Drinking and thinking it's funny and cute at 82. Any advice?

That's right-that's all they do. Please contact Reformers Unanimous-a bible-based addiction support group at 866-733-6768.

Holly, your mother, not having been declared incompetent, has the right to go home. And YOU have the right to resign your POA and not have to show up the next time she falls down. Just make sure you notify your mom and APS that you are no longer POA.

I know, I sound cold and hard. But I do believe that this is what it's going to take for people to regain their sanity.

*Chimonger* - Your comment saying "We've got laws protecting elders; now we need laws and agents protecting Caregivers" really hit home with me. I dealt with an episode this summer where my mother (in her 90's and an alcoholic all her life) drank to excess, fell and summoned Life Alert. The EMT's thought she had been injured in the fall and she was too out of it to tell them her condition, so they transported her to the ER. I live in another state and drove the several days to get to her town. She was in the hospital several days and then transported to a facility to give her PT for her "weak knees." I begged both the main hospital and the PT facility to have a social worker evaluate the alcohol issue (this was not her first, other episodes are in her records), and get a social worker involved. When I was enroute and even when I was there, both facilities would not discuss very much with me even though I have Medical POA for her. They said that HIPPA protected her as long as she could say she was "ok" and wanted to just go home. I begged the Social worker, please -- you are just sending her home to get back to drinking and she will likely be back after another drunken fall! Isn't this the time that the medical profession could send her to an addiction rehab facility because she is a danger to herself? Isn't that a part of this equation??? She put on her best behavior and did the minimum required to pass the PT requirement and said she wanted to go home. So, with me there in town they said she could go home. I begged them, please, I do not think I can pick her up if she falls (I have sciatica and cannot pick up more than 25 lbs), plus I cannot stay more than a few days. She needs a longer-term solution! They told me they'd make an appt for her to go to a counselor and that was it. I think it was cruel on their part to disregard what I was trying to tell them, beg them to please listen. The social worker wrote things down, but I've not idea what was noted. HIPPA policy! So, I took her back to her home and called Adult Protective Services from my cell phone outside. I said that I believe she is a danger to herself. I've not heard anything from their agency although I've been told that it's a slow process in her state. If they did visit, they likely saw things all neat and tidy because her weekly care-aide keeps things tidy. Also, she can sugar-talk her way through a short interview. Why can't the ER reports raise a red flag? Why doesn't my POA have any strength? I'm absolutely amazed that the docs and nurses can look me in the eye and say, "she wants to go home, you can take her home now" and they don't hear the panic in MY voice????? Decades of this, all the way back to when I was a child and she would disappear for the afternoon and go drink only to be too tipsy to drive home -- the policeman would bring her home, in the door, and say, "take care of her." Good grief! I'm AARP age myself! Help! There are no other family members left alive. I'm "only one Holly."

Go to Reform U website I urge you!!!! It is a bible based addiction support program.

Loreal : Ahaaaa! Well then I have a suggestion! I used to keep vodka in the house for Bloody Mary's and punch-y drinks. My husbands friend came over just about every day, and was drinking away all my vodka! So I started making his drinks, and this is what I did : I filled a whole glass with ice and orange juice, and then poured about a tablespoon of vodka right on top and didn't stir it. And do you know what he said? "Damn, Girl! You make a helluva strong drink!" You might try that 😀

