If a family member is the caregiver and takes more verbal and physical abuse from the patient, what can you do?

Paradise I wasn't lucky I got help from a rape crisis counsellor... not counselling per se but an explanation that abuse is nothing more than the insecurities of a bully intent on gaining power for themselves and that the best revenge is to be the best person you can be and to stand up and be counted for the things that are right and to expose the things that are wrong in this world. This words meant so much to me and I try to live by them. I have lost jobs for standing up for the right things but I never lost my dignity. I have lost 'friends' for criticising things I believe are wrong but I stand by my comments. I am a gobby cow and I get a lot of things wrong but I do try especially when it comes to the serious.

OMG, ohjude...how awful!!

OhJude...unfortunately, I have to admit that cycle does happen...learned behavior. I also know of MANY situations don't go in that direction. You are lucky,my friend. You broke that cycle...intellectually & emotionally. God bless you. We need more like you!

Easily llama lover. My mother it me over the head with her walking stick some time ago when I was asleep. Ive seen with my own two eyes a person who I didn't think was able to stand unaided pick up her zimmer frame and throw it at a nurse. A gentleman not far from where I live was stabbed by his wife who had frontal lobe dementia with a pair of scissor. My mothers friend's husband has knocked his male nurse out when he was having his catheter changed. It's not about the fact that they have the capacity in a one on one situation its that they almost seem to be opportunistic in their choice of times. Hair pulling, biting and scratching is common especially at bathing and dressing times when the person with dementia feels exposed and very vulnerable and the CG has to be close enough to do their job. Its not necessarily about strength but don't confuse dementia with infirmity. The two don't ALWAYS go together although inevitably they will. xx

Paradise did you mean abused people become abusers? Please say no to this. In my experience I would be anything but abusive. I know the powerlessness I felt and if I had my way no-one would ever have the capacity to disempower another. I am much more likely to harm me than another.

Wow! How does the elder impose physical abuse on the CG from a strength standpoint? Child-like behavior, yes.

Could not agree with wanto to learn more. You have to educate yourself as much as you can. Another good resource, if not mentioned before it "The 36 Hour Day"
Really, you can't get educated enough because just when you figure it out, something changes & blew that advice out of the water. Good luck & God bless you in your journey

The book Learning to speak Alzheimers is also a great reference as it gives strategies for recognising things that might be setting off upserting and argumentative behavior so that these wpisodea occur less frequently

If you have people with dementia in yourhousehold the polive like you to let them know so that if they need to resond to a call the have some knowledge going in. At the very least, start with that. You also might want to take the online courses provided at the Alzheimers association website. There is a baduc class and then you can take one on managing behaviors.

I believe that you are able to have a person committed to a mental hospital with the signature of a physician and one other person if the person is in danger of harming him/herself or others.
At least I think this is true in Georgia.

Abusive situations travel in cycles. It sounds that your brother needs a serious intervention & if there is physical/mental issues...remove him from the mix. Abusers become abusers...thus the cycle continues .YOU have the power to break that chain. You are stronger than you think. Easier said than done...but from personal history, it may hurt, more than you could ever imagine...But take a deep breath and DO IT, or you may not be around to do anything

I don't have answers, but l can relate to what your going through! My mom is also a negative, abusive, & demanding! 3 siblings feel it's my fault that mom is a mess! They say she belonged in a home from the beginning, so oh well! You brought this on yourself! I have to say to you though.... I personally think you need to give up the caregiving, as do l. My mom l don't believe ever liked me an carries that baggage into her dementia world! The kids that she would love to had take care of her, wanted her in a home! She said l rather be dead than live in a home! She says to me l'm nothing but the hired help. My hope for my mom was l thought l could give her a better ending than her dysfunctional beginning! I know some things can not be changed, time to move on. I'm 72 an l have a handicapped son in my home, that l support, and grandchildren that could use my help! So yes this feels like a giant mistake, an wasted 2 1/2 yrs. living in her home taking responsibility for her an her home. I believe my mom has always had a mental illness an now dementia! Some things we can not change! Accept the things l cannot change an move on! I hope this helps some of the caregivers that are stuck an feel guilty!

Right I don't know what happens in the States or Canada or anywhere outside of England in this particular case but I did ask a 999 call taker (911 to you all) what would happen if a caregiver rang to cite physical abuse.

