Tired of my 67 year old mom living with us. How do I talk to her about this?

I agree with all comments...

Is there a way you could have your siblings help out financially and emotionally? I too am stuck in a similar situation. My 87 year old mom lives with my husband and I for the past year. She doesn't have any money so I can't afford to place her in an assisted living home. My older sister won't help out at all, in fact, she hasn't seen or called my mom for four months. I think you have to manage your mother's finances. I just started doing that since my mom started making mistakes and getting charged overdraft charges. As she is getting out of her credit card debt, I have been accumulating it since we pay for everything. So sorry for your situation. Hope your siblings can step up and help out. My sister won't even speak to me.

It is easy for US to say "give her a deadline" but having looked at housing options for about 9 months for my mom, I found several options but seemed there was always questions about "will this be enough for them.". I found VERY nice apartments in a St. Louis suburb, but couldn't get my stepfather to move into what he considered THE CITY. He passed away and I was even more aware that Mom needed assisted living. She lost her spouse, half her income (now under $2k) and we had to sell her home quickly to get her out of the house payment, which was 1/2 her total income, sell her car, (I bought it.) She had a mental breakdown, but in a couple months she has come a long way toward becoming herself again. But she is 87 and having mental problems as well as other needs.
Your mom needs to look around and see what others are going through and take some responsibility for her own life!
By the way, I was widowed at 60, and 4 years later I found a wonderful man on the Internet. (my son strongly pushed me to look, even sent me the link to the dating sight.). Husband had been looking for months and stopped looking soon after we started seeing each other. I didn't have to settle for less either!!

Rosebud 58 - I like it! "you need to thicken your Teflon!"
Good advice for everyone.

If Mom refuses to move, it will be necessary to go through the eviction process, and law enforcement will physically move her if necessary. Let us hope it won't come to that, but Mom should know that is what would happen.

A thought regarding the deadline approach. You could inform her of the upcoming change (ideally without getting sucked into the usual arguments) and then post a count-down chart, showing what is happening step-by-step. Hmmm, and another thought -- have you looked into eviction proceedings? You know, where the Sheriff serves papers and hauls them off if necessary. Of course, future relations might be strained . . . :-)

Just do it, what ifs will keep you crazy

I agree with deadlines to get her out of there. How did you put up her for so many years? But I'm curious about one thing: if the deadline comes, suppose you have found a place for her to move, but she refuses to leave when that deadline arrives? How can you force her short of physically picking her up and carrying her out? That would probably be considered abuse. Maybe if you moved all of her things to her new home and left her with a house devoid of her possessions? It's easy to say get her out of there, but not so easy to do as far as I can see.

One of the best things you have done, is get onto this chat list! It's very supportive and informative!
Her behaviors/emotional dysfunction make it almost impossible for her to "hear" anything you say that is rational or logical. She is in it to serve herself. She will keep using up anyone who lets her.
There may be other issues going on as well....but without evaluation, you have no way to really know what all is going on--she will not likely voluntarily let a Doc evaluate her mental/emotional state, so you may need someone to come do a home visit. [contact Area Agency on Aging to refer you to someone who can do this, or at least get a start on it]. She sounds quite dysfunctional, and, might be seen as incompetent to handle her own affairs.

She gets about $3K monthly--she could afford to live just about anywhere, even paying for her own insurance out of pocket--most seniors have faaaarr less!!

So why hasn't she been paying her share of living expenses while under your roof?
What would happen if you said she had to pay $2500 per month as her share of living costs [[depending on your overall expenses, and how much comes out to pay her actual bills, and liabilities/damages for having her in your home, and what time and resources you spend on her]]? [[if you do not need that money, you could invest it for her future needs, or place it into a Living Trust or something productive]]
What if you included information on at least 2 appropriate places she could live instead [which you already checked out]?
That way, she'd have an immediate choice to pay or move out....of course, the amount you say you'd want monthly, must to be--high enough-- it is less attractive than her moving to her own place....and that could backfire--she may go ahead and pay it!!!

While she's been staying with you, it sounds like you have been providing more than half her support--if you have been doing that for over 6 months per year, she could be a "dependent" on your taxes--has she been filing her own taxes, or have you been claiming her as our dependent?
IF you have been claiming her as your dependent, that might constitute ONE piece of evidence she needs help with her care. And that might help prove she at very least needs a Conservator to handle her finances--which could be in a place of her own, or in Assisted Living, or ? --out of your house.

