The Caregiver & Dysfunctional Families: How are you doing?

Popsgirl: You can't control your mom's determination to make your dad better. I don't think you need to leave town, but you should tell your sister that is close to your mom that she needs to step in. Tell her what your father has told you and explain that you have no sway over your mom. Beyond visiting your dad and letting you know that you love him, I don't think you can do much else.

Best wishes, Cattails.

JW and Popsgirl the others have made good points-I am 71 and my mother can still bring me to tears but I have learned a lot from the dysfunctional thread and the narcisstic thread if you want to move a away but the best is too learn to detatchPopsgirl you need to tell your sister your are pulling back and she needs to step up.-as for her driving with numb feet that is crazy-she needs to stop driving yesterday and the fact she is getting lost means the next is a bad accident and you do not want her killed or to kill someone else-let your sibs know what is going on and you should inform the police to take the respondsability off of you-maybe someone has to disable the car but immediatly inform the DMV and the police give them her license plate number-that is all you can do she will just get very angery with you if you try to restrict her driving - would also inform her doc about how dangerous her driving is at this point.

Good Morning Sharynmarie,

I had not read your last post about the 1,000.00 deposit.
Yes, this is reminiscent of our aunt, the narcissist. My pet name for her became the battle ax. I think it's very important to keep some humor in there somewhere.
I think this is the only way sometimes, we can maintain some kind of sanity for ourselves. We used to refer to our mom, as Mommy Dearest. But the ALZ, and I'm 100% sure the meds have changed all of that. The one form of protest that my mom shows, is the use of a wheel chair. She expresses that via her vanity, and not wanting to identify as being elderly, she's 92 yrs. Well, maybe that's a good thing too.

My aunt until her death being the older of the two sisters was never diagnosed w/ALZ, Dementia nor other mental illness. But with all of her questionable behaviors, I used to tell my sister that she had to have had something. Again, on account of all the divide and conquer routine going on w/the POA, MPOA, for her while she was alive, my sister didn't even really know what was going on w/my aunt's MPOA. So a proper diagnosis never happened for her.

Well, I feel for you, and highly commend you for the compassion shown your sister in her recovery from alcohol. It is difficult for any of us who have been raised, or exposed to narcissists, to disengage from them. Good for you, that you've figured it out. Hopefully, on this end people like our sisters will figure that one out too.
O.K., Sharynmarie, have a great Sunday! Love & Light! Margeaux

Thanks, Cattails, for your candor. I know you're right. I spent yesterday afternoon looking for a place to live two counties away from my mother. My brother who lives here in town is now being openly hostile to me. I'm more than ready to let him take over the responsibility for my mother.

And yes, I am in counseling to help me deal with the guilt, the rejection from my mother and the feeling of having failed.

I've read a great deal about narcissistic mothers, and I guess I keep trying in my head to make excuses for her and rationalize why she is the way she is. I'm sure that her childhood was difficult, though we know virtually nothing about that because she doesn't talk about it. I know her own mother died when she was about 12, and that she was the youngest of about 8 kids, so I'm sure her needs for maternal love and nurturing were not met. Maybe that produced the narcissism, I don't know.

And maybe I'm the narcissist because it feels like I'm making the problem all about my sanity and my needs instead of putting hers first. I keep trying to tell myself she's 83 years old, with physical problems, cognitive problems, mental, emotional and spiritual problems. I should be able to be more objective and detached, and just deal with her on a surface level, but I can't get past the hurt.

It may sound selfish, but I'm moving. And I'll let my brothers discover for themselves what I've been experiencing.

Thanks for your support.

