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We don’t have any children but if we did I would definitely tell them they are not to take me into their home, especially if I had dementia. My husband said every time your father sees me he tells me Richard is in a wheel chair now & I say that’s too bad. I asked my husband who’s Richard...he said I have no clue 😆
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
This made me smile!
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I doubt this will be an issue in my case. No one will be there to take care of me this I already know.
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Geaton777 Apr 2021
Pasa, in your case it is even more important to have a plan in place. Please invest in a consult with an elder law attorney. Sometimes they give a free initial consult. You will need to figure out the PoA issue. My BIL & SIL in AZ have no kids and no other siblings near them and they are working on this with an attorney.
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My children know that this house is just a shell.

Our family’s memories are not contained in a house. They are contained in our hearts and minds. We can see them in pictures. My girls know that I will NOT cling to the idea of staying in this place.

My mother is in MC Assisted Living. My local daughter knows that I would be more than happy to move over there when the time comes. It is lovely.

No way do I want EITHER of my daughters to have to take care of me 24/7 when my mind has left me.
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NeedHelpWithMom Apr 2021
What a wonderful description. It is only a shell. Ahhh...so true.
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I hate it too. It's hard. It's unrelenting. It's not at all satisfying. The repetition is mind blowing. The bathroom issues and convos - yuck. The complaining - OMG it's too much to listen to.

One of my daughters says no way re taking care of me. Other says yes. She has worked in an AL and knows the deal. BUT, I'm thinking NO. I don't want her to have to take care of me when I'm a difficult pain-in-the-a$$.

When we get older, we plan on downsizing. We already have wills, living wills, POAs and such in place. I would hate to ruin their lives like I feel like mine is. It's not "ruined" it's just hard and not fun.
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NeedHelpWithMom Apr 2021
It’s very hard and never gets easier.

I have been there. I feel for you and hope you find relief somehow.

My mom is in a hospice house which is difficult too.

Still, the people who care for loved ones daily have it the worst.

Take care.
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In my case, I told my daughters when they said to me, “When you get old we will take care of you like you did with grandma.”

The very first thing I said back to them is, “No, you won’t! Thanks, but no thanks. I want you to live your life for you, not me.”

They were surprised at first. Then they both said, “Thank you, Mom.”

I remember hearing other posters saying that they never felt a responsibility to care for their mom because they didn’t care for their moms. Those moms set the right example for their children.

I think the best way to prevent the cycle repeated is to show our children that our parents will be just fine in a facility.

If possible, never take them in. If that isn’t possible and sometimes it’s not due to extenuating circumstances, then put a time limit on how long they live in your home.

Please don’t leave your own home to be with your parents. Most people regret doing this. Again, if it is necessary to this, put a cap on the amount of time that you will stay.

This isn’t ‘The Waltons.’ That was a television show!

Any other television show that makes it look like ‘one big happy family’ is hogwash! It’s stressful and very often ruins the family dynamics. Sometimes there isn’t even a strong foundation to begin with so you can be sure that the relationship will crumble.

Plus this business of them raising you is a crock! They had to raise you. That’s a parent’s job. Otherwise, it’s neglect and abandonment, in which case they don’t deserve you now sacrificing your life for theirs.

My cousin calls her mom on Mother’s Day and Father’s Day to wish a her mom a happy Mother’s Day and happy Father’s Day because her mom raised her alone! I love that she is so very grateful to her mom.

Her dad wishes to be in her life but she says that he is a stranger to her. I understand how she feels this way.
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babsjvd Apr 2021
Love the waltons analogy!
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I have told my girls that I don't expect them to physically care for me but I do expect them to visit and make me part of their lives. I don't want to be forgotten like my Mom was. I am responsible for my socialization. I am responsible for my happiness.

Eventually, we are going to have to downsize. My husband is not going to be able to continue to do the up keep. I already dread when I need to clean an 8 room house so downsizing will be nice. But will probably hang in there until grandson is older.

As said, get all your paperwork in order. I have all mine in a filing cabinet. I am about ready to reorganize that with notes or what is what and who to call. Get rid of what you don't need or have not used in years. I have been doing this for a while. If not for DH, I could get rid of lots more. That means that China u never use. That punch bowl with 12 cups that was grandma's. Believe me, your kids probably don't want it. I have girls and they don't want any of my stuff.