This is not a police matter UNLESS the abuse is serious and renders the individual incapacitated in some way. That said if the attack was ongoing they would possibly send a police officer BUT they would definitely send a paramedic to conduct a mental assessment of the perpetrator (and a medical examination of the victim, but also possibly a mental assessment of the victim).

If the person who assaults has dementia or is mentally disabled in whatever way then in law they might well be guilty but on the grounds of diminished responsibility and even that is contentious since they had no intent to cause harm. The only action that is likely to happen is that social workers would be called in the assaulter removed to a secure professional unit for psych assessment during which time the caregiver (if they are live in or a relative (other than a spouse) could stay at the domicile. If they have post assessment to go into permanent professional care then the caregiver (Unless a spouse) would have to find other accommodation - spouses and civil partners have different rights. Now that effectively means that we as caregivers are not catered for. If your loved one - your Dad for example, its you hard over the head and cracks your skull which may potentially cause you to have epilepsy in the future then you have no recourse to access compensation for that and that is really unfair given that the person with dementia can now use their home to pay for their car while you as the caregiver have a life ruined. OMG our laws need changing

One more thing. You should set up a camera as suggested. My MIL is agressive and chases after my FIL. He tries to cover himself and she got a bruise. She called the cops. They saw her bruise and arrested him. He won't tell on her( thinks he's protecting her). She's got dementia,he is the most patient man I've ever meet. Protect yourself. As said before document everything.

Whatever is happening, you MUST document it.....to protect yourself! take photos, take videos, get a BODY CAMERA. These days everyone expects to be able to do instant replay---so get with it, and make sure you can PROVE that they are abusing you. Also bring witnesses. Even one scenario of abuse, proven with videotape, is enough to have these seniors committed to a facility, and you must consider this as the best option right now.

OK Lets look at this caregiving malarkey as a business and then see where it takes us....

Strategy : o ensure LO care is the best it can be. measured weekly by happiness and improvement in outlook.

Not quantifiable in a metric but through qualitative analysis

Business Plan

DO we have the resources to care?
Do we have the funds to place LO in care for respite
Do we have enough money to place Mum in permanent care?
Are we qualified?
Are we the best people for the job?
What makes us so special?
Are there better options?
What do we need to do to make sure they are better and that they remain better?


Hmph that was a bad move - Mum should be in care!

I agree. If a doctor notices a bruise and there is an investigation, they may not understand that the patient is the aggressor. I'd ensure they are somewhere safe, before there's a crisis.

Once the violence starts, its time for longterm nursing. Get both evaluated. If there is money, it will have to be spent down. If not, medicaid will help. You can't do it all. Your responsibility is to make sure they are cared for. That u can do by visiting regularly.

Taking a slightly different approach, you might want to consider taking Judo. My father taught it to us as teenagers and it most certainly did give us confidence.

If you are of Cherokee lineage, then you have an extra burden because of the denigration of Native Americans for centuries by the white power structure which was so vicious in controlling the lives of Native Americans, driving some to alcohol, despair, low self esteem and worse.

If your brother is physically abusive of you, he also may have been a victim of this ingrained social phenomena of discrimination.

I've read that some of the trauma has focused on women, as caregivers of the families, and they have born the brunt of family dysfunction. I did see a program on local community outreach to help women in this situation, provided in the NA communities by other NA peoples.

If you are in a community of other Cherokees, are there any social workers involved, any help to address family abuse? If not, can you find a support group in which you could interact with others and learn how to regain your self esteem?

I don't know if you're in a position to leave, stay at a women's shelter and refocus your life, but if it's an option, I'd consider it.

I think the first step is to recognize that as an individual you don't have to take this abuse. Then the challenge is how to handle the home environment. Others who may more direct experience have offered advice. I can't speak directly to this issue. But I hope you're able to gain some insight from their suggestions.

Shrugging off the unacceptable treatment doesn't have to define the rest of your life. Please consider how to either escape or to consider what is available to help change the situation to make yourself safe.

Good luck, stay confident, and remain that as an individual you have the right not to be abused, in any way or form.

The trouble with dementia is that the brain doesn't join up the dots too well, so memory and behaviour are seriously impaired and only get worse over time. the joining up the dots that is not necessarily the abuse although it is possible

I did smile as I read call the police. I wonder has anyone ever done this? Or does anyone work for the police that would know what would happen. over here we are lucky - very lucky - in these circumstances the Social Services would deem they AHD to go into professional care but then again that also means that if you are dependent on them for anything whatsoever (including living in the house) that goes too so not all brilliant but at least you won't be abused. Well not by the person with dementia - the state over here doesn't give a toss about you the caregiver.

