Looking for answers not put downs.

So yes, this is LONG, and I thank all of you that care to take the time to try to assist me, and I believe that I have tried to put all of the background in there, and it is very hard when you have adult children, and there is 31 years.

The issues that are of concern for his father and I are this. First off, yes, his father is remarried and so am I. It has been of mutual consent that because of our son's issues that his father and I do communicate, and we have forgiven each other or I forgave him, and then the forgiveness came flooding in. That was years ago. There are things that parents know and that adult children know. I do not see any harm in speaking with his father, and what it is proving, is that this child unfortunately needs much more assistance that either of us can give him. His father has tried the soft approach, the medium approach and the whatever approach. It is all about look at me, my rights, I have been violated because you divorced mother. But none of his conversations when he is talking with his father involve the complete in my opinion verbal abuse he is trying to put on me. He knows full well I was a full time, never took one day off working mom until he was a young man. I was working full time for a while, and juggling caring for my parents and their medical needs, and trying to do that all, etc. But I do understand very clearly adult children do not understand that. My son (other son) stated, mom, we do not see really what you are doing. We hear about it, but we really do not have a total concept about it, until it hits us. Then he mentioned something and I cannot claim if this is true or not. He said, my brother and his wife have had their life paid for by her parents. Which if true, is exactly what he expected from his life. To get a free ride. I do not in any way say that with negative, but just sort of follows along with the concept of what his father said that he would always find the vacations between he and I that were the most fun, the most expensive, and wow, that has an impact on me just hearing that. I do not know if that is true, but it falls in line with the fact that when he was 16, and I paid a gross amount of $500 a month for car insurance, surely people I did not know my boundaries then. Why oh why would I do that. Simply I say that is my fault, lack of knowledge as to what the normal cost of auto was, as I too was a wife, that my husband took care of all of that, and I was then in a world where it was all my responsibility. Therefore, when they say parents make mistakes, that was one huge mistake that only took one month of learning real fast. Of course, the son wants you to pay it and will tell you all the reasons why, but what we are getting at here people is this.

We all need to live in the here and now. I believe that if there is an adult child of mine that wants to know about the past, they should be polite, not argumentative, and certainly not make me feel like I am not worth talking too. He has seen all of the 15 letters of reference, and all of the Care giver of the year for one Assisted Living Facility for the last two years, I do not know what he wants, and I am not about to sit there and show anyone my positives, because I believe that if people really love you and want to know about you, they will find this information on the internet.

Thank you all for allowing me to calmly say, "hey what is the deal going on" I feel very normal, extremely happy and I have a son that reappeared from the woodwork, and yes in a way I am glad, but I am not about to be run down by anyone, regardless of if it is my son. If I have done anything that has offended him, I would always be the first to apologize, and I did a very smart thing while raising my boys and that was keeping a journal, so i have all the happy days which there were many, and some of the harder days all on pen and paper, and it really is a life where a family is simply trying to make ends meet in America.

Of course it has been a comment in my life from my ex husband and others that it appears he likes or makes a point of finding people with money. In fact, I have a very modest 2008 subaru, and in 2008 when it was brand new, I let me drive it as that was one of the last dinners we had alone together and he said 'when are you going to give this to me'. I do not know if he was joking, but I do not think he was. I believe he was seeing in his school that everyone or all of the kid he hung around with, their parents did purchase them a bmw, or something like that, sorry, not me. I was raised to earn your money and pay cash for your car. I am 55, not that old, and I remember how proud I was when I paid $3,000 for my brand new Chevy Nova. There was a sense of real ownership and I was very proud of that.

So thanks to all of you for any ideas, suggestions, or kind comments you can give me.

Know that I have sought counseling, I have gone to our community counselors, I have gone to private counselors, and he would walk out, when he did not like why he was hearing, and I have done just about everything to figure out what makes my child work and why life or his past life makes him angry. If it is me, what, and why? What have I done specifically that has made him angry. Working, well working allowed me to get him a job where I was working when he was 16 for $8.50 per hour. That is pretty darn good. But quickly I learned that it wasn't the work that he wanted it was the paycheck, and it was a lesson for me and for his father. All along until this day we continue to try and figure this out. Not to label him, or give him anything but love and an open door. Possibly in 10 years, when he has matured or is ready to talk he will, I do not know, but I have been told by more than one person friend psychologist, pediatrician, social worker, that much of this is about "what he perceives as his reality from his childhood" that is something that happens when children cannot handle what is going on so they create. I am not stating he is lying, I am stating I get it, I get it that I created a false reality when my mother was drunk, but my mother had a substance abuse issue, that is not her the facts here, and I have had to unfortunately do everything in my life to protect myself from my son, because I do believe unfortunately he is a fighter and would do anything to try and hurt me.

