It's been a hard week....

Get it over with. Bring biscuits or cake. Drink tea, beer, whatever. Make it a social visit.

Then make a diary note to repeat a MONTH later.

(Leave his shopping, chores, repairs, bills for him).

Beatty - glad you liked that! Even more than you liked it enough to repost it!

I have cats, and have for many years. I know that in general you don't wash cats... They are self-cleaning! Of course there can be exceptions, but not likely in the co-worker's case! I've had a couple of episodes which required some "rinsing" but never bathing (worst was Eddie "helping" me paint....)

"I suppose I better visit him on sunday."

If you decide to go, any supplies he asks for, keep it to a minimum. If you can't get any of his items at your own local store, don't stop at his. You have to go to your local place, but not his - no need to expose yourself to multiple places. Bro is local, he can pick up the slack or anything you can't get at your store. Sorry dad, shortages, they didn't have what you wanted...

Since you and the wife have child care and her mother to consider as well AND because your dad doesn't care for the kiddos, bring your daughter along. She can keep you company, cheer you up during the drive to and fro, and be your excuse to not enter the flat AND skeedaddle ASAP!

If possible, I would arrange the date YOU want to go, not the Sunday trip HE expects. Don't give any excuses for the change. It is what it is dad. Either I come on this day or not at all. Then HE has to choose.

I read the 'washing the cat' comment to my Hubby last night. (Generally I am banned from any 'elder speak' inc my folks, at work or this forum!) But he roared with laughter 😂

My sister just got a cat... I said now she will have the perfect excuse never to help again but Hubby says we'll use it first! Thankyou.

Beatty - :-D

Enjoy and you're welcome to use it OFTEN! Works for friends, co-workers, just about anyone, including "family".

Paul - didn't at one time you say your family has a cat or 2? If so, Sunday has just been announced to be 'Cat Laundry Day'!!!

disgusted - I did go. Bought LOADS and hes not happy at all. Not playing this "keep food to a minimum" thing. Its a con.

To be honest, coming out of lockdown is worse. MIL lives alone and has taken it really badly.

Shes nice enough and used to stay 2 nights sometimes 3 a week anyway. Sometimes it was childcare help.

Trouble is, and she did manipulate my wife a bit, she seems to have scammed herself 3 nights a week at our house for the foreseeable future! Siblings as usual are hiding and leaving it all to use.

I get that shes lonely, really missing the kids but, honestly. I'm trying to be nice and think of that and be a nice person. I've no tolerance these days after years or dad.

But 3 days a week of MIL everyone else in the house (especially the kids) will love. Me not so!

Arrghhhh. Pray for my sanity in the coming weeks!!!!!!

disgusted - three cats. Trevor, Eric, and Daisy.

Previous cats - Kevin and Keith.

Trevor - instantly brought to mind an old, really old, SNL (looks like 1991) skit with Simon (Mike Meyers) and Trevor (Macauley Culkin) ... funny, Kevin was his name in Home Alone, so that matches up with one of your previous kitties too!

Since you have 3 kitties... The next 3 Sundays are taken up by Cat Washing!!! ;-)

As for MIL - well, having her there keeps everyone else happy (and maybe out of your hair), and to look on the bright side of things, she's not your dad being there 3 days/week! NEVER divulge to him that she is there, EVER! You'll never hear the end of that. Of course having someone else there often will tend to get under your skin and/or on your nerves - kinda upsets the routine and you kinda have to monitor your Ps and Qs.

So you "visited" and brought supplies, and "...hes not happy at all..." We all expected that, right? You did your "deed", it isn't appreciated, but it's done. Put that behind you. Of course he doesn't like you bringing "loads", as he knows that means you won't need to go back for a while. Tough tookies. I came, I saw and I delivered...

Personally, if my mother did that to me, I would say fine, you figure out a way to get your supplies then. Obviously you don't like they way I do it! It was a long trip for me to get to her place and then take her to the store, monitor (she would buy stuff she already had plenty of) and bring her back, OR pick up supplies elsewhere and deliver. Fortunately she was thankful - had other issues, but that wasn't one of them.