What always bothered me is "we want to keep Mom in her house as long as possible" and those Ads for reversed mortgages. "So you can stay in your home". To me when it comes to needing a reversed mortgage, time to sell because you can't afford the house any longer. When a spouse dies, so does the money they brought in. This usually effects the woman because the husband made more money. The pension gets cut and so does the SS. I so wish I had talked Mom into selling her house when Dad died and move to an apartment. Her money went into a money pit. There comes a time when staying in your home is not feasible. We need to keep an open mind to changes. Not just how it effects us, but how it effects others. We can't expect our children who have jobs and families of their own to be able to mow our lawn, be Caregivers, ect. So we do what we can for ourselves. Seek out resources. Know when staying in our home is just too much and time to move on. And hopefully we can put some money aside.
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One component is not getting so hellbent about staying in a particular house. So many issues could be avoided if people wouldn’t get so house hung up and realize a home can be anywhere. When a different living arrangement would make more sense, let’s all go for it
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You're trying to deny the reality that life is a cycle with ups and downs that every single person experiences. That's why marriage vows have "for better or for worse, in sickness and in health" in them. Life gives you the good and the bad.

If you don't want your child to experience it, be sure to have plenty of money in the bank to pay for nursing home care, move into one before you need it, and don't go on any medications when you start developing health problems. You'll die more naturally and much faster.
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
I LOVE this idea re: no meds. That's very wise. I saw one relative cling and cling and cling to life, and it was frankly preposterous after a decade. You're SO right!
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Never did I think my healthy and very independent mom would need the kind of care she needs. She was on no medications - lived on her own - ran her own business and has been fiercely independent since she was 17 years old and left home and then became a single mother in her mid 20s after booting an alcoholic husband. She had a small retirement (which has literally been a lifesaver for me to help supply her needs).
She was 100% proactive in her own health - and even a month before her stroke had just had all her arteries checked and was cleared.
Life happens - bad things happen and they are totally out of our control. Because she lived alone - she was alone when she had her stroke - the clot traveled too long and it was considered a massive stroke. She was just shy of 72 bday - she will now need care for the rest of her life - in a country that isn’t prepared to provide quality places for her type of disabilities.
That has make me -the now 49 year old daughter think about my own as well as my husbands future care.
To be honest - I cannot wrap my head around it yet. I don’t want to put this on anyone I love to do alone either - but I also realize I need to figure out who will fight as hard as I have had to fight if this happens to me.
My husband and I don’t have children - we were the people who took in other people’s kids lol. Scary to think either of us would be sent to a very broken system if our outcome was anything like my moms. Assisted living and memory care places are great fits for some - but they are not a great fit for someone like my mom.
Gosh just what it takes to recognize UTIs (the cognitive decline and strange behaviors) and how to treat them carefully without severe side effects and how to find time in the day to mobilize and immobile person - the baths and hoyering and changing etc etc eats up an entire day. Getting to an appointment is like a entire day for a dr to see you for 15 minutes. So I don’t know the answer this to this question yet - I’m still after 2 years trying to figure it out.
I do know 100% that the care my mother requires and the quality of life she deserves doesn’t appear to exist in my area - but I have not given up - I hope to find the answer and until then I just keep going :).
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
Yes, yes, yes, yes! EXACTLY what I'm thinking about. Wow. So true.
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I'm an only child managing care for 4 seniors (and one who is now deceased). I've seen a lot (and yet not as much as so many others on this forum): from dealing with Medicaid, social services, unsafe discharges from the ER, guardianship, ending driving privileges, elderly drug addiction, hospice, etc. I chose to involve my then teenaged sons in some of the help so they can have an understanding of what happens when you age, what happens when you don't plan, what happens if you think you unrealistically will never have decline or dementia.

They know me and my husband have PoAs in place (and they know it is them and what the duties are, when the duties kick in and that we in no way want any bickering over our affairs). We have Living Wills (so that no one need make the awful ending of life decision themselves); we have Last Wills (and they already know we have a trust which should be spent on good qualify care for us and whatever is left over will be split 3 ways equally). They have a "working" understanding of how the law works in terms of who can make decisions for another and when. They know in no uncertain terms that they are not to move us into their homes when we seem needy nor orbit around us pretending we are "independent" in our home. They have, first hand, seen the signs of dementia, what a UTI looks like in the elderly, Parkinsons, and the impact of denial and stubbornness. They at least have an idea of when to legally intervene.