Seems amazing that alcoholism is still so prevalent, and that those who are sober often tend towards being some level of codependent, so often....basic human nature, I guess, some of the behaviors that keep letting the situation slide.
An alcoholic coming to an ER, or being dysfunctional at home [really really dysfunctional], are let-slide by so many family and officials who maybe should get the alcoholic evaluated better....it's just simply missed unless the person is falling-down drunk, etc.
They need advocacy by someone who can insist they stay in the hospital once admitted to the ER [as one person described]; by doing that, get Social Services involved. Pretty sure, had anyone done that for Mom, she'd likely have been admitted to some level of facility long ago.
Where Mom lived for around 50 years, people knew she was a mega-horder, that her place was pretty much uninhabitable; many knew she drank, and that she had behaviors of certain mental ills to-boot. Some even knew she lived in the derelict little camper trailer in the driveway, and ran a hose from a neighbor often, for water, etc....yet, everyone left her to her own devices [and vices], unless she got really out-of-hand, like not stopping talking about her [broken record offensive subjects] when she was carrying on while riding senior transport [they did kick her off the bus and make her walk]...but, .None. got her anything like a 72-hr. mental evaluation hold. Ever. [even though she'd had one flagrant episode of suicide attempt that cause hospitalization years ago]. None called the health dept. or anything.
If any officials did show up, she was always able to buffalo her way out of getting seen by anyone who could evaluate her, and able to "explain things" well enough, none ever got past her gate.
And kept up using and doing her behaviors.
The last-straw?
Her spouse went to hospital, dying imminently; she went with him as spouse, and her house was vacant for a few days. She got a ride back there to fetch a few things, then back to hospital. SOMEhow, a fire broke out in the bathroom; firemen hauled hoses clear through the horded piles of junk to put it out.
After that, after she'd been back to get something again, I found a couple stove burners on, leaking gas, filling the place with it. Coulda blown up.
At that point, all of us put our foot down, and told her flat-out "you can't go back and stay at your place anymore [because of what had happened [hosp, fire, gas].
Her choices were to stay with one sibling or the other, at that point.
That's when she begged desperately to move with us out of State. SUCKER here, obliged, and it was 6 years of he!!-on-wheels until she moved to another one's place.
But None of that got her to stop using. None of it improved her mental health.
Users are as they are. Only way they stop, is if they choose to do the work to make it so. And, stopping drinking will not cure existing mental health issues--might help decrease behaviors, but, those are still an issue to deal with.
IF the user can't get a supply, they can't drink; that can trigger really bad behaviors. It's fairly common for them to not take any meds that could stop the habit, too....not always deliberately, but by forgetting, or, by just feeling desperate to feel how they do when using, they tell themselves "I can miss a pill or two just for now, so I can feel good again". ANY excuse they can think up, will do. Mom even used "beer is my laxative; I need it every day to poop" [despite reminding her she'd always used coffee for that].
Yep--if she couldn't get it while out shopping with me, she'd walk to the little store about 1/2 mile away, to get some on her own. Otherwise, she'd never go for a walk!
Then, she'd try to trigger guilt in others for failing to take her shopping for booze, saying how bad her knees hurt from walking--but mostly? She .snuck out. to the little store, didn't want me to know she had....so would limit her verbals to just complaining about her knees, etc. Very creative person; amazing how she could manipulate others, and mosts didn't even realize it 'til too late...
Moral of story? If elder is a chronic substance abuser, they need strong, focused, sustained intervention to stop, usually...and it still might not work......OR...those trying to support them simply agree to let 'em drink themselves to death in whatever foul bunker they squat in, and know that it could be really grizzly process at any moment.
ALLOWING someone their choice to keep being so dysfunctional, is very hard for most of us to do; sometimes, that's the better part of valor. There are hundreds of factors which should be considered in that choice, and it's different for each.
And it's always. very. hard.
Those who caregive for them need as much support as we can get, to keep our own sanity and health intact...maybe that's where experts and officials need to focus more help next, so we don't fall through the cracks. We've got laws protecting elders; now we need laws and agents protecting Caregivers. And more options.

OH....and the pills and booze do not interact.

TO Nomde: Where are they *getting* the liquor? Furthermore, they must be getting an awfully weird reaction, combining booze and pills ...
I buy it, water it down and take it to her. Otherwise she may try to talk to a store to get it.

I had never heard of a pill to cure alcoholism!! I'm going to ask about it for sure! thanks!

Or Naltrxone.

NomdeVoage....gooood information! Have never heard of that myself!