Job (well) done and over with... plan the cat washing, one each of the next 3 Sundays... but don't tell the cats!!!
=^..^= =^..^= =^..^=

(Edit after post: Got a chuckle just after posting this... washing the cats, Trevor and SNL - that episode was with Simon and Trevor in the tub!!)

My sister and BIL on a farm ended up with someone else’s pair of drakes. They called them Barry and Kevin, for locally significant reasons. They then acquired some ducks, and Barry transferred his affections to the ducks. Kevin was distraught!

Paul - You need a man cave to get away from your MIL. That might help keep your sanity. Do you have a home office that gives you privacy from the rest of the house?

I like my husband's parents, they are very nice to us and we them, but I don't think I want to spend more than a few hours with them once every other week over a meal. We and our in-laws need our own space.

Paul, it might help to work out how many more weeks you can cope with MIL for 3 nights a week, to ‘make up for all the nights with the family that MIL lost during the lock down’. After that it goes back to the way it was before. People will often accept a future date, when they would resist something immediate. This would give you a reasonable way to nix the ‘foreseeable future’ expectations, and help you cope yourself through the remaining time. Stick to your new skills! Reasonable but firm!

Just to wrap up the measurement issues, from Wikipedia:

"The gallon is a unit of measurement for volume and fluid capacity in both the US customary units and the British imperial systems of measurement. Three significantly different sizes are in current use: 

the imperial gallon, defined as 4.54609 litres, which is used in the United Kingdom, Canada, and some Caribbean nations;

the US gallon defined as 231 cubic inches (exactly 3.785411784 litres), which is used in the US and some Latin American and Caribbean countries;

and the US dry gallon, defined as ​1⁄8 US bushel (exactly 4.40488377086 litres).

There are four quarts in a gallon and eight pints in a gallon, and they have different sizes in different systems.

The IEEE standard symbol for the gallon is gal.[1][clarification needed]"


I especially love the "clarification needed" part.

So I think, if anyone's crossing the Atlantic in either direction, your best bet is probably to look at what you're getting and think: "that much."

I'm probably among the last generation ever to have had to do arithmetic problems using old UK currency - pounds, shillings and pence. Twelve pence to a shilling, twenty shillings to a pound; and to add to the fun a guinea was twenty-one shillings. A florin was two shillings. A crown was five shillings. Half a crown was two-and-six. A farthing was a quarter of a penny. There were also ha'pennies, and threepenny bits, and sixpences.

Quite honestly it's a wonder that we're not crazier.

After decimalisation, when a sixpence was suddenly worth two and a half new pennies (!!!), once things had all settled down a bit, I remember talking to my grandmother about the new currency and the new arithmetic problems and how much simpler everything was in base ten. Granny had a particular look she gave you when you'd been so stupid as to miss something blindingly obvious to the meanest intelligence. She took my hand, turned it over, and told me to count up on my fingers with my thumb. Base twelve. D'oh! So... that's where it all started.

Flippin heck CM thats confused me !!!

MIL is being picked up today going home Friday. Day too long IMHO.

Margaret - Yeh I suppose we've "missed" three months of even seeing her at all so it'd take months to catch that up.

Polar - yeh I do. Same as you. I like the lady I do but I don't want her here all the time. I try to explain to my wife but she just says "yeh but my mum is ok" which she is. Normally after about 2 days her mum starts to annoy her even more than she annoys me though lol.

Disgusted - Jeez I cant imagine my Dad for 3 HOURS a week let alone 3 days. Yeh there are some positives.

Maybe its me. Being stuck home in lockdown is hard for everyone and I'm not liking WFH any more. My wife and I have argued more which I guess is like a lot of people.

I am working till 5 in the daytime but then I've got her in the evenings. Normally when I;'m in work I'm not home till 6 and by 730 shes gone to bed same time as daugher to read her books.

I think part of it is me getting way too stressed about it. (Dad does nothing to help my stress levels!) Maybe I should just chill a bit and go with the flow.

"Maybe its me. Being stuck home in lockdown is hard for everyone and I'm not liking WFH any more. My wife and I have argued more which I guess is like a lot of people."