OMG, My mother, only 74 looks, and act's 99. Very sad. She married seven times, drug the four of us children with different fathers from home to home, school to school, and then had us sent to psychiatrists, juvenile hall, foster homes, etc...when she couldn't figure out what was wrong with US. At 52, I came to realize a few years ago, she suffers from Borderline Personality Disorder, as well as, Intermittant Explosive Disorder. She rages at anyone and everyone she chooses. She raged in my face a few days ago for not offering to take care of her, and I told her, "I will not subject myself to your abuse any longer. I can't do it." My PTSD symptoms are activated every time I'm around her. We have tried to love her, but she won't let us in any normal sense.
Anyway, she recently lost the most wonderful Care Provider she's ever had. The poor gal just couldn't take it any longer. She said she hung in there with my Mothers crazy behavior because she felt sorry for her that her children didn't come around. She said, "your Mother said the most horrible things about you kids, and I felt sorry for her." I'm glad I was able to explain to her about the BPD. She said, she had new patients/clients to take care of and they smiled, and were generally happy, but she was waiting for them to explode on her. I told her it sounded like she was experiencing PTSD symptoms, and that in time she will be ok, and that now she is better informed, and will be in a position to recognize BPD traits sooner should this ever arise again.
Raging in my face looking like she wanted to kill me, my Mother said she was the way she was because of me, and I should take care of her despite the abuse, that she was there for her Mother. (dream on)
The fact is she desperately needs Assisted Living, and us kids along with her Doctor are working towards getting her the help she needs.

JW~I have been following your posts and you are doing the right thing by getting out. You are not being selfish by any means. You need to develop boundaries with your family to protect yourself which your therapist should help you develop them. Chances are your mother will do the same things to your brothers and then they will come calling on you to come back to care for her. You need to stand your ground with them if/when this happens. You have been given advice here and I hope all works out for you, stay in touch!!

Dear JW,
My Father is a full blown NPD, (mother Borderline) and I believe the genes, and generational karma is handed down through our family lineage. Isn't that amazing, from people we've never even met??? Naturally, our parents acted out what they didn't know how to work out; as a consaquence, they handed their wounds to us, their children.
JW, I so identify with you that I'd like to share a therapeutic technique i recently learned called "Self Identity" from Dr. Stanley Hewlen based on Hooponopono Healing. I think is going to be quite helpful in healing our inner-child when those thoughts and feelings of guilt, rejection, and not being good enough come up; rooted in our childhood development. I'm going to become more aware to connect these painful thoughts/feelings immediately to my inner-child, and say to her: I love you, I'm sorry, please forgive me, and thank you, (to my inner-child) for holding onto the false core beliefs, memories, and thoughts about myself. Ask: What is it in me that created this feeling? (painful childhood) This is based on his phenominal book, co-authored by Joe Vitale,( from
movie The Secret,) "Zero Limits".
I've been working on healing from NPD abuse my entire life, so am looking forward to giving this a try. So happy to hear you're moving to take care of YOU for a change. Much love always.......

JW, Welcome to the thread.
After having read your post, I can't help but think. I too am the eldest of four siblings. But of the siblings we are two sisters, being the eldest, then the two brothers. In our family also, there has been this inherent dysfunction that the daughters would just jump in there and do all the details about caregiving. I many years ago, was living in a foreign country, living my life. If you can believe it, my narcissistic mother at the time still had power over me. Well in short I left a really good relationship & came back. In hindsight I admit it was guilt, being the eldest and always following through w/family. At that time, my dad was a bit older, certainly not ill yet. Anyway, I didn't move back in with my parents. Eventually, though I did, my dad was diagnosed w/cancer. So I was living there helping out in any way I could. But my dad was very independent, not a high maintenance person, My sis help out a lot also at this time, but not our brothers.
But I did become the watch person. Mom was many times too tired, and emotional on account of dad's surgeries, chemo and all that. This was now 12 years ago, and I moved out also.

Current day my sister has done the caregiving, but in a way more intense manner, than was expected of me, since dad was a different world compared to our mom w/ALZ, and her sister-the narcissist, who just died-RIP!!

My dad was a nice guy.

