On My Mind

(((((shell)))) it does sound like you need a better therapist. You can't save someone from themselves and their bad choices, but you can ruin your own life trying. You can have a great life with your sig other.

Had a 2 1/2 hour phone chat with my oldest son who called this morning as he is considering a career change and wanted some feedback. I am blessed by the relationship we have and to be able to be of help even if it is only an understanding ear. When he was in town we used to go for lunch together several times a week and have great conversations. I miss that but am grateful for the phone contact.

Prayers for sil (and all of us) who has been exposed to covid on his work bus He has been tested and we are awaiting results. He shows no signs. A few days ago (after the exposure) he was over here picking up some stuff for the dump. I didn't know and I would rather they had told me and that he hadn't come till I knew he whether he was clear or not. Fortunately I rinsed my nasal cavities and gargled after they left. Sigh.

Have I mentioned yet that I started college with Purdue's online curriculum? I've probably been too busy to share lol. I was a bit panicky about being able to keep up with workload but so far I'm managing. According to projections, I'll have my BS in Psychology in Applied Behavioral Analysis in 18 months, and then I plan to use that to apply to Occupational Therapy programs. I'm so glad I found a way forward for my career and educational goals. Purdue is expensive and they are charging me out-of-state tuition which I find funny since it's ONLINE so it's mostly out-of-state students. It is what it is, I received some help through financial aid and plan to pay the rest out of pocket. Fingers crossed everything will work out. I'm working really hard each week on the material and I'm learning a lot more than I remember learning in traditional college classes 25 years ago.

There are articles in the news here that Chicago could start receiving covid vaccines in as little as a couple of weeks. It said that they will go to healthcare workers first, of course, and that the supply will be limited. But... it seems to signify the beginning of the end of this nightmare and I'm hopeful that by Spring, there will be a big change back to normal daily life. We shall see.

(((((ali))))) so so glad to hear that you are on your way to a satisfying career. What a change from a few years ago!!!! Mature students are the best! Sorry they are charging you so much.

Re the vaccine, I feel it in the air too. Not sure we will see much change by spring but it surely is coming. and a new normal with it. I am already looking forward to shopping in my old stores. 😊

Golden,
I am going to find a new therapist although with this Covid thing it may take me some time. I did talk to my case worker last night and she found someone to help me get my business plan together and will help with finding funds to start my food truck. It's not glamorous, but it's a start. I think my mother has taken up enough of my life that is why I am moving in a year. My sig-other and myself need to save some more money and get our ducks in a row. My plan is to have a great life with my sweetie!

I pray that you, your sil and dd don't have Covid and that you are all well. Your family will be in my prayers.💗🙏

Hugs!!

shell - so glad to hear about the changes you are making. Glamorous doesn't matter - just that it works for you. Definitely your mother has taken enough of your life. Thx for your prayers. I am praying for success for you and your sweetie in all aspects of your life.

Fantastic, Ali!

Thank you Golden!

Many hugs to you!!!

Ali, WONDERFUL, JUST WONDERFUL!

Thanks, all, very much appreciated. It's going to be a lot of work but I'm up for the challenge.

I was thinking -- Why didn't I do this during caregiving??!! I had 6+ years of being out of work. Why wasn't I thinking about the future and the opportunities? And I realize that when I was caregiving, I was very depressed and ill so much. I didn't think I could work outside the home (because I never felt good, so tired every single day) much less take on a job and full time school again. It feels like wasted years of my life down the drain but I like to think I'm more driven now and also that I have a lot more empathy for the bad situations and health issues people can find themselves in. It's good to be on this track. Thanks again. (((((hugs)))))

Ali, what great news!!!!!!!

AliBoBali: I am late to the congratulatory party for you! That is wonderful! Congratulations.💞

Took my mother to her cardiologist yesterday and her Dr wanted to put her on blood thinner and my mother said no. My mother went on to tell her Dr that she doesn't want anymore Rxs, nor does she want any Tx. My mother has told me this for about a year that she was/is done with this world, but this is the first time she has really told her Dr this. However, her Dr refuse to listen to her. I step in and started to tell her Dr my mother's history which is this; my mother has had 19 surgery, countless upper GIs, beat 2 kinds of cancers and one of them twice, she has COPD, Afid, highblood pressure, has had countless other procedures done and has been sick my whole life. She can no longer eat the foods she likes, she can't hear very good, her eye sight is failing, she can't go shopping because it takes to much out of her, she doesn't drive, she knows she is losing time as she calls it, she has a very hard time getting up and down the stairs; therefore, she spends all her time in her bedroom. She can't read a book and she can't sew either. I also told her Dr that my mother has no quality of life. Her Dr offer her therapy and my mother asked the Dr "what is that going to do for me?" The Dr said, "well you sound depress, it might help you to give you hope?" My mother replied with "I lost my hope years ago when I started not be able to do things I like to do." Then the Dr asked me "if my mother would take her own life?" I told the Dr "My mother is Catholic and believes that it is a sin," which she does. The Dr recommends Palliative Care. The Dr went on to explain that palliative care would help with her quality of life and my mother said, "no, I am done! I know I am losing my mind, and again I can't do anything anymore. Why should I go on?" As this conversation was going on my mother started crying and for the first time, I saw how much pain she was in. I saw how she really is done with this life. She has given up! I told the Dr that I would do some research on palliative care and if I thought it could help her I would call them, but that I make no promises about my mother doing it. I know my mother, if she decides to do something or not to do something she will not budge. However, the Dr set up the palliative care and for them to contact me. Sigh! When the MA came in to check us out she told us about how palliative care would call us, so I had to tell her that is not the deal that we made with the Dr. I re-explained to the MA that I would look into it and if I thought it would help then I would call them. The MA said that "she understood and she would put a big not to palliative care that they need to wait on us calling them.