She will probably not easily allow anyone to take over control of her money--she's having a great time using it---could have been playing that ever-popular game of divide and conquer on those close to her--has she been libeling you, or your DH, while living under your roof [unfounded accusations of any kind?].
She gives money to others, not you?...she loses uses or gives it away, not paying any of her support?
Does she pay her own bills [if any]?

She will keep using you up as long as you allow it!
She will act out emotionally when you talk turkey with her--that is flat-out manipulation--have witnesses present who have been prepared for this,
and put all the talking points in writing for her to keep it clear.

FIRST put some ducks in a row...
==Find places she can to live--senior apartments, assisted living, elder group homes? in your area. How much do they cost, how do they work, details.
==Learn about Conservators, how they work in your area, and, who does them, if she refuses to allow you to do it.
==Talk about it with your nearest "Area Agency on Aging"--they are located in just about all counties. These usually have volunteer legal services to help with elder care issues, as well as many other resources.
==Seek listings of AA support groups nearest you-- they can refer you to Codependency groups near Mom.
Take her to them, and you go along, too...being supportive, you might learn some things, too---- groups consist of those who have been dealing with that themselves....
===Use simple, clear terms. Just facts.
===Give her the positives first--that you love her, for instance....then identify to her what is wrong with her staying with you.
===Put your points in writing, so she can read them--that way, she is less apt to misconstrue what you say. She can re-read it later, so she can make sure she got it straight.
===Practice your discussion. Get supporter[s] to be there with you.

THEN, talk with your Mom...
===Remember, the discussion is about her, not you===no matter how she might try to turn it around and make it about you, it's not. You can refuse to take any of her accusations threats or anything, personally--it's all about her, really.

It might look something like this:
"==Mom, we do love you, AND we recognize you need help we cannot provide.
==Some of your behaviors are unacceptable in our home [be specific--you will have to name them for her].
==There are support groups which could help your present and future. [give information about AlAnon/CoDependents Anonymous]--Transportation can be arranged; you must attend meetings to get some help, with others who have similar issues--I will go with you!
==There are Psychologists who can help you sort out your feelings and history [provide 2 references]
==We would love to visit with you and give you reasonable help in your own place.
==We need our privacy back.
==You can afford to pay for your own place at [ 2 named places you already checked out], or, you can go to assisted living [name one that is decent].

She WILL cry, get angry, may act out.
She may work herself into a dancing fury.
She may get terribly depressed, may make threats of illness, suicide, other.
She may need watched for her safety.
Document everything.

You may need to have a Social Worker come in to evaluate her ability to take care of her own business, or whether she needs someone to take care of her finances for her; may need a Doc to evaluate her abilities.
She's been with you for some time--long enough you could see where she needs helps, and how well she could survive in her own place--those need communicated to whoever evaluates her.

You are now the adult in better form for making decisions, she cannot make logical, rational choices...the greater she struggles against moving out, is related to her fears of losing her abilities to handle her own affairs and her losses and perceptions of deprivation--and her fears.
She's lost her known life, and fears change.
Address fears supportively, as a caring parent does for a child who fears changes---- things that might be scary--moving--how it's handled; where basics come from, where she can shop, etc., to get her basic needs met; cover all the details that might be scary--though that might not be enough,
and she might be in denial of her fears.

If she sorta almost can take care of her living arrangements herself [finances, bills, shopping, activities of daily living [like dressing, bathing, laundry, kitchen duties], then she could live in her own apartment.
Otherwise, if she is "iffy" on those things at all, she might do better in one of the graduated living places--they start in an apartment where they can choose to have some light help, then as needs increase, move into assisted living, then nursing home...some places are pretty posh, others more basic.

Your Area Agency on Aging could really be helpful.
You need some supportive helps for YOU...ask Area Agency on Aging, your local or area Senior Citizen places, what support helps there are for those trying to deal with elders behaving badly.

You need some time for you, to prevent your Mom's sucking your life out of you, while you get things sorted out.
She will keep disassembling your lives, if she is allowed to keep doing it.
Limits need placed, and soon.
Get help if you feel you need it--witnesses to the event of when she gets told what her options are, etc.
This IS up to you.
No matter what, it is up to you.
Only you can decide what your limits are, how long you will tolerate, even sadly, her using you both up--financially, emotionally, and other ways.