Anyway, my point about all that I just wrote, is the fact that in our family also, we women have been the ones called upon when there's caring to be done. It took me a very long time, and I guess I finally realized it when I did return from my time away in Europe, that my mom was still affecting and making me feel guilty for what? She didn't want to allow me to live my life! I finally had to put my foot down with her, and I am so glad that I did, for my own sake. My morale was just constantly being taken down by mother. I was sick of it! I was raised the people pleaser, so this was hard for me. O.K., I'm sure this possibly had something to do w/much later decisions going on in the clan, about legal matters. I totally got bypassed in terms of being elected as a POA for my parents. This has hurt, being the eldest and I was there little go to gal all the while I was growing up. But bottom line, there was too much of the male hierarchy going in our family, the "BOYS," would always be entrusted w/such important positions. I'm more like a proud peasant, in terms of pecking order. HAAH!

Even right now, my sister lives w/mom, does a wonderful job. She's gone through a lot doing this because she also had to put up w/mom's sister, til just this last Jan. That was literal hell for her and me, especially. Our brothers also as yours, don't get their hands dirty at all. They'd prefer to as you're brother says, "let nature take it's course."
My sister too, is on the one hand a very strong person. Every now and again, she gets her feelings hurt because mom has never been the nurtury kind of mom.
Well, she's going to get less of this now that mom has the ALZ. But in our case, my has mellowed tons.
JW, don't feel that you have to put up with this behavior by your mom, nor your brother's. I in a sense, have had to take a stand as such, but for other reasons.
You have done a lot for your mother, and if she is the very one, expressing she would rather you leave, this must be terrible after everything you have already done for her. Well, now if your mom has elected your brothers for the legalities,
let them take over. I'm not afraid to admit to this part in my circumstance, the fact that I'm not legally in charge, so this limits my power, but then I also have my boundaries of my own on account of this too. There! It also feels great to say this!
I feel it is of utmost importance for one to realize that we are worthy of respect.
No one else will respect us, if we don't honor ourselves in this regard. Love and Light! Margeaux

Margeaux,

I smile at the term "proud peasant" because that is exactly who I am in the pecking order of my family. I've done my best to ignore the fact that the other siblings are favored and given keys, responsibilities, etc. and I am treated as a second class daughter by my own mother. She suffers from some sort of problem that causes her to rage in anger whenever anyone crosses her. Unfortunately, my father calls upon me to help him with tasks occasionally and doesn't tell her. That is when I get an accusing phone call, "Why didn't you tell me your father talked with you about _____?" The conversation ends as soon as it begins. I am not allowed to speak, not respected in any way, shape or form and my mother continues to dictate to me as if she believes I am still that 10 year old daughter. It is utterly amazing to hear her flip into her rage over the phone and "forbid" me to see my father. I'm sure my dad has known over the years that she has often done this to me and caused the divisions within the family. It does not hurt me any longer because I dealt with issues of my family of origin in counseling years ago. My mother's abusive behavior toward me during childhood was forgiven long ago. I've attempted in the best way I can to have a loving and kind relationship with her ever since. It is her choice to mistreat and disrespect me and the other people that she abuses with her screaming fits and demands. The way I look at life now, my father chose to remain married to my mother despite her poor behavior at times. Although he is not able to care for himself any longer, the choices he made in his life have left him in the hands of a very controlling and domineering woman. If she chooses to be cruel to her own children then he must bear the consequences as long as he is married to her. I am sad for my dad but I don't allow her to mistreat me any longer. I'm no longer afraid of her and I no longer need her approval. That is the freeing aspect of the result of my family of origin therapy years ago. I keep the boundaries necessary for my own safety and mental health. It is unfortunate that some of us have a parent or brother or sister that is abusive and cruel. It is a fact of many lives and I'm just glad I don't allow it to rule my emotional health any longer. It took me 39 years to get to that point, but I'm happier because I chose to love myself and then love the others in my life to the best of my ability. If they can't love me back, that is not my fault or anything that I should feel guilty or badly about. It is just reality, some people like my mother may have been abused as a child and never got the therapy they deserved. Unfortunately, I can't bear the responsibility for her poor choices and bad behavior. I'm just a proud peasant too!