Afterwards, my mother and I was in my jeep and my mother looked at me and said, "I am just tired and not the kind of tiredness that you need sleep, but the kind where I am just done." My mother was so upset that she couldn't stop crying. How can I have so much compassion for someone who never had any compassion for me, but I do. I see the pain and misery in her eyes. She has decided to stop all her meds as of last night. She also has decided that she no longer wants to go to anymore Drs appointments.

I don't know how to feel or what to think. I love her because she is my mother, but on the other hand, I hate her and want nothing to do with her for she has caused me so much pain and stress. She makes life miserable! I am confuse and feel like I am at a crossroad. I will continue with my plans on moving out; however, I must also make plans on how to handle everything if she should die before I move out!

Thanks for reading!

Shell,

I cried as I read this because it brought back so many memories for me.

I understand how you feel and how your mom feels.

Of course, you care. I did too when mom lived in our home. I still care.

My mom was a good mom when I was young. She had different ideas because the world was different then.

Let’s face it. They lived in a different day and age where things were done much differently. They weren’t as fair to their daughters as they were to their sons and so on. They were most likely treated that way too. It was part of that era.

It’s important to break cycles of abuse. Thank God, you and I evolved.

I am not making excuses for them. It’s just the way it was.

I had discussed this dilemma with my therapist and I accepted it, then I didn’t feel as badly towards my mom because I knew that she was a product of her environment.

Plus, my brother wrecked havoc in our lives. Your brother caused grief too.

From what you tell me about your mom she was a bit harsher than my mom.

It’s impossible to erase those memories. Trust me, I understand that. I am haunted by memories too.

My therapist clearly said to me that I had PTSD, which is difficult. It is still hard for me even though mom doesn’t live with us anymore.

If I am triggered by something, I go into a funk or experience anxiety. I am working on my reactions. I have a ways to go still.

It doesn’t surprise me at all that you care for your mom, in spite of her behavior. I was the same. We don’t have hatred or vengeance in our hearts. Nor do we have a mean streak.

My mom had a mean streak at times. We take after our dads who were loving, caring individuals.

Our moms are exhausted and who can blame them? We would feel the same way as they do. I have empathy for them. I really do. So do you. I know that you do.

I definitely think Palliative care is the way to go for your mom, even hospice. It’s comfort care.

She deserves that as a human being. She deserves to have dignity.

Many, many hugs! The serenity prayer helped me understand that I had to change what I could and accept what I couldn’t.

Take care, dear lady! You are doing your very best!

Shell, I haven't followed all the individual stories and directions on this thread but just happened to read yours, that very sad yet wise and insightful plea of your mother.    It brought tears to my eyes.   This woman is making an assessment far more insightful and realistic than that of her doctor and yet the doctor apparently either doesn't realize that or can't admit it.

I think medical people who acknowledge a situation realistically and make suggestions for moving on are fairly rare, but I think also that that maturity and wisdom comes with practice, and aging, and perhaps personal experience.

I don't have any suggestions, but if you feel it appropriate, tell her she has an admirer and someone who really feels she's special, even though I've never met her.

Oh, Shell, your Mom needs a Palliative care doctor.

Your Mom is right where I am. She's ready to go.
I am an old nurse with now Atrial Fib for 10 years come this next January. I always refused blood thinners? Do you know why? Because as a nurse I saw more death from blood thinners than from anything else. Everything from abdominal bleeds to brain hemorrhage. I take an Aspirin a day. At 78 here I still am.
I had breast cancer 34 years ago. I have chosen not to take mammograms ever again. First of all, I am willing to go, and I found all of my lumps on my own when mammograms were negative. Secondly I would treat now only with lumpectomy. I am 78 and ready to go. Would ask for the good drugs.