P.S. If you talk to her doc, you might find that they have something called Tranzene, which will take aware the urge. It's made for people who are trying to quit ... So she doesn't crash like someone said, and maybe have withdrawal and DTs ... I knew someone who took it, and it seemed to work just great. And then, of course, just slip it in with the rest of her medicine, and tell her it's for anything you want.

May I ask you folks a question about this? Where are they *getting* the liquor? Furthermore, they must be getting an awfully weird reaction, combining booze and pills ...

Campyone- alcoholism possesses her, it's not her laughing.

I love the out-pour of support, and also the brutal honesty. Great group here :)

Loreal, my Mom didn't stop drinking until she WENT into a NH. And that was that. She also paid a few bills, didn't drive and quietly drank all day. She took amitriptyline and Advil PM to go to bed and usually didn't wake up into noon every day. I took her she was a stroke waiting to happen and that is want happened and now she is in a home. She is safe and well taken care of. She wasn't a knocked down nasty drinker either, but that is what it came down to. She didn't have any emotional withdrawal I think because the stroke whacked her mentally so bad. I've not heard of a home not taking someone in because they drink. They can't drink in a home anyway.

2nd UPDATE.
Thanks for the kind words. We have not really spoken since last Wednesday.
Every try living in a house where you don't speak to each other. Think I'm done!! She can take care of herself, She is such a typical Alcoholic, now it's my fault and she doesn't have to listen to anything i say. SHe literally was laughing as I was in tears.. Who does that??

dear loreal....if your mom is still capable of paying her bills on time...she's not that bad yet. by the time it's time for a rest home...she might not even remember she wants alcohol. ya just don't know in these cases...they are all different.

Hi Loreal, from what you described, I don't see a real problem with your mom. Being honest about it is the best and main thing. They might want to have her evaluated to see if she has any alcohol withdrawal symptoms before they admit her. Aside from that the best thing for you to know is that happens all the time and you are in no way alone in this!

My mom lost her sense of taste many years ago (possibly to the two rounds of chemo/radiation from two different bouts of breast cancer...who knows) so watering down the liquor is very easy for me since she can't taste it. (whiskey).

We took her car away from her a long time ago. My oldest needed a car at the time so we just told her my daughter is borrowing it and she will get it back. She has an older car in her drive that won't start, but she feels like she has it there if she needs it. (the keys are at my house, so no chance of anyone jumping it off for her!)

My mom is not a sloppy, hateful, destructive, obnoxious drunk. She is just more confused than usual. Doesn't remember what she had for lunch or who mowed the lawn, but she takes care of her two cats, pays her own bills (I left a few not auto-pay just so she will have something to pay....seems she needs that as her routine).

My biggest concern is that when it comes time for her to go to a home or assisted living or moving in a care taker, or whatever....they will not accept her unless she is sober.

to NomdeVoyage - it depends a lot on the particular doctor, and the hospital's policies. One former ER Dr. in our area tried to release an addict/alcoholic that a friend brought in, in pretty bad shape, because the patient said he just wanted to leave. The friend explained that the man was now homeless, and if released, he would die on the street that night. A social worker was called in and a placement found.

Veronica, I have a question. I have a friend who's dad is approaching very much a similar situation. I thought the idea of calling the ambulance was excellent. But what do you mean that the staff in the ER will give you a hard time about it? Thank you : )

Beenthere.......thank you for your strong, truthful and inspiring story. I have alcoholism that runs in my family with 2 family members that have died from it. You are exactly right about trying to talk to someone about their drinking, weight, or any addiction. THEY are going to have to be the ones to hit rock bottom and ask for help and help themselves. I had already given advice that she should have been left when she fell out of bed and that sounds harsh and cold but when you have done everything in your power to help someone that wont help themselves like a 3 or 4 year old then that is what you have to do. They have put themselves in that situation so let them get out of it. I don't want to ramble so I will leave it at that. Campyone......take care of YOURself. Beenthere......again, thank you for your candor and congratulations on your fight for sobriety. God Bless

I didn't notice if anyone said so or not, but if she's been doing this for a long time, she might go into the DT's if it (alcohol) is removed. In this case, hospital is the only way.