I don't want to sound like i'm man-bashing because i'm married to one of the wonderful ones, but why do parents always give so much power to the boys in the family? Especially concerning their healthcare. My brother told me that if I took the emotion out of the situation that I would see having my father in a nursing home is what was best. Isn't that how people end up in nursing homes? Taking the emotion out of the situation? Needless to say, I convinced my mother to take my dad out and moved them both in with me. Now my brother is telling everyone that I supported dad being in the nursing home and that I'm a liar. All my brother can think about is his greed and himself. I had my mom change the healthcare surrogacy over to me and my brother went balistic saying that he almost sued me but didn't cause I'm family. He told me that I was a manipulator and that mom was the biggest manipulator of them all. I guess this is what happens when your the only boy in a family. You get turned into little lord fauntleroy!

My dad died six weeks after they moved in. My dad had diabetes and terrible wounds on his feet. I cared for him with the help of home health during this time. My brother didn't come and see my dad until he was about to go into the hospital and have his legs amputated. My dad died a week later. I called my brother the night before and told him that dad was going into heart failure and would he fly in.
He hung up and called me back and said the ticket was $400 and he couldn't come. He works for Homeland Security....excuse me. Now everywhere my mom and I go he goes ahead of us and "marks his territory." That's what I call it. He's a major control freak. I have two older sisters. The oldest child and sister is all in with my brother. She even wrote on my Facebook page where my kids would see it that she had never loved them or me. She lives next door to mom's vacant house and refuses to help with it. My other sister has been supportive all along, but has some issues of her own that create even more conflict in this already CRAZY family. I'm the baby. I'm a tough cookie though. My dad came to me in a dream and I told him that I was sorry I had let him down. He grabbed my shoulders and said oh honey you didn't let me down....I let you down. My dad made my brother equal owner of he and my mother's stock. Now my brother refuses to remove his name from it. What a mess!

Careful: I agree, you didn't let your dad down. I'm sorry your brother and one sister are so unkind to you. You deserve much better. Hugs, Cattails

I started seperate facebook page to draw some attention to my writings and such besides handicrafts like crocheting and loom knitting and my sister went ballistic over something that is several months old by now and i refuse to communicate to her now because its become petty this and petty that no real actual talking. I hate that i had to do it but I called the selfish one when I was looking after my husband who had a stroke in 09 and few other things trying to keep my family off the street. She can send my dress to me and along with 7,500 dollars owed to my family. I wil state that in my own personal will because I am not ms moneybags like she is. She needs therapy like I am going thru and its just pointless to have discussions with siblings whose only focus is on themselves. I love my family but if they cant love me for who I am then why try to dance with them and do the brownie points thing. It does get old and its does get stressful...I can't count the number of times over the years while my husband been in the hospital and both of our families looked the other way.

She called me selfish i meant to say lol :) when i kept her house clean and try to teach her kids some respect for the adults.

Burned~ I know how family members can be so one sided. Of course we all have to put our immediate family first, but if family can't be emotionally supportive of others, without all the snipping and putting down, it creates unnecessary stress. I only family member I have had problems with has been my own mother who will take advantage of me and other family members because she can't see her children as separate individual people. Good luck with your facebook page, you might also consider Esty.

I am really struggling now and not because of my mother. I have been working at a new work site (same company). I am having trouble getting my work done and clocked out on time which is frowned upon. The problem is customer service is so incredibly busier than what I have been used to and the routine of the shifts is different than other sites I have worked at. I am a worrier so I am really worried about my success at this site. I have actually become depressed about it. I just finished my second week there and I'm hoping for the best for this next week. I have never been the fastest but I have never been the slowest since I have been working for this company which I have 4 years invested in, and I don't want to look for another job now. I just too damn old to start over again. Anyway I have groceries to put away. My cat gets a reaction to celery like it's catnip and he is going crazy in the kitchen. Love and hugs to all!!