No, not just you. Clearly even your wife gets to that point ("Normally after about 2 days her mum starts to annoy her even more than she annoys me though lol.") If possible, take some time outside the house - getting claustrophobia being "stuck" at home happens a lot. Even if you just take a break and go for a walk. As I say to others, 3 months staying at home most of the time is bad enough, try 2+ years! Mainly because of $ that has been me... Just when that was resolving and I could try to live a more normal life again, virus/lockdown comes along. Compound that with car woes (Honda had dead hybrid battery, resolved that only to have something up front go, likely tie rods, older Jeep is at shop waiting for check-over and minor fix, new Jeep is under safety hazard recall!) So, my "trips" away from home are severely limited again!

As the saying goes, absence makes the heart grow fonder! Too much of anything can get nauseating!

When still married, very early on, ex accepted a job offer and quit his job, but the new job didn't pan out. I worked off shift, so until he found another job, he was "under foot" a lot. I did finally say 'go get a job!' At one point he also said maybe he could stay home and watch the kids and I could work - sure, but that means you take on the other house duties, you don't just sit on your behind and let the kids play... cleaning, meal prep, laundry, shopping, etc. in addition to child care! He was one of those who thought women's work was a snap!

"Maybe I should just chill a bit and go with the flow." Yup. Especially if you realize this is not just you - many float in the same kind of boat!

FWIW - at some point well before mom started down the dementia path, I used to say that 4 hours was the MAXIMUM I could be around her, and that was when others were there (holiday or other gathering.) When my niece and her BF were there, I stopped by to pick them up so we could do something together on their last day visiting. Not 10 min there, trying to ask my mother something, she got in my face all nasty, so I walked out and waited by my car. When they came out, I repeated that statement above, and the BF said that wasn't even 10 min! So I reiterated that 4 hours was the MAX, I never gave a minimum. So, you are not alone. Sometimes she was okay and I could tolerate longer periods, but I knew well beforehand that there was no way I could live with her or her with me. Nope.

(some say why so many cars - two aren't new. Honda is about 12 yo, gets great mileage when Hybrid battery in place, so good for longer trips. Older Jeep is 17yo, but it is my plow - loooong driveways, both previous and even more now, that wouldn't be done by shovel! New Jeep was so I would have something reliable in winter without a plow - reliable? Not even 2yo and already THREE recalls, two of which are safety related!!! Reliable??? Expensive as all hell, but seriously...)

disgusted - yeh I guess so.

Wife is just SOOOO laid back she lets everyone do anything at all. Not for one minute does she think about what shes agreed to.

In a way, shes so nice that she does this but it infuriates me. People take advantage.

I've lost track of the times I've said "what did you say that for?" or "you just agreed to x" and shes said "Oh did I? sorry" and then "Oh it'll be ok".

Just today she got her shifts for next week. MIL is asking ME so she knows when to come up to "help out". My wife is out at the moment - I said do not admit you're working monday or that'll be her excuse that she has to come up sunday and stay all week. (We dont need her anyway I'm home).

Otherwise wife will not even see if and say "aw ok then".

paul: I used to say "yes, I'll take that on," but then I asked myself why I ever said it. Can relate to your wife. Lesson learned. Learned to say no more. Good grief.

llama - yeh I can't criticise her too much because of her really lovely nature. But it does lead to a lot of people inc family who take advantage.

She sees the good in everyone. Maybe I'm the opposite after my experiences. She just does not even think ahead and think what will happen.

I could count in the 100s the times shes said ok to someone mainly her mother then I've said to her later "but yes you were going for the day with your friend that day". Oops shes now ruined her plans....

I said to her more than once - "Im sure you get up in the morning, say whatever, don't think ahead and just say yes to everything anyone asks".

Shes done it in work too. Shes a nurse and they give her some old sob story about how their short of people. It always works. She says yes then has to cancel her plans. I'm trying to get her to say "I'll think about it" then go and check her diary and see if she really can help out or not.

Shes lovely is my wife but so infuriating...

paul: Your wife sounds like a lovely lady! She must be a great Type A personality. Have a friend like that - only requires 4 hrs sleep per night, ran daycare, went to college for BA and Masters Degree, ran a support group at her church incl. food preparation, joined a gym and then got a job with the DoD (Dept. of Defense). My own daughter tells me to slow down. I once did say no to someone when they asked me to take items for donation to a charitable organization. Your wife is taken advantage of at work, too?
That was me - I worked under adversity with workhorse bosses. I wish your wife well - but sounds like she's got everything under control.