Keep pressing her to move out, and she might surprise you
--she might have already been currying favor with another relative, to move in with them, and not telling you.
You ready for that?

Then keep us posted how things go!

Not honestly solving this problem now while it is solvable; e.g. You MIL is young and healthy, she is mentally astute, will increase the ill feelings and relationship problems with all of you over years. My Grandma lived with us from age 60 until she died at age 76 and every day became more stressful until it became hateful. It should have been handled honestly and firmly in the first year instead of swept under the rug. As it was. My mom ended up hating her mother, my mom and dad had a miserable marriage for the portion of their life that should have been the best, and my brother and I were never allowed to be happy kids, were in the middle of everything, and were asked to handle many adult matters that were not for 13-17 year olds. My Grandma was a professional manipulator and my mother took on guilt like a cloak and then passed it on in other guises to the rest of us. My dad just wanted peace and my brother and I just wanted to be teenagers. Do something before years go by and you have destroyed lives. If it is a problem already it will not get better. Save your family. I can't tell you how bad it will turn out if you don't.

I am 79 and take care of myself financially and every other way. My six kids sometimes need a wee bit of help and I give it. When she says you hate me say, "Yes I am certainly feeling like that these days. We need to make other living arrangements and that might just make it possible for us to stay friends. You will have to be strong, clear and not show emotions, Have a plan, give her not choice and if necessary let her know a deadline when you will put her things out and change the locks. Period. It will be a great learning for you and could just even save your relationship with her (if it is worth saving). She is not stupid and at some level she is just frightened. Tell her if she cooperates with you you will talk with her about her options but do not waste your breath unless she is willing to be calm and engage in meaningful dialogue. Good luck, darling. You must take care of yourself. That is your first responsibility.

Amen to ferris1. Your mother is much too young to be living with you. I am 71 and I wouldn't dream of being a burden to my children. She is not your responsibility. You are right in saying that she does not get it. She probably never will because this is the way she wants to be unless she wants professional help. Get her out of your house ASAP. I don't know how to say this kindly, so I will just blurt it out. You are being codependent by putting up with her antics. And, she is trying to buy your siblings' love. It probably won't be easy for your to get out of your trap, but you need to do it, not only for you and your husband, but for her. This is an unhealthy situation all the way around.

If she becomes physically ill, get her to a hospital with a good psych unit; they may be able to diagnose what seems like bipolar disorer, get her on meds and get her on with her life.

It is time to stop enabling her. It is not healthy for you, your husband or your mother. You need to learn to set boundaries and be firm. Pick up a few brochures at places she can afford and give them to her. Tell her she has 30 days to move, not a day more. Be firm.
She will most likely try every manipulative tactic she can to get you to extend the date or better yet change your mind altogether. She may even become physically ill. You must remember that both you and your husbands health is a stake. Living this way is stressful and can cause a host of health problems for you.
You may need to hire a Life Coach or a counselor to help you set these boundaries and be firm. Get the help you need so you can stop this cycle of enabling. Good luck!

I meant to say tell her she needs to get her big girl pants on and take care of herself while she is able. Sooner or later she may need help when she is older...bit in the meantime? you need your own life.

I just shuddered when I read this. My companion did the same thing. His mother was dependent on him, she was a alcoholic when he was a child and depended on him when she was drunk. She sobered up when he was a bout 12. He moved out when he was 17 and on his own one year before she called him and said she was in the hospital and needed him. And so the story began. He moved back with her, few years later got married, she moved in with them .At 60 she gave up her drivers license because she did not want to drive anymore..and the taxi company began..she now was dependent on rides. At 62 she turned power of attorney over to him because she did not want to pay bills. Although she was fine physically and mentally. Just lazy. Now she is 82, he is caretaking and still doing what he did for her from the time he was a child...caretake. Don't do it!

No experience with this. My mother-in-law agreed to live in an apartment on her own, then eventually went to assisted living. Can't you say she is capable of living on her own and that the psycholocigal well-being of you immediate family is primary?

i heard a long time ago "say what you mean." no fancy conversation is needed. Please look out for your own financial future or you will end up with nothing.

BobbBlue, you didn't say how long your mother has been living with you, however, ousting her will most likely be a slow process. There are some very good solutions/comments here, and they are all on point. These folks know what they are talking about. Your mother is dependent because that is all she knows. Now, unfortunately, you have to undo that thinking. She is terrified to live by herself and understandably so. But, she isn't the first lady to find herself without a spouse.....be it death or divorce. We all adjust and your mother needs a forcible push!