Sharynmarie, It may just take some time for eventhough you have worked their for 4yrs, you have not in this particular area so it's going take some getting use to. If no-one verbally has said anything, don't worry so much for that can make it harder on yourself too. Now, back to your cat. What is deal with celery n him? Do you give it celery n he acts like he had some cat-nip? I know my spoiled cat just goes insane over cat-nip. She is sitting right next to me at the arm of chair n sometimes I don't even know she has jumped up beside me n all of sudden I will automatically be petting her. My hubby said, she got me trained. ; )

i have tried etsy but i can't downsize my my pics which is why i use fb no limitations be back later.

Lildeb~I thought so too, but last Wednesday the manager of my department said she gives people 1 week to adjust, then on Monday of this week she told me she doesn't know where to place me within her team. She said I am slow but work consistently and I don't make mistakes. I told her I have never been the faster but I have never been the slowest at other work sites. I told her I was concerned about the stress it may be placing on co-workers. She said not to worry about it, all people work at different speeds, etc...so I don't know if she will transfer somewhere else. I don't like failing and I feel like I am, time will tell.
There is something about the smell of celery that my cat likes. Whenever I bring it home and I place the bag on the kitchen floor, he starts rubbing all over the bag trying to get into the bag. He will go under the kitchen table and start playing with the table legs. I gave him a celery leaf once and he started rolling all over it and playing. I am assuming it is the smell that attracts him. Yes he has us trained too. In the morning he waits for my husband to leave for work so my husband can let him out in the front yard. We have a doggie door but the cat is smart enough to know that he can get in the front yard faster if we open the door and let him out instead of using the doggie door which takes him in the backyard.

Hey Sharynmarie: I think your honest conversation with your manager is a good thing. If I was a manager, I would appreciate that you are consistent and don't make mistakes, but I understand that you are in a new environment and the support is different than in the past. Bless you, Sharynmarie. You are a good person and I pray things work out in a way that gives you security with the company.

Sending you lots of love and good wishes. Cattails

Sharynmarie, I would want consistent than having someone that is fast with errors. Give it some time n see if you start to feeling more comfortable in the new area n maybe your speed as well as your consistency will come together. All you can do is your best n hopefully the boss will see consistency is better than having errors.
As for the kitty with celery that is too funny n the doggie door, that is one smart kitty. ; )

I hope everyone here will be able to find one small positive aspect on life with the challenges we may face.

I am learning to say what needs to be said with love but toughness. I have also learned about the call/texting block feature on my cell phone for use with siblings.That being said, I know all of us are carrying a tough load so I want to send my love to all of you. Take care of yourselves.

I always feel better after I vent on here and I realize that I may be trying to put too much effort into siblings who are acting petty. I'm not going to do that anymore. Thanks!

Today was a better visit with my mother at the nursing home than last week when she wanted to walk out of the nursing home, get in her car and drive home. Yet, mom told me that she was about to call the police chief where we used to live when I was a child and where she lives now to go find out where I am. I reminded her that I was at home which now is in __ city. What an interesting train of thought was in her head today.

too bad they do not give that option on landline phone you have to do it manually. I had a bit of fun last night...did some venting and got drunk just what the doc order lol. Now I need to take a shower and then go do some shopping for more kid shampoo because my kids have taken to making bubble baths and wasting it. My daughter is wear big hair of the 80's until i get her in the tub sorta reminds of me of the musical Hairspray ....

Cattails and Lildeb~Thank you for your advice. I plan to continue to work by best which I have always done, pushing myself to go further. My schedule has been reduced to the minimum that the union allows, but I am not going to analyze it to death because that will cause me more stress. Most work sites within this company only give the minimum plus 4 additional hours anyway. If after a couple months I feel she is still not happy with me I will ask to be transferred if she doesn't transfer me first. I think what is making this so hard for me is having been raised in a dysfunctional family, all the old inadequacies are surfacing their ugly recorded voices. I refuse to let someone make me feel inadequate so I am practicing detaching from my emotions as best I can at this point.

