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I have Durable POA and could step in if need be. My dad is 90. He keeps reading info on the internet and fears that he and my mom's money will be taken from them. So he's looking for a safe to keep all their money in the house. OR he's looking for switching all the money into Swiss money -- or gold. Aagh!!! He is a very brilliant man who has lost the ability to do everything that gave him purpose in life (fixing everything that needed fixing in the home, teaching, etc.). So this is his way of "being in control." All that this does is cause friction between my mom and dad, and I can't help him listen to reason.
He was tested for balance issues by his neurologist about 8 months ago (CAT scans, but not MRI) and was found to be clear of Alzheimer's. But I realize that can change at any time.
I feel like I'm having to be marriage counselor as well as caregiver to both of them. When is the point that I need to take financial decisions away from him?

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If you notice changes in your dad's cognitive functions, then he needs to see his physician. Keep a list of changes you see. As far as money goes, set him up with an elder law attorney, they will be able to discuss ways to 'protect' his assets. This may be a relief to him. On the other hand, if he has some dementia he may just be obsessed with money. My grandma thought she had something in her throat and wouldn't eat when she developed dementia; nothing wrong with her throat. I see people with dementia who fixate on something specific. Reassure your dad & continue to offer your support and assistance. When was his last checkup? If he hasn't been recently, he probably should go. You can contact the doctor ahead of time and let him/her know what symptoms you are seeing and express your concerns. Good luck
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Samara, families have worked hard to earn and save that $1M+, and this amount doesn't buy what it did years ago. Various kinds of taxes have been paid along the way. Even if we wanted to use it (which I don't) to pay down the $18T debt, I doubt we could even come close to doing so. If every man, woman, and child contributed to pay this debt, it would come to nearly $60K for each. Sorry, but with what I've diligently saved through hard work and sacrifice, and what I expect to inherit from my parents who also did likewise, I'll be able to live securely (not exorbitantly) in retirement. Having $1M or even $2M is not really being "rich" anymore. Therefore, I believe the $5M figure is a more suitable exemption point in this day and age.
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We are getting too many politics in the answers now. It goes back to the basics....convince Dad to set up a one hr consult with an elder care attorney for some advice on setting up a trust, so that both parents are protected when one of them needs more medical/long term care of some kind. Attorney will help him and Mom if she's able to understand, that having a POA, Healthcare directives, living will and trust set up ahead of time is well worth the money spent to safe guard assets and assure YOU have a helper from their firm when it comes to going through down the road Medicaid, VA applications for further assistance.