The second half of this plan is for me and my husband to be realistic and move ourselves into an appropriate community BEFORE a crisis, BEFORE we "think" we need it, so we get to make the decision while in our right minds and do all (or as much) of that work as possible. Few individuals are able to acknowledge, and then act, when they sense cognitive decline has slipped into themselves, and my sons also know this. So I guess giving your child knowledge and wisdom about what will probably happen is what needs to happen. This way she isn't blind-sided. I would also impress on her that she is NOT your "caregiving plan". She can surely be your helper and manager but not your hands-on daily caregiver. My own mother lives in a small house next to mine and is still mostly independent at 91. My husband and I are not retired and don't plan to be for another few years. I've had the discussion with her that when her care becomes too much for me, she will need to go to the very nice facility where my MIL also is, 3 miles from my house. As my mom's short-term memory erodes, I'm not sure that she will even remember this discussion or like this plan, but we DID discuss it, she DID agree and that's all my conscience needs. So, even if your finances are not stellar, there are still solutions of which you should make your daughter aware for your care, even if it means Medicaid. My MIL is in LTC in a very nice facility as a Medicaid resident. She receives the same care and attention as the private payers. She is even in a private room. She is with people all day and doing better than I think she would cloistered away in a private home. And my husband and I have our lives. I am not judging anyone who wishes to provide hands-on in-home care for their LOs. But it should never come at the cost of their own well-being or future. What would be the point of that? I wish you much wisdom and peace in your heart as you move through your caregiving.
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
You're so right. My wealthier mom and her husband set this up for my brothers and me when they were in their early 60s. My poor biological father and his wife did not, and they are the ones whose care is so heavy on my life right now. (I'm their only child, and I never knew them growing up) Next time I can get my daughter to sit still for a few minutes, I'm going to tell her what I do/don't require or want her to do; I'll also write it down, hand it to her, notarize it, whatever it takes. No one should have to do this all alone for their elders. Because of geography, I too now have four elders on my shoulders (the fifth recently died) and I just cannot imagine how thoughtless it is to do this to someone else. The irony is that my father and his wife had the experience of doing this for my great grandma and for my grandpa, so they KNEW, but they foolishly blew through all their money in their 60s, thinking their ship would come in any minute. SO helpful. Thank you sincerely.
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This hits me hard...between my mother and my husbands parents we are spending our 50s being guilted into doing things that our parents DID NOT DO for their own parents they were busy going on cruises and vacations in their 50s not doing a darn thing to help their senior parents. Were spending our empty nest years doing what they just dont want to do for their self anymore ( but thats work and were retired they say) Resentment is a daily struggle every single day now. I resent wasting my 50s taking care of people who are going to die in this house but don't do a dam thing for that house they plan on dying in. Ill probably get ridiculed for saying this..but from my personal experience seniors now days are as selfish as I've ever seen ...every single day its me me me me me but what about me.....I will NEVER do this to my children. I didn't have children so they could "take care of me one day ".
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
Heck YEAH! I swear my biological father pretends to be way more helpless than he is. He gave me a brochure that had the name of a doctor he wanted to see circled on it. I said, "Why don't you call him? I don't control your schedule." I re-wrote that doctor's phone number in huge red marker. I handed it back. A week later, he handed it back and said, "I looked him up on Yelp and he's the one I want to see." OK, I said, did you make an appointment. He said, "No, because he's too far from here." I said, "This brochure has 14 doctors on it who all do the same thing. Just call a closer one then!" He replied that it was "too much work" to look them all up and see if they were "any good." So I just decided then and there, tough luck then. You complain every single day that you're dizzy. Five GPs have told you to see a neuro-specialist and one of them gave you this brochure. You don't do it? I'll set up an appointment with crematorium now... Seriously! Just like do it, man. You manage to call anyone else (like me!) and talk your freakin' head off daily. I'm not stepping in. I'm not your f/t assistant.
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Isn't there a scheme some people use to live permanently on cruise ships? That could be fun.
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notgoodenough Apr 2021
I could age in place on a cruise ship, Zippy!
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I love this discussion and glad you brought it up. I am youngest female in the family. My mother and sister are passed away now. My sister was 12 years older than me, and her generation was really different than mine. She came of age in the 50s and me in the 60s. Big difference. Anyway, I feel I have learned a lot going through their aging and care in their final days. I will not be like them. I will never, ever burden my children with my care in any way if I can help it. My husband and I have planned ahead so we hopefully have enough until the ends of our lives. I actually told my one daughter that when I get old and hard to deal with, that if it becomes necessary to put me in a home, then go on with her life and visit only when she feels like it, even if it's not at all. Of course, she said, "Mom, I'm not going to do that!" But that's what I want, actually. I don't want to be the mother or sister that someone dreads "having" to go visit. I have a rather solitary personality so I'm okay with being alone, if it means not annoying my children or grandchildren. I'll be fine. We enter the world alone; we exit it alone.
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
You are my soul sister with the same attitude, OldAlto.
My daughter, 28, continues to believe she'll just tuck me into a "grandma flat" in her basement someday, but 1) she has no idea how awful my own life is right now caring for our elders and 2) I would NEVER like to live with her, even when I'm old, because it's such a burden on the young.