Do you know what MY doctor said ? "Well, you understand that Kaiser follows the recommended guideline for recommendations regarding testing. We will continue to send you notices that you "should" get these tests, as that is our protocol, but I UNDERSTAND you, and understand that you have these well thought out decisions made. Let's do your POLST to hand on refrig or closet door so EMTs don't try to bring you back if you go". And we sat and did it.
My doctor understands that I am ready to go, and only fear being tortured to death by the medical community.

Now, do I look both ways when I cross the street? Sure. Do I get my flu shot? You BETCHA. Will I be beating other old ladies out of the line so I am first for Coronavirus vaccine? I SURE WILL. But I will not take further testing (other than to measure the efficacy of my levothyroxine for Hashimoto's hypothyroid). I don't measure cholesterol, or anything else now. My advanced directive forbids the administration of any artificial feedings, or CPR, of ventilator. If I got Covid I would ask for the good drugs and no treatment with ventilator.

I have had a WONDERFUL life. I was born to the best parents ever. I had the best bro. While a few husbands I found wanting I am now for 35 years with such a good good guy. I have had no major illnesses aside the cancer and I survived it with great good luck. I have always felt able. I have never wanted. I loved my career as a nurse. And I am READY.

I hope your Mom seeks a doctor who does specialize in Palliative care and she will then be listened to. It does recognize she doesn't want to go on. While we cannot in our country (yet) allow for euthanasia on request, as we can in some countries, she needs to be treated as someone who has a rational voice.And rational wishes. It disturbs me when/if doctors don't listen.
Be sure to explain to Mom that palliative care is only for her comfort, and all that testing and medication will be out of the way, but SOME MEDS will stay in order to keep her comfort. There is a difference between prolonging our lives and making the lives we must continue to live comfortable.

Thank goodness for your support and understanding of your Mom. Thank goodness for Palliative care (I was appalled that in the Desert Regional Medical Center, a HUGE hospital, teaching hospital in Palm Springs, had NO palliative care program. The doc who was the resident for my bro was being TRAINED as a Pallative Care doctor, and yet they did not yet have this program. The United States needs to CATCH UP.). Be sure it is explained to Mom. No treatments. No extending her life. Just making her comfortable. Making the life she must continue to live as good as it can be made. And then progression to hospice when it is needed.

Shell,
The other thing is that all this has allowed you to see your Mother as a suffering human being, who suffered also from severe limitations in being able to care for you. And you are caring for HER despite what you went through, and learning a deep and solid compassion that is going to help you moving forward in your life more than you can even guess. I think when our parents live long enough for us to see them as human beings, and not just parents, it is a gift to us.
My Dad was such a good and wonderful dad, but I will never forget when he told me how "tired" he was, that he only wanted the peace of endless sleep, that he tried to get up for my Mom and get on the scale and to eat, but he was exhausted, had had a good life, and only wanted sleep.

(((((shell))))) This such a difficult time in a person's life and the lives of their loved ones.. You are wise to plan for both your mother passing and her surviving. From my experience I think what she needs and probably wants is palliative care. My mother was on that the past couple of years if her life. They treated any pain she had, continued her thyroid meds but that was about it. She was on an antidepressant at one point to help her feel better. Prayers and blessings for you and all as you enter this next phase in your mum's and your life. It's not easy.

Golden,
My mother doesn't want palliative care. I think she and I are not sure what palliative care is exactly or what they do. She is afraid they will extend her life and make her do things she doesn't want.

Thank you Golden for your hugs, support, and for your wisdom. ❤🐈


Alva,
Thank you so much for your input, knowledge and your own story. I will have to figure this out. But it sounds like from what Golden and you are explaining that this is the next step towards hospice. She doesn't want Tx, but I want her to be comfortable. I have a lot to think about. About the blood thinners: my mother is a bleeder and she nor I can not get it through any of her Drs (past ones and this new one) that she will bleeded out. Thank you for understanding!💗


Garden,
Her cardiologist is semi retired and so my mother saw his fill in Dr who is a physician assistant who is in her early 20's so she doesn't get it. My mother is afraid that the medical professionals will keep her alive. But I won't let that happen. If she wants to go I won't stop her and I refuse to let her suffer. Thank you so much for your kind words and your support. I'll past your message on to my mother, it will make her feel better.


NHWM,
Thank you for your insight and support. My mother is was really never a good mom, but your right she is a product of her environment. Her mother hated her and she hates me. The only way I broke the cycle is because I made the choice to not have kids. I too suffer from PTSD. Thank you!💗


Thank you ladies. I have a feeling it is going to be a rough road ahead of me and I will need all the support I can get.❤💗❣

No, Shell. Look up palliative care. They do NOT want to extend life. They want to make the life left the best it can be. They advocate things to be treated, Urinary tract infections, lungs filling with fluid due to CHF, and etc. Pain medications. But they do NOT adocate for countless visits, tests, referrals to specialist and etc. Palliative care is easy to look up online. Research it so that Mom gets COMFORT but no prolonging of misery.

shell -what alva says. Look it up.
Mother was on palliative care and they didn't make her do anything. It is basically comfort care, not to extend life but to make what is left of life as comfortable as possible. When she got a fever they gave her tylenol to keep her comfortable If she had gotten an infection they said they would have given her antibiotics to keep her more comfortable, She stayed in her facility and was visited periodically by the house doctor, She never had to go out to any appointments. Once you are on palliative care those stop and many treatments and meds stop. From what you wrote this is what your mother wants. It allows her to wind down naturally, and without suffering.

