amount of guilt, being beat up by my conscience, judgement from other family, or good intentions by any of us made one iota of difference.

If you are dealing with a rational, sane person with their faculties, and you walked away from them, you may have a reason to feel some guilt or remorse.

Dealing with someone who is not in their right mind is a whole different ballgame. Whether it's addiction, mental illness, dementia, whatever. You can only do what you can and past that point you must let it go. Nobody is wonder woman or super man in these situations with magic solutions for Disney endings.

You can drive yourself insane too by dwelling on "If mom would just..." or "If I only...". If everything was perfect and mom was cooperative then there wouldn't be two million people on this website.

At some point you have to step back and have the clarity to realize that you have literally done all you can. You don't have to have any more plans or solutions. It is out of your hands. Give it up. Get into therapy, be nice to yourself, and get used to the new feelings you will have at this point. It won't be euphoria. It won't be relief. It will be weird but it does get better.

Shouldn't you tell *somebody* that you're done? Sure, if there is anybody to tell. Telling a social worker or APS may or may not mean squat. Our cultivated sense of responsibility to this parent means we think we need to do a clean handoff to somebody, somewhere. This may be a mistaken thought. It may not be possible. You may very well need to stop answering the phone, turn around, and walk away until you can find your own wellness and create a safe zone for your self.

What if Mom's lying there on the floor bleeding out her eyes? It might happen. I fit my mom with a lifealert button she never used once in all the times she fell. My mom was passively suicidal in the first place, so she had been trying to die for decades anyway. Maybe your loved one could use a fall response service.

The super unfair part of this is having to come to terms with the possibility of sad outcomes and our powerlessness to stop it. Dealing with the powerlessness and having absolutely zero control over a situation you think you should control is very, very difficult. Therapy can make a WORLD of difference in how you perceive things, respond to them, and accept your right to a life and your own happiness.
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Guilt is the worst. If we don't find a way to conquer it we end up tolerating all kinds of abuse. I know because it's something I struggle with no end. It's my worst enemy. Guilt distorts my ability to reason and make good decisions. It robs me of my serenity and even my sanity sometimes. It's that voice in my head that tells me I am a bad person because I don't want to make it my job to try and make a miserable person into a happy person. Or I don't live up to someone else's standards. But I am not a bad person and neither are you VeryTired. If you can't overcome the guilt on your own get help. In the end all of your efforts will destroy you and they won't do one blessed thing to help your Mom.
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Unfortunately, a mentally ill person who is over 18 cannot be forced to take their meds or go to therapy unless they are considered incompetent as an adult of whatever age.Your mother would have to end up being institutionalized in a mental hospital to be forced to take her meds. It sounds like there's really nothing more your can do for her and the only thing that's left is taking care of yourself in getting help to deal with all of the abuse you have been through. If you were married to someone abusive like your mother, would you put up with that?
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You can chose to get off the merry go round. It's not conscience that keeps you, it's guilt.
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Surprise, been there, tried this... she went from psych facility to adult home, becouse she refused to go back to my home, as we could not do this and she refused as well,,. this adult home was a horrible place and after one year i found an apartment for her because she is flatly refused to gi to nursing home and for assistance living it is too late... she is 82 and they dont want her so frail there... so after drilling a hole in my head that she wans to be alone, she got her wish. i should of break the contact right there, but there is thus pesky thing, colled conscience and i am doing the same thing over and over.. tolerating her abuses. but if they take her back to facility again i want them make her to take medication, but they would not do that and you can predict what would happen next. it is a h*ll circle...
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