Hi everyone. My dad has also been verbally abusive and physically threatening. It usually happens when I tell him to have a shower or that Im getting together with my boyfriend or anything else that gets him agitated. A couple of weeks ago he was particularely mean and when he started calling me bad names, I told him it was unacceptable and that he was never to say that again. Then he walked toward me with his chest puffed out and arms raised. I stood tall and shouted that he was not to touch me, and that his behaviour was way past my limit. He sat down and looked quite upset. Since then he has treated me with more respect even when he gets angry that I tell him what to do. My adult son is living with us which makes me feel safer. And he is declining so quickly. There are many quality moments still...

can you call the police? I'm just curious. I wonder what would happen. Maybe they would straighten up? Maybe the police can connect you with help? Worth a try.

We all want to have that Norman Rockwell family. We want to have families like those depicted in TV shows where the elderly parent lives happily and harmoniously with their grown children and family. However, more often than not, that's not possible. We all carry excess baggage and the older we get, the more baggage we have to carry. A perfect parent would be the one who appreciates their grown child's help and hospitality and doesn't butt in where they don't belong. But unfortunately, most parents never ever let go of the whole parent/child thing. They never allow their children to grow up. They move in with us and then proceed to take over every aspect of our homes and lives. They seem to feel that they cannot let go of the control. Perfect world would be where we take our elderly parents into our home and it's a wonderful life. But we don't live in a perfect world so we have to do the best we can with what we're given. I have a wonderful friend who takes care of both of her very elderly parents AND her in-laws. They are kind, happy and a joy to be around. I find it very very difficult for me to be around them and never go to my friend's house to visit anymore. It's just too painful to see her parents and then come home to mine. The difference is astounding. Rather we meet somewhere for lunch or something because it hurts me so much to see how wonderful her elderly group is and how they don't butt into my friend's life, how the grandchildren and great grandchildren love to be around them and often come get them and take them home for long weekends without being asked. I am so jealous of how my friend can sit and laugh with them and feels so at ease with all of them. There's no drama there. Only lots of love and respect. Whenever I take my mother to a doctor's appointment, I see women my age with their elderly parents and they seem so loving and happy...and then I look at me and mine....the difference is mind blowing. I wind up going home and feeling guilty for days on end. What I can't seem to grasp is that my mother is not at all like any of these wonderful elderly people that I mentioned. My mother is bitter, angry, hateful, spiteful, abusive (verbally) and a control freak. She enters my house complaining about the dogs, what's on TV, what's for dinner, the arrangement of my furniture, she even makes fun of the color I recently painted my living room (it's a very light gray - what's so funny about that?), she never fails to comment at length about my physical appearance. How gray my hair is, the style of it, my weight, my clothes. It's as if she has this list of negativity that she memorizes and then she will go down that list one by one until the visit is over. Christmas is the very worst. She will complain about the food, the presents, what she got, what she didn't get, how much I must have spent, every little thing. But this is nothing really new. She has ALWAYS been like this. The difference is, I didn't have to be around her as much back when she could drive herself and take care of herself, so I only had to deal with her on major holidays. Now I am forced to deal with her daily. I think if everyone who is having issues with their elderly would look back, they would see that their parent hasn't really changed....it's just that now they are forced to deal with it all the time rather than just some of the time. Whew! long post. Sorry.

My heart goes out to you. I can't imagine a more stressful situation. I would suggest that you try to step back and look at this from another perspective. I would suspect that you have a duty to protect the one who is being abused from the abuser, as their caretaker. Laughing it off isn't adequate, imo. I might try explore options for placement of the one in most need and who qualifies and handle this voluntarily, while you still have the opportunity.

Run, don't walk away! Abuse should never be tolerated! I know what you mean when you say that you laugh it off....you laugh because you don't want another fight, or verbal or physical abuse. It is an effective strategy. BUT you still feel the pain. No one should feel they have the right to harm you in anyway. The fact that you are, obviously, a good-natured person, should not allow them to take advantage of you! Look closely at your options. Do you feel you NEED to take care of them? If so, why? Are they eligible for AL or NH care? Do they have medicare or medicaid to support them? Please, please take care of yourself! Your life is your own...you have every right to be happy and safe. Please make it so...Being abused is NOT you, it's them! And just like you would never harm them...they should NEVER harm you! My blessings to you, Lindaz.