Thank you for trying to understand and more over thank you for listening to me. The mother, whom very much loves both of her children and as my younger one and I sat on the phone for hours, and here he was saying to me, which i told him is not his responsibility, but he said, he has a choice mom. He has not chosen that you only have one father and one mother in this life time, and we have had it pretty good, yes there were some times that were very difficult, but in life if everything is easy, then we have not learned to really live. Those things that were hard were more about homework, and the school demands, and the demands of college and the demands of having a full time job, which when he was married he did not for two years. I have not asked nor is it my place to ask anything about that. One thing as a mother of two adult boys, I have learned that they come to you. They really do. If they do not know that you have done the very best you have, and if you can morally look at yourself in the mirror and know that you are a very good person congratulations.

By the way, I am continuing to be in better health for those that know I got bad caregiver burnout, and have loving families with little children that just adore me, and I adore them back. It produces a love that I cannot even explain.


Blessings to all and a very Happy Valentines Day.

I do feel i wrote without the anger and the intenseness, and I know that that is probably because I had a procedure at the hospital 2 days ago and am 95 percent sure that what has been plaguing me collagenous colitis is disappearing. It is not fun, and was a horrible situation, but it is over. Thanks and all please have a happy peaceful day and remember. "life is a journey, not a race"

This was long, and I sincerely apologize for the typographical errors.

It sounds like you have a mentally ill child. That is very, very sad. It is Not Your Fault. I know you would cure him if you could. That is not within your power. You are willing to go to counseling with him. You can't make him go.

Stop being defensive. You don't owe anyone, especially someone who really does not want to listen, explanations of every thing you've done in your life. Discuss all the details with a therapist if you like, but don't feel you have to defend yourself for who you are.

Let your mentally ill son know that you are available if he wants to see you or talk to you, but you are not interested in qualifying on his terms. You are satisfied with your life. He doesn't have to be.

My heart truly hurts for you. Mental illness is a real tragedy.

I'm glad that your health is better. There are two passages in your post that I believe you mean as quotes from your son's email. Are THEY BOTH quotes, or is the first one a quote and the second an interpretation of what YOU think he's saying?

If your son wrote, as it says in the second quote, that you haven't made anything of yourself, then I wouldn't give him the time of day.

BUT, If that's your interpretation of his actual quote in the first letter, then it looks to me as though he's attempting an intervention, perhaps to get you to take better care of all aspects of your health, mental and physical. That's my two cents.

Glad you are better.

If that second email is verbatim, which re-reading your post, it seems to be, I agree with Jeanne.

Jeanne Gibbs
Where am I being defensive
I typed or copied and pasted two different versions of what he typed to me.
This are his words.

This is not being defensive.
I have long given up,
just wanted to ask aging care if they had any other suggestions.

Where in that incredibly long email am I defensive.

I could have been black and white this is what it is like.

I have talked to a therapist ten years ago. They stated, to remember that each child is different, and this one, is very defensive for some reason and at that we do not know.

I have to look and see what I typed as he sent it to me twice once in upper caps and once in lower caps, and I did not review word for word, but saw they were about the same in content.

I do not have time for anyone doing this to me. And have such a beautiful life, why oh why would I want to spend time on this. Because I believe that aging care.com there are people that will be honest, captain, etc. There are some that are too honest, and honestly can kill. I have already been hurt, and need no more hurt by my son's issues, that is why I so delicately but if you are willing to give advice.

All I have done is expressed to aging care.com all I want them to know no one else. I know who I am, I don't need the world to know. The three families I am helping are so incredibly grateful for me, that is all that matters.

Of course and my loving parents, and my wonderful husband and glorious younger son. They mean the world to me, and always will.