Paul: "Wife is just SOOOO laid back she lets everyone do anything at all. Not for one minute does she think about what shes agreed to."

So, your wife says yes to people without giving it too much thought.

Hmm... I wonder if that was what happened at the altar when the priest / minister asked her: "Do you want to take this man...?"

Haha. Just joking Paul. You're a nice guy and she was right to have said yes to you.

Dad and brother are trying to pull an absolute classic.... I knew it was coming.
Obviously, for last few months, since brother lives a mile away hes been doing the shopping etc. To be fair, legally I was not allowed - there is still a 5 mile rule in wales. Also, he lost his job so had plenty of time. I just knew he wouldnt like this.

Of course, I visited Dad last weekend. Spoke to Dad last night. Hes out of food, can I do him a favour and visit this sunday and get him some stuff. Both brother and his wife and working saturday and sunday. Complete rubbish.

He "suddenly" got a new job a week ago. I dont even think this job is real. She hardly ever works but, now and again, paints peoples houses. Suddenly they are both working ALL weekend.

They must all think I'm stupid. I've become available and, not for the first time, brother has cooked something to ensure I "do my turn".

And Dad, seriously, need groceries. I got them for you THREE days ago. Come on now.

As it is I'm busy sunday. Its my MILs bday. And I'm on call.

Im so annoyed at being manipulated again.

llama - yes but infuriating. Work the same. She has fibromyalgia but if they ask her to work she always says yes. Works 40-50 hours makes herself ill because she didnt realise what she agreed to.

I always say, let them deal with it. Overtime is optional - it when you want to work not them all the time.

polar - ha ha when she was younger she wasn;t as bad so I'm in the clear!

So should I not go sunday?

Brother wont be there all weekend because of this alleged working. So Dad will be alone. He doesn't "need" groceries at all.

One way I feel a bit sorry but damned if I'm going to let them play their tricks like this.

I might pop up one evening next week instead. Suits me better. It'd be 2/3 days later. Dad would hate that though because its not a day he selected.

"I might pop up one evening next week instead. Suits me better. It'd be 2/3 days later. Dad would hate that though because its not a day he selected."

While any visit should not be because you feel "sorry" for him, at least going on YOUR time ("Suits me better.") is the way to do it. It's not what HE wants, but you can check the box by your name, said you did your time and be done with that! Sure, he won't like it, but again, this is working around YOUR schedule, not his, not brother's. Don't forget to schedule washing the cats!!! Also bro may be planning his "outings" thinking it'll force you to go more often. Don't fall for that trick!

As for the wife, remember she isn't you or an extension of you. There must be a reason you chose her, and her "nice" nature just might be part of it. Don't let it get under your skin. Perhaps put up a LARGE calendar, marked clearly with things planned on it. Maybe push back a bit, if there is something that is important to most/all of you and have her reschedule whatever it was. Work may be a tough one at this time, but as things settle it should naturally reduce the amount of "we need you." Funny, waaaay back in my first job (cashier at a local market) they only hired part time people (way ahead of their time - part time=no bennies!) So one time the night manager says to me 'I have to write up a report on why anyone works more than 30 hours. YOU are a problem because you sometimes work more than 40 hours!' The reason was if they had someone call out, they would ask me. I didn't have any obligations and if I had no plans, sure, I would go in. It got so bad that one time I told the head cashier who called that I didn't have a car. He asked 'If I come pick you up will you come in?' I said sure and he DID come pick me up!

So long as she doesn't really feel whatever she's agreed to is imposition, she will continue to do this, so don't let it irk you. If/when she starts to feel someone is taking advantage of her, she can learn to push back (she'll have a good teacher!) Her chosen profession is nurse, which likely means she is predisposed to "help" others when they need it, or to be agreeable to whatever comes up. It isn't like nursing (outside an office at least) is a "normal" 9to5 kind of job. You don't go in saying today I do X, Y, Z - you go with the flow. Sure, there are certain things planned, but sometimes other needs pop up and need to be handled. Different world than office work (yes, crises crop up there too, but not usually on a daily basis.) Kinda like being a mom - you have certain duties that happen every day, and then those emergencies pop up!