xoxox
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The most important thing is make sure you have finances in order. Everything is much easier without financial struggles in play.
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notgoodenough Apr 2021
You are so right, finances are key!

My mom had the means to private pay for care in a facility, as well as a LTC policy. Whatever else I might have gone through, it was a huge relief to know that finances were not an issue. When she needed things, I could just buy them; we had it worked out that if I started to experience financial strain from not being able to work because I had to take care of her, she would pay me. It took a lot of stress out of the situation.

The issue as I see it is that "our" generation isn't going to have the financial resources that our parents had. So it's going to take some serious financial planning to ensure our kids don't end up in the situation we find ourselves in. My husband and I are currently shopping around (with the aid of a financial planner) for LTC policies...and I have to say, being on this site has helped me know the "right" questions to ask: such as, does this policy mandate that a qualified facility have 24/7 RN on duty (thanks, Alva!); is there a continuum of care; will the policy pay directly, or do I have to pay out of pocket and then wait for reimbursement; what's the top amounts they will pay out; etc.

I sure don't want my kids "stuck" where they have to put their lives and their families lives on hold to take care of me and hubby because we were flippant with our future care plans!
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I’ve picked out my Assisted Living, and TOLD my kids that it’s where I want to go.

I love the house where my husband and I live now, but certainly NOT ENOUGH to saddle my children with trying to keep me here.

I will hopefully remain healthy long enough to see my grandchildren approach adulthood, but I leave the choice of visiting OR NOT, to them. I CHOSE to do what I did for those who depended on me, but my PERSONAL INDEPENDENCE is too important to ME to depend on them.

I’ve told them that if my personal situation indicates that I’m not connecting cognitively, they are to DISREGARD my complaints and insults and tears, and I MEAN IT. They have known me as a loving and supporting parent, and I want THAT MEMORY to be the one that lasts.

My “departure service” will be preplanned and paid for.

If anything else occurs to me while I’m still mentally competent, I’ll incorporate it into my “declining” plans.

I love them dearly, and I’ll do ALL I can to spare them.

Of course, all of my legal responsibilities are in place.
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
Brilliant and inspiring, Ann.
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Just make sure that you have all your medical paperwork in order, like both POA's(medical and durable), Living Will(advance directive), an actual Will, and either a POLST or DNR.
And then make sure your loved ones know and understand exactly what you want and don't want, regarding your care. If things are made clear, there should be no issues in carrying out a persons wishes.
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MountainMoose Apr 2021
I also recommend:
- A living trust. I have a living trust where my bank's Trust department takes over if I'm physically and/or mentally incapacitated. My trust department's representative instructed me to put everything possible into the trust so the department can take care of it should I become incapacitated (and act as successor trustee when I die). My dogs and household goods are included too.
- A Specific Durable POA for "stuff" so those items that can't or shouldn't be in the living trust like vehicles or an IRA account and other accounts like the power company and phone company. (The trust department CAN ONLY handle things in the trust.) So, if I deteriorate mentally, my friend is my Agent and has the authority to take care of non-living trust stuff like selling my car to collect the proceeds for my care.
- A General Durable POA as a over-arching device in case I miss something that hopefully an agency will accept.
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As a single adult caregiver who has no kids, I think about how I am going to deal with end-of-life without having kids. I have watched my parents not make moves into living situations that allow them to be more functional as the years pass and I think that if I can at all afford it, I will move into one of those developments that allow you to go from independent senior living all the way to nursing home in the same development. It feels like one of the tricks to aging without dependence on kids is (1) making the assumption that you WILL live until an age when you're completely incapacitated and (2) making decisions when much younger (like late 60s) that will put you in circumstances where the kids will not have to make housing/feeding decisions as much.

Just my two, possibly useless, cents.
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SeniorStruggles Apr 2021
A lovely thought and I don't know your situation, of course, but those places start at $750,000 - basically, your entire life savings.
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