It is easier to go outside of family to discuss these issues, because family or my family it would be tough. mom and dad cannot communicate, and my 26 year old so is doing really well and doesn't need the baggage of his brothers actions.

I believe Jeanne was saying that you don't owe us (or your son) long explanations of what you did and why. That's called being defensive. When you simply say "I was the best mother I was able to be", that's not being defensive. Best of luck to you.

These are from two different emails my son sent, one quote is on the Feburary 10, 2015, and the other is from January 31, 2015. It is apparent, that he is very frustrated, that is my error, as I thought I was copying the same paragraph. I did not want to disclose the entire letter as I do like some privacy and the rest of the letter was nothing more than the people that he wanted to be with him when he went to verbally attack his mother for whatever sad reason. That would have never happened though. Ever… Trust me…

Jeane you are right, I do not owe one person one answer. I was trying to give aging care an answer because I was giving questions that were not full of content so this time I try to and if I am defensive, I need to work on that, that is never my intent.

true babalou. i still can learn many things in life.

perhaps to get you to take better care of all aspects of your health, mental and physical. That's my two cents.

Regarding this, thanks for only wishing. I have almost died from a deadly colitis disease that I got from an elderly client. my son hasn't seen me nor has cared to since 2008. He only came around because I had his baby clothes and he had a baby, and the nice in me decided that maybe he would come around.

Mental Illness is a disease, It does not come around, it manifests and hurts and destroys. It will take a lifetime of people figuring that out to make it work.

A therapist years ago, stated to start my own care business, and really care and love those like my own family. It truly has been the best therapy for me, and I love what I do.

As for my son caring, no, sorry, I am a realist, that is not true, I have good friends that really care, and really have been caring about me, and my lovely husband that truly literally saved my life. I will never regret me loving my client though. She deserved all of the love I had to give her. Always forever.

My will is all made out.

My conscious is free. I have done the absolute best I can, and am continuing to love little one's when there mother's and father's are busy working. My goal is to give back to the community, and I am doing that with complete true love and pleasure

I have not been able to see my grandchild because he will not give me his address. My poor son I asked him because I thought he was going to see him, to give him my granddaughter's gifts. Never will I put my son in that position ever. Not even a thank you.
I believe my son is a paranoid schizophrenic. (I have two degrees psychology and abnormal) which just means I have knowledge very limited). He has a great degree of interest in self gratification, and what is in it for him. But I do not know. I just let him go eight years ago when he was brutal to me and his father witnessed it, and it got ugly, as his father protected me. that was the last.

My poor other son (younger son)

FYI.. Two days ago when I was in the Hospital. I am 55, and the Chief of medicine stated that other than the one issue that I had past tense, I have the body physically of a 40 year old woman. I don't know how, but like I have said, I never have drank smoke or took prescriptions or ones that are bad for you I take Vitamin D. etc. and have always led a very clean life. I was a figure skater from age 7 to 19, and have always had a happy life. I made poor judgement choices in partners, but like I said in life, we all have a few hard knocks it is how we choose to move foreword from them.

Livelifefull, I didn't mean "Stop being defensive" as a criticism. I meant it as advice. You do not owe anyone, especially a mentally ill person who refuses to hear you, an explanation.

If your son said, "It has been eight years. Why haven't you learned Hungarian? And I need proof that you haven't purchased any food that I am allergic to in those years before I'll see you," you would immediately recognize this as his illness talking and (I hope) you would not feel you had to defend yourself from not doing these things. When someone expects irrational things of you, you can't satisfy them with rational reasons.

I am very sorry your son is mentally ill. Especially now that he is a father I hope he gets some medical help. Maybe his new wife will help in that regard. But his condition is not your fault and you do not need to defend yourself regarding it.

This is NOT a put down.

You are hurting so much all over its like you are one big open wound and almost anything can hurt.

But truly, you are not only defensive, but you are defensive about being defensive!

And you know what? In a society that is so focused on the ideas that perfect parents can prevent all problems and anything wrong with your kid must be your fault - I find that completely and totally normal and understandable under the circumstances.