On a happier note, my friend Sandra has been able to place her mother in a NH. She is more relaxed and slowly getting back her zest for life. She has a B.A. degree in psychology and teaches bereavement classes through a local mortuary.

Love and Hugs to everyone, hope your weekend is a great one!!

sharyn, I know exactly where you are talking about.
Sorry to have been MIA (missing in action), I have a stuff to deal with. I am on my way home from seeing the specialist, and it is kind of a good news/ possible bad news scenario - but, as always, could be worse. I did not run errands for mother, in fact I didn't visit her. I have and have had things I need to do for myself, and I don't need the stress of being in her company, and hearing the latest litany of woes. She has been telling me she is on her way out, and her stomach is finished, and her heart is bad, but she has never been on heart meds, wakes up in the morning with rosier cheeks than mine, and hasn't lost a pound, so I find it very hard to believe her. She just wanted me to focus on her when I came into town, BTDT - no more! The main thing she wanted me to do is really something she needs to sort out with my sister, but as always, I am called in to be the "fixer upper". I can't/won't do it any more. They need to resolve thier own issues.
The inadequacies, the taking of blame for things for which we are not responsible for, the failing to stick up for ourselves, the underlying continual stress of waiting for the other shoe to drop,... and that is where I was when I was last on here.

Thank you all for the suggestions. I do appreciate them, and do use them. Perhaps I was not clear. I do have coping skills in the area of the reducing my responses to dysfunctionality, or because of dysfunctionality, as Sharyn described so well above, what I would like to acheive, and maybe it is not possible (but I can dream) is to not react in the first place, so I would not need the coping skills. In fact,to heal sufficiently that that underlying tension does not exist any more. I am better than I was, but not as good as I would like to be, nor as good as I think I can be. I know it is a tall order, but if you don't aim for something high, surely you won't get there. I think some of the healing would be dealing with the PTSD that has come from the childhood experiences, and I understand that can be helped, also firmly believe in the power of prayer, both for these issues, and also for my physical healing. They may be related. The continual stress must affect the immuine system.
Anyway, that is where I am at. I see some new members in the thread -welcome - you surely belong here, from what I have read, and will get some great support.

Hope everyone is having a goodf weekend. ((((((((((hugs)))))))) ♥♥♥

Burned~So glad you had a fun time last night getting drunk and venting!! A friend of mine did the same thing and I am so sad I missed the opportunity to join them...oh well maybe next time!! I must admit though that this friend of mine is always in need of advice and help but pooh poohs on everything offered to her so we are getting where less and less of us offer her help. Keep doing what you are doing as it is beneficial for you and your children. I hope you get the job as a teacher's aid, it will definitely help your situation!! Love and Hugs to you!!

sharyn -forgot to mention that I am glad that your friend Sanda has placed her mother, and is feeling better.
I have real trouble believing that you would be judged inadequate in a job. The others have giving you great advice, and your idea of being transferred if you feel things are not working out is good. Do what works for you, and I am glad too that you are sloughing off the feelings of inadequacy. My prayer foe all of us is that thst the time comes when we don't have those emotions to deal with any more. ((((((((hugs)))))))

Joan~You are probably right!! I thank you for that thought. I am sure it is my emotional insecurities with the past that has been triggered and I have to deal with it by practicing my emotional muscles of detachment. I am feeling better today but have some concerns about going to work tomorrow.
I hope your news is good and please know that you are a good daughter and friend!! I understand about having to place yourself first when dealing with a dysfunctional family member and choosing your own health. I am happy you are dealing with your health issues first as we can be no use to anyone else if we let our health fail. Love and Hugs to everyone!!