Although it is a generalization, I often tell others that the old axiom about men being one-track mind and women scatter-brained really has it's roots in prehistory. Not all men or women fit the "mold", but think about it. When humans were still hunter/gatherers, men had to stay focused on hunting - prepping tools, making plans, doing the hunt, etc. It wasn't like they could just go out for a few hours and bring home the bacon (once in a while it might pan out, but more often it would take many days!) Women, on the other hand, had to tend the hearth, prepare foods, set up/take down shelters when they moved, care for the kids and gather the other food stuffs (nuts, berries, fruits, roots, vegetables. etc.) So, in that respect, yes, men were "one-track" mind, stay focused, and women were "scatter-brained", having to juggle many tasks every day.

A rather boring and dated, but relevant video we watched in Anthropology was about the Kung Bushmen of the Kalihari. It demonstrated exactly this. So, although not everyone fits the mold, and there are crossovers, I find that sometimes people can't "juggle" tasks - they have to stay focused on that one thing they are doing, while others can juggle many tasks. I often have many "sticks" in the fire and some are amazed how I keep track of them all, including other women!

disgusted - im just so annoyed.

I would bet my mortgage that brother and his wife are NOT working this weekend. In fact, I dont think hes even got a job.

Hes been caught out so many times lying to Dad. He says one thing to me, gets on his high horse, then behind Dads back lies to him. This is his MO telling him hes got a job because he knows it gets dad off his back.

Its also not the first time hes "manufactured" things so that I'll have to fill in (he thinks). I'd also put money on the fact that whats happened EXACTLY is Dad has told him I came last weekend and hes thought, right thats it, he can do weekends now.

I just refuse to be manipulated like that. I know it sounds mean because Dad will be alone this weekend, but if I do it once, then both brother and Dad will know it works and just wont stop.

I'll be forever getting calls expecting me to visit at last minute "oh you're brothers working can you come".

If you remember my brother and I dont speak. The last time we spoke was when he tried to impost a Saturday rota which I said I couldnt do (I've got kids to look after!). He made it worse by saying my lazy wife could take her turn too because his wife would. So I know how his mind works. Hes got a massive chip on his shoulder that he does this that etc and I do nothing.

Of course, I've moaned to my wife about her MIL. To be fair, she has listened and put her foot down a bit. Not ideal still but its a compromise.

If I give in to pressure from my Dad/brother then what does that say?

Its MILs 80th birthday sunday. With current situation no plans, but its possible only wife and her siblings will go (with covid and all you dont want the kids mixing) so I've got to look after daughter.

Can hardly say, umm sorry seeing your mum on her 80th, cant happen. Dad and brother have cooked something up and trying to make me do that instead. Can you imagine?

Paul; You seem to spend an awful lot of "brain space" on your dad.

Your father has no more right to "demand" things of you than you have to "demand" them of him.

I.e., dad calls, or brother calls and says "you must come this weekend, no food in the house".

You say. "I can't come this weekend. I can have an order delivered at dad's expense. That's what I'm willing to do."

If they get nasty, hang up and don't answer their calls for a week.

Can you do that?

YOU get to decide what you want to/can do. Not dad. Not brother. You have the power of self-determination.

Barb, I think it’s become fairly clear that Paul shares this head space with us because he has no-one else to complain to. It stops him getting into arguments with his wife, who no longer has any tolerance for it. I’ve got no problems with it, because it seems that it has genuinely helped him cope and also change. It’s almost getting to be like sharing his life, which is quite good for me on an isolated farm. I’ll share my recent highlight – I went shopping yesterday, 100 mile round trip - not really so interesting! Rave on, Paul (though I’m not sure that you are old enough to remember Buddy Holly lyrics).

I get that Paul, you come here to vent!

I worry about you ate exhausting yourself with all this thinking about the games dad and bro play.

You DON'T need an excuse to say no. You have OUR permission!!!!

(Hugs)))))