Get her excited about living in a new home. Tell her you will help her to find a nice place, and you will help with the curtains, furniture placement, etc. And she may want to bring a new puppy or a kitty cat into her new home. Offer to help her plant flowers, herbs, roses....whatever makes her happy. Let her know you will check on her, and she can come to visit you as well. Let her know you are looking forward to having dinner with her in her new home. She is learning to crawl at this point, and you will have to be patient. She also needs to understand that she will need to be responsible for her bills. And, if she lends money to people, then she may not have enough to pay her bills. As hard as it may seem for her to make a new life without her spouse, it is doable. Listen, teenagers leaving home for the first time find it a shock also, but they learn....and they manage.

Your mother is young and hopefully healthy. There is no reason on the earth why she must depend on you or others. My parents are in their 80's.....Daddy is blind and Mama had a stroke two years ago, however, they live on their own. Mama takes care of everything. Your mother will feel so much better about herself once she becomes independent. So, don't put this off.....start looking for housing as soon as possible. Your mother will be fine dear, and so will you.

Hugs

I agree, she needs to have a deadline date. talk with her, ignore the you don't love me assertions because its not applicable. after the talk put bullets in writing which clearly indicate the end date. she therefore can't say you didn't tell her, didnt give her a date...in our county there are senior apts where she can be closer to people her own age (not assisted living). the alcoholic personality traits don't go away even if she stops driinking (referred to as a dry drunk) so you will have to handle this whether she is drinking or not. You need your mental health...forget a life. Just focus on your mental health. You also need to be planning and saving for your own future because there won't be SS then....be honest with yourself about planning for your future/an emergency/mental health. Good luck. let us know how this turns out.

Enriched, please read the origional question, and
Then read my first post on the thread, then
Perhaps, you'll understand.

WOW! Bless your heart! After reading your post, my mother comes to mind.... Not because she was similar to yours but because she had figured out after years and years of being taken advantage of by family members.....she had to work on setting BOUNDARIES! You can only help people so much... Eventually those you are helping need to stand on their own!!
I would find out about her SSI, Medicare benefits, total money she has coming in monthly and find her a little house or a little apartment. Because of her resistance to go, I am sure you will have to do most of the work..but I bet you could find her a nice little place. =}

Dear 'busy', I do not understand [your response]…but, methinks that quite possibly that you do not understand which is not uncommon.
Have a better day—
Peace,
Enriched

I just love "self correct" on this machine.
It should read "the barrowers are delt with"

Sorry !

WOW EVERYONE!!!! What AWESOME ADVICE!!!! I am [also] an Adult Child of [2] Alcoholic Parents—my father deceased as a result. I am currently 'renting a room' from my mother [career change, MUCH less $$ but building!] who just stirred up a MAJOR hornet's nest re: my bi-polar sister [lives out of town—NO help $$ or otherwise…] who erratically takes her meds & chooses to consume alcohol w/them then drive to Dallas to TARGET/verbally/emotionally abuse me…]. Not to insert my problems here BUT I STRONGLY urge you to participate in Al-Anon meetings so that you may learn what your role is/is NOT & boundaries since [SADLY] this is an extremely codependent situation! Secure a sponsor or gather phone numbers from other participants so you have a 'lifeline/support' when it comes time [which it is…] to set your boundaries WHILE retaining your sanity & not succumbing to the guilt produced by the codependent/alcoholic/addictive [gambling] dynamics. I actually just opened my Al-Anon book called 'The Courage to Change' [GREAT RESOURCE!!!], reviewed my notes and ran across this…The Three C's—You did not CAUSE it, you cannot CURE it, and you cannot CONTROL it. All you can 'control' are your own choices. Next I'm calling/reaching out to my fave contact for a dose of sanity!!! My prayers are that you will put things in place so that you may do the same when needed! You might also check out the 'dysfunctional families/siblings' thread on this GODSEND of a site/resource!
Namasté—you are not alone in this!!!!
Peace,
Enriched