You need the help of Reformers Unanimous, a bible based addiction support group. Whether she wants to admit it or not, if her bottle is her crutch, she is an addict. Go to Reform U

campyone....alanon will give you all the advise and help you need! you will love being in a group of people that all share the same problem..get it off your chest and get support. there are many meetings...try all close to you...find the one you feel most comfortable in! yeah...good luck!

No need to plan lawsuit in advance. Please try to wait until HCP actually does something that merits legal intervention. Hospital staff are no more at fault for patients' SELF neglect than the family. Sorry that all ER experiences arent what we expect. How about an involuntary hold to evaluate danger to self? Can you file an ex-parte affidavit swearing to mom's dangerous state so a judge can order treatment? This situation did not happen emergently, there is no reason to expect one hospital visit will straighten out years of social problems. I do understand the dilemma, as my own father ignored his health needs for decades. Good luck to you.

good for you campyone. stay strong and God bless you.

UPDATE:
Well I sat her down and told her how unfair things were and that she is basically pushing everyone away.
Well, like a true alcoholic, she was very apologetic, and the whole it won't happen again, states she can quit on her own.
Then she found a reason later that day to be upset with me and started, the I DO EVERY THING WRONG, YOUR SO MEAN TO ME, BIT, Sorry to say it totally set me off. I was in the process of getting her stuff ready to go out. I stopped and looked at her and said "Are you kidding me?" Told her she needed to find another way to get there, I have not spoken to her since Wednesday night, and she has not spoken to me, was told by her friend she's waiting for me to apologize, LOL not going to happen. This sis when I am glad for my little travel trailer, I go back work on laptop,watch TV .
Thanks for all the wonderful advice, I looked up local Al Anon meeting, will be going ASAP.

There is a medication that if you drink alcohol, it will intentionally make one very sick. Ask the doctor if giving this will save her life?????

Campyone--what a horrible place to be in. I am a recovering alcoholic with 18 years continuous sobriety. I only tell you this to let you know, when I talk about alcoholism, I know what I am talking about. Someone mentioned it would be unusual for an 82 year old to get sober and sadly that is true. I was a fall down, black out, don't have a clue what I'm doing, slurring my words, DRUNK. And after all this time I am only one drink away from a drunk. Such is the nature of the beast. I am sober because I do the work to stay that way. But I will tell you, had I been 82 and with COPD I don't think I would have given a d___ and kept drinking to end it all the quicker. Yes, for your sanity, see if you can get your Mom to a doc and evaluated. The truth is you can talk til you are blue in the face and it won't matter. We alcoholics are selfish, self centered and don't give a rat's behind about the people we hurt when we are actively drinking. So save your breath. Do what you can to get her some help but, more importantly, get yourself help to deal with her dying without the guilt of having anything to do with it. It would be natural for you to feel that way. But in no way is anything your fault no matter what happens. Go to Alanon, see a therapist, do whatever you need to do to be able to allow your Mom to do whatever she wants without it affecting you. Hard to do. But if you don't, it will drive you crazy and cause you a great deal of anxiety. Help yourself and then you can do a better job of helping your Mom. I know I have rambled. Forgive me but I want to share one more thing. A friend of mine had an elderly alcoholic Mom and got her to move into assisted living. She refused to keep buying her booze. Without a car to drive, the only thing her Mom could do was walk about three blocks through a very busy intersection and got her booze.....cause that is what we do. We are alcoholics and what we do is drink. The miracle is when an alcoholic can go ANY time without drinking because that is what is unnatural for us. Eventually they had to move her Mom into a locked area because of her dementia and that ended the drinking. I hope you can find a way to give yourself some peace of mind and serenity. You are powerless over your Mom and it is making your life unmanageable. Stop trying to control and start taking the steps to take care of you and see if you can get her some help. That is all you can do. Good luck to you both.