That is where you start to safeguard assets. If he wants some money in gold, there are MANY legitimate advisors out there who are warning against banks (put the cash he needs immediate access to in a credit union) and who also recommend that 10 to 25% of investment assets be in gold in one way or another. Gold is also not looked as a way to make money, but as a way to protect assets and have tradable assets should everything fail. The world wide situation is NOT good...no matter the politics. And our government is NOT necessarily the sweet little wonderful organization that most average Americans think it is. All countries are in a downward spiral economically and all countries, including ours, are playing dirty games, trying to keep their countries above water. WE, in America, have more to lose because as soon as we lose the dollar as the recognized world currency, we can no longer print money freely to keep the numbers looking good. So from that perspective, our country is really a little more desperate than many of the others. And there IS a big push to force a change to which country control the world currency and a big push to drive the dollar down. It's all evil. It's all dirty. And it doesn't really matter the politics or 'sides' in this matter. Very few are trying to fix anything in a moral, ethical manner. You have to safe guard your own little part of the world where ever you are! And, for many of us, get a lot closer to GOD.
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Charmin: Things have been volatile since 2008 but you may wish to acknowledge to your dad that there have always been fear mongers to add panic to our lives. Explain that he has been on this earth long enough to know and hasn't fallen prey to this hype before? It's usually when they stop telling us things are going to crash that they do.
Fear seems to become more real and threatening when we age and are more vulnerable. If you can empathize with his concerns and tackle the finances together (possibly with some trustworthy assistance) then his fears will be diminished. I would suggest not allowing him to watch FOX news as they are the ultimate fear mongers.
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It sounds awful to think of estates worth "only" a million would be taxed, but the country is like 18 trillion in debt. Its gotta be paid back, somehow. I would love to have a family farm to inherit, even if you have to take out a loan to pay the tax. If youre an unfortunate non-land owner, you can't go out and buy that farm for a mere $500, 000. Farmland is precious and getting scarcer all the time, its doing better than gold.
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There is no difference in the two party bank controlled system. The proof is nothing changes when there is a regime change. Our current occupier, Pulitzer Peace Prize winner ran on the campaign promise to know out the neocon military war complex under Bush and now brags that he is good at killing people with drones.
80% of the people hit by washingtons drone strikes are civilians but yet they expect us to believe that the recent terror attacks in France are because of a cartoon. That new Common Core curriculum seems to be working just as planned. : /
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Pan, since Republicans are presently the majority lawmakers and therefore make the rules regarding taxes on estates, and perhaps you fear the government (the Republicans--by definition) will raise our taxes, perhaps you should vote Democratic to save all but the TOO RICH with estates that normal people don't worry about ever having because they will never have that kind of wealth.
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Babalou Im not trying to be argumentative but do believe that knowledge is power. Since you brought up the MSM I would like to give an example of what is going on in France this morning.
Do you not find the timing of this a bit curious? Washington gets caught dropping weapons to ISIS for the second time (the first was claimed to be a mistake) and McCain is caught crossing the border illegally for a pow wow with them, Hollande announces that all sanctions should be dropped against Russia and 2 days later we have a terrorist attack based on another social media cartoon. The 18 year old they claimed was with them has stepped up and said I have wittnesses that I wasnt even near Paris at the time.
Im watching the news and they seem to think that we should believe that it takes 4 helicopters, 100 armored military vehicles and 2000 heavily armed men to secure 2 men?
Theatrics! This is why the French people are flying signs saying "Not afraid" Most understand that this is meant to instill fear and arent buying it any more.
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Please go back and reread my post.
"Babalou, they are trying to drop that to 1 mill. " (previous page)
I have not researched this topic further because it doesnt apply to us. We have all hard assets in a trust set up by an Elder Law firm. I recommend everyone do their own research based on their individual circumstances.
Thanks,
Pana
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CNN - MONEY Search Zero Hedge. I've said my piece. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion; I don't need to say anymore on this subject.
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January 2013 is over. I don't believe that the exemption went back to 1 million dollars, did it?
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"That’s right – while the federal estate tax exemption was set at $5,000,000 and the estate tax rate was set at 35% for the 2010 and 2011 tax years, and the exemption increased to $5,120,000 for 2012, on January 1, 2013 the exemption and rate are scheduled to revert back to the numbers that were in effect in 2001/2002 - meaning, as mentioned above, a $1,000,000 estate tax exemption and 55% estate tax rate."
wills.about/od/understandingestatetaxes/a/futureoftax.htm
I dont think it is fair to Mr. Durden to claim his site is a "conspiracy theory" blog without giving an example of what you are basing your accusation on. A citation would be helpful.
I have not run across "theories" in any of his articles and miss the good old day when all these events were still theories.
The MSM has been a farce since exposed in the 50's with Operation Mockingbird. I highly recommend that you do some research so as not to mislead others till it is to late to update their planning.
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The authority that Panapal quotes is a financial blog that is described by mainstream media outlets as rife with conspiracy theories. Check out your financial facts before making or changing investments. If a parent wants to make what seems like an unwise financial move, I would find out from them what they are basing that on. I would enlist the help of a fee for service financial advisor or eldercare attorney, preferably one your parent already knows and trusts to advise on investments or changes in financial plan.

Is this joint money? Is mom's names on all accounts? I presume nothing can be changed without her consent? Would they agree to splitting their funds so Dad can do whatever foolish thing he wishes with his