Bobby Blue, it's a tough thing, the situation. You are certainly not wrong in coming here to ask for advice, as the answers and the methods don't come easy.. Sometimes we have to bounce those things off other people in order to figure out what to do, exactly, and how to go about it. That's why we're all here, in the way of support. You obviously love your mother, or else you wouldn't have taken her in, in the first place. Although you didn't say, I would assume the reason you did was from being distraught over your father's passing, and that's a natural inclination, on either part. You are having to learn how to deal with her playing the guilt card. If your mother is co-dependent, she certainly doesn't have the tools for helping herself, and she's probably been using that guilt method for a very long time.. Looks like you will be having to "help" her live on her own, and I've no doubt you will find a way to go about it in a way that will help her grow, and not hurt her, so that she can stay independent. I finally have gotten to where, when my mother throws her guilt card, I just let it roll down my back. And I feel heartless sometimes, because i don't break down and cry with her, in reaction to her tears,, but I already did that and now it's time to buck up and move on. Life has changed for her, well, for both of us. I've accepted it, now mother has to accept it and move along. It has to be harder for her, emotionally, because she's the one who has lost control. Crying and falling prey to her guilt trips would only be a disservice to her at this point, but she doesn't know that. As children, we sometimes had to learn when to pull ourselves up by our bootstraps, and we took our ques from others, She will have to take her ques from you, now. My mother pulled a good one this morning. She refused to eat (after I'd given insulin, I might add) and all of her meds were slowly melting in her oatmeal. Medications that she couldn't afford to skip. I just had to be firm with her. It's hard for her to switch her mode of relating to me, I was the youngest, and she never really treated me like anything less than "the baby" of the family. The roles are reversed now, and as much as I don't prefer scolding, of any sort, her behavior prompts it, at times, even if in a very moderate way. As much as possible, I try to allow her her dignity. Doesn't always work out that way, though, just as we didn't always come out of learning childhood lessons, with dignity. In short, she has to learn who's boss. After she'd had her tantrum, I gave her the facts. She'd have to stop with the toddler antics and take her medications, or she'd have to go back to the emergency room, which she did not want to do. Then I sat down and fed her (she usually feeds herself, even if it's a mess when she's done), and gave her her meds. That's all she wanted, anyway. some attention. You might suggest, to your mom, that if she didn't act responsibly, someone else may have to take control of her finances for her... and maybe you should let her know that if she didn't, it may be misconstrued as being a little deficient, mentally, and someone would have to be appointed to manage her things. While you're at it, mention that if she continued to stay there, with you, then she would have to agree to let you manage her finances and she would get an allowance. My guess is that she isn't going to be too keen on that one. But, it gives her a choice, then the responsibility falls back on her. Just like a child, she has to be given choices and consequences. Good luck!

This crazy. Get to a shrink, for the best way to handle this. You need to get over guilt feelings. You don't love me, blah, blah. Enough is enough, you need to tell her to go, and back it up. It is one thing to caregive a helpless invalid, and another to enable bad behavior. I suggest a therapist, one who will help you with your immediate problem. They know just the right thing to say and do, and give you support to overcome your Mom's bullying.

Stop enabling her. Give her the ultimatum of either contributing financially or finding another place to live. Don't feel guilty! Your mother obviously doesn't feel guilty about using you to her own advantage! How is it your mother does not have medicare for health insurance, she is 67?

Why are you bearing the whole responsibility ? Don't do this- you are not
Joan of Arc. Discuss with your sibilings about alternative living arrangements with them equally. Remember she gave birth to you and your sibilings. Otherwise advise her with a deadline to find another place nearby all sibilings or within reach in case of assistance. Don't make the mistake everyone else makes and fell guilty ( I am on the last string on my rope right now in my situation ). also don't make the same mistake I made make your stand and stand by your convictions. GOOD LUCK.

Hello Bobby. This is a bit complicated. I feel
We are working with several "issues". I feel
That your mom needs help. While the
"shock treatment" will get her out, I am
Not sure if it could be the cure over all.
I believe she needs some counseling.
We need to get some issues solved soon,
Such as the health care, depending on
Her set up, she will already be penalized on
Part d. If you do not understand medicare/
Part d and medicare supplement, contact
Your local aging commission.
Overall, we need to help mom stand, gain
Strength, and walk on her own, so she can
Be independent.

Maybe with counseling with both mental and
Physical, and those who are narrowing
Are felt with, maybe we can get mom
To a place where both of you are happy.
If gambling is a major problem most states
Have a counseling program.

I have a feeling, that dispute all the current
Headaches, you would like to see your
Mom get the help she needs, and get over
All her coping methods that don't work,
And get to a place where both of you
Are happy.


I wish you well and good luck.