I strongly agree with anyone who says that no one should tolerate abuse. I'm a survivor myself and all abuse really does is devour the victim. Abused caregivers can back out of caregiving and request a replacement. Another thing they should do if this happens is to warn others of the abuse. Abused caregivers who must refrain from a patient who is abusing them should never allow that abuser to convince them to come back because of the abuse cycle is an endless vicious one. I must warn you of those 'good' times because they're just part of the cycle as I learned during my childhood when I was abused by my mom. You never have to take care of someone who is abusing you. When my parents aged, I didn't even have to care for them due to how they lost their parental rights to me when I was rescued from the abusive home and became a ward of the state. You never have to take care of someone who is abusing you. Finally, I must warn you that if you allow this to go on, you will also allow others to abuse you as well. If you're being abused, it's time for you to go from being a doormat to the person you were really meant to be. No matter what, a person's condition is no excuse for them to abuse you, and the worst thing about the abuse cycle is it only worsens.

I am so sorry you are going through this! I am a CNA and I take care of my Dad (Stage 6 Alzheimers) but he isn't violent or verbally abusive. You have to know that you can only do so much before you get to meltdown. If your Mom has dementia, she may not be able to help the verbal abuse, but if she is violent and hurts you...well, who is going to help YOU??? If you are hurt, who is going to help THEM? Sounds like your brother is very sick and usually very sick people are bitter and nasty. Again, you are no match for abuse and you shouldn't accept it as your lot in life. Knowing that you have done the best you can sometimes has to be enough. Please consider finding a care unit for them, you can always visit them. I pray you will be able to resolve this and please, please, PLEASE do NOT feel any guilt, you have been the hero, not the zero!! God bless you!

Apparently lawmakers have always believed that while the patient(s) need protection from their caregivers...caregivers are on their own because there aren't any laws (that I'm aware of) at least not federal or in my state, that specifically mention protection for non-paid caregivers/family members. What can you do? The choices are slim and none of them are easy or ideal. (1) you can stop being their caregiver and hand the job off to paid professionals. By that I mean, nursing home or a group home setting. This would allow you to visit with them whenever you like but it would also allow you to go home if/when the visit goes sour giving you some protection. However, if you depend on their income in any way....that will be gone. (2) If that's not an option many cities offer adult day care that is funded by Medicare/Medicaid. Take them there for a few hours every day to give you a break. (3) Medicare/Medicaid also offers in-home caregiver visits. They will handle things like helping them with bathing and simply visiting with them. You will need to speak with their doctor's and his office will have to "prescribe" these visits. However, it will give you up to 6 hours a week broken down over 5 days. Long enough for you to take a much needed break here and there. (4) Find a local support group. This might take a little digging, but most cities have them. They usually meet at churches or hospitals and they can be a lifesaver for you....and...lastly (5) divorce yourself from them completely. Family should always support one another, love one another and respect one another. Abuse is never okay whether it's verbal or physical and whether they're old or sick. Being old or sick is no excuse for abusing the one person who is trying to help you. I'm sure both your parent and your brother are not only ill but extremely frustrated and depressed over their current lives. They appear to take all of this out on you - because they know they can. They know that you will never desert them so they feel they can treat you however they please - all without repercussions. Because if you strike out at them or verbally abuse them - YOU can be arrested. Sometimes we have to worry about ourselves and our future and if that means finding a really good place for them to live that's not in your house...then why is that being a bad daughter/sister? A bad daughter/sister would allow them to live there and abuse them or neglect them. I'm so sorry you are going through this and I pray you find peace and happiness.

Physical abuse????!!!!!!!

No. If a family caregiver is being physically abused, the patient needs a higher level of care, meaning a facility with three shifts of professional caregivers.

one of my aunts was being beaten black and blue by my uncle because he wanted to get out of the condo and wander down the highway. She would wear the key around her neck to keep it from him. She had a massive heart attack a few weeks after he was placed in memory care. He lived happily for another three years.

YOU are only indispensable to YOURSELF.

Does these people have any kind of insurance that can help you to get a home attendant? I take care of my father along with the help of my sister. But it's becoming to be a bit for the both of us. I can only imagine what you're going through. Try to see what you can do to get your love ones some professional help. You have to take care of yourself. And if the need be, put them in a facility without guilt. This is a blessing from God for you and your family.