I am wondering if you are not ready for her to go to this next phase of her life. It sounds like she is. ((((((((hugs)))))))) This is so tough and scary,

Shell,

Some of us have children. Some don’t. I believe that you broke the cycle because that is inherently who you are!

I don’t believe for one minute if you had children that you would be like your mom. You’re nothing like her.

My sweet mother in law had a mother from hell! She was a fabulous mom to her sons.

I was nothing like my mom when I raised my daughters. I take that back. I passed on the good parts that I learned and tossed aside the rest.

My mom is such a freakin perfectionist! My kids still laugh how when they were young and they were paranoid about coloring outside the lines around her! LOL

No joke! She would stress out if my girls went outside of the lines just a smidge.

She was loving to my girls though and I would explain to my girls that grandma was extra picky! They took it in stride.

Shell,

There are some organizations that will offer palliative care and merge into hospice care later. I was looking into that for my mom.

Now she is with my brother and is on hospice. I have no idea what program he chose. I wish her well.

I call and speak to her about neutral topics only.

When I closed the door on caregiving I shut it tightly. I let go completely. I did it for 15 years. That’s enough. Let him deal with all the details now.

Who Dat! Geaux NOLA Saints! Go Taysom Hill!

I am a huge Drew fan but this new guy playing for Drew since his injury is incredible! Love him!

We are playing the Falcons today.

The team has been on a hot streak lately. Hoping they keep it up!

Oh my gosh, nail biting game! We won though. Who Dat!

So I did some research on palliative care and talked to my mother today and she said, "she'll think about it," which means no! I even use Golden's phase about PC would let her wine down naturally. I also used Alva terms that PC doesn't want to extend her life; they just want to make her comfortable, but I am afraid my mother is going to dig her heels in and not budge. On the plus side, the PC order is good for a year. I told her everything, how the Dr comes here, how there is no real Tx. How they will manage her meds and her pain. How they would give her antibiotics if she needs it just for her comfort, but she won't have it.

I have to wonder if my mother has so much self hatred that she punishes herself. Because I never can get her to do something even if, it is for her own good. It has always been that way, she will fight me on everything! I will try again at a later time!

Ugh!!!

Alva, I have been thinking about what you said that "compassion will serve me well." I don't see how having compassion will serve me well.. Where I am from compassion is viewed as a weakness. However, you were a nurse for many years and that tells me that you have been around all types of people and perhaps you know something that I don't. Perhaps, this is another life's lesson. I have a feeling that you are right, compassion may serve me well.

Shell,

Give her a minute to process it.

How’s her eyesight? Can she read fine print? My mom struggles to read small print.

If she can read you can leave literature lying around for her to read the information herself.

NHWM,
My mother is losing her eye sight and her hearing. But you're right, she probably does need some time to process the information. I feel as much as I am at a crossroad so is she!

NobodyGetsIt,
I have not seen you posting for awhile. Hope everything is ok. How is your mom?
I tried to send you a message but was unable. Hope you both had a nice Thanksgiving.

"December 7, 1941 – a date which will live in infamy," President Franklin D. Roosevelt famously proclaimed.

Shell, try this. Tell her "Mom, if you end up accidentally in the hospital, if you have a palliative care MD they will LET YOU ALONE and send you home. Otherwise it could end with more needles, more tests. The Palliative Care MD is the one who keeps the other MDs off your door mat".
Then let her process it a while. If she DOES end up in care again say "This could all have been prevented by a palliative care MD to hold them off with a shotgun". She may agree, and she may not. And to be honest, no MD or palliative care MD the outcome is the same. Ready to go and will be taken when the next thing comes along. I think for yourself, now come to peace with the fact that you will not call anyone. I would ask her to make out an advanced directive directing she does not wish to go to a hospital now under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES even if this should be a cause of her death. Because to be honest, if your Mom strokes at home and you simple do nothing there would be questions. I know you can answer them likely to the satisfaction of all, and your Mom has ALREADY GOT ON RECORD with her MD the fact she now wants to go.
This is hard, but you and Mom are speaking about it, and Shell, you have no idea how RARE that is, how good that is. You are coming to agreement and to peace and this is such a blessing right now. I think you are doing EVERYTHING right in this matter.