If I remember you got a smattering of impractical suggestions, most of which you had thought of already, and maybe a couple OK ones, and a lot of people agreeing with you completely that it is not your fault and never your intention that one son should become alienated from you. Estrangement is one of the most painful words in the the English language and you HURT from it. We can see that and empathize deeply...and it seems your son, whatever his specific diagnosis may be, is a bundle of imagined hurts that protect him from the pain of his own condition. Get help in stopping all the little voices inside you that are still trying to tell you this terribly painful situation is your fault and you should just keep trying to hit your head on the wall of trying to fix it. There may not be a fix for this one in this lifetime, or a miracle may occur, and somehow you have to heal from whatever had already happened as best you can either way.

i just endured about a 4 yr stretch without seeing my g kids because my son was too busy with his own life to even answer an occasional email . i finally decided he had every right to pursue his own life and left him alone . the son crashed hard in a divorce ( many of us have ) and has invited me back into his life . im real happy about that but the g kids now live in fla with their mother , im in central indiana , bob is in chicago . im not a bit worried about the g kids being so far away . they grow up so quickly that its just a matter of time that one of them may knock on my door . the relationship is etched in stone , they know theres a soft landing spot in central indiana should they ever need it . ditto with both my sons . they couldnt fly so high with such boldness without the shack in the hills of central indiana to cushion their possible fall .
i hope that makes sense . im getting old and vulnerable but i put all my eggs in one basket then guarded that basket with everything i have . my sons are free to fly but they can come home at any time , smash a hole thru the wall and build themselves a room on .
my youngest son and i are extremely close -- but we hardly ever communicate . its ok . hes living his life and im living mine .
i think youre giving your son too much power over you .
i had to attend 26 weeks of anger mgmt 15 yrs ago during my divorce . dam right i was angry . i asked the class teacher one evening how to deal with a SO who passively - aggressively knew which buttons to push to make your blood boil . he explained that those buttons belong to me and i had to control them , not allow someone else to . great answer , great class , great teacher and the best 520 bucks i ever spent . its hard to piss me off nowadays . im easily annoyed but ill hide it until your brain breaks .

pia is killing my aunt and i right now . edna and i really need each other but if edna died tomorrow i wouldnt even send pia a ' last word ' email . not gonna happen . these buttons belong to me and altho shes pushing the right ones , theres no audible effect -- shes wasting her time . edna is no dummy , she knows pia is seething .
lol . to quote aerosmith , pia is getting " screams of no reply ".

I think your son is mentally ill. I'd add comments about emails in general. I don't like them.

Live life full, you might be better off to end the emails, they are so hurtful. You get on with your own life of helping others. Let him sort out his anger on his own, he's a grown man. Give him to another angel and let it go until you are healed.

I'm sorry for what you're going thru with your son. But when reading your story I thought I was reading my life with my SON. I haven seen and spoken to my son in 4 years, for the first year he will text me only on my birthday, Mother's Day, Christmas and New Years but then the text stop all together. And last night I was speaking to my husband about WHAT I DID WRONG? But my son always wanted more and wanted what all his friend had. But we did our best and gave all our kids what we could. Some time my husband wouldn't pay our house mortgage to buy them what they wanted specially him. He had a baby and had his own apartment with his girlfriend. Once his baby was born his girlfriend stop working to attent to there new baby, then money started to be thight and one day he told one of my daughters that he WOULD NEVER ASK US FOR NOTHING! Well the next day he said that he asked us if he and his new baby and girlfriend could move in with us so they can save money so they can get back on there feet. So of course we HELP HIM! Then he stayed with us for two years and the only thing he had to help us with was to pay the utilities, but he wasn't doing a good job on paying the utilities. Well after two years of living with us his girlfriend left him with the baby and then the timing was bad for him because we had to move from that house and we're going to down size because my husband had surgery and I wasn't working, so we help him move all his stuff to a really cheap place but it was just for him because he move to far from us and he couldn't bring the baby so I could babysit the baby, so the baby went back to his mom. So after paying for him to move to his new place he didn't want know or talk to us any more and up to this day we don't know why? I'm sorry you're going thru this but I don't think we did anything wrong bring up our children but there expectetions were to high and unrealistic. I always say we all have choices and as an adult he made his and I think he blame us for his life not been the way he wanted but not because we didn't help or put him thru private schooling so he will have a good job. But he choice to live in a bad area and work in a Mall she's a 30 some year old working at Mall. We did our best and that all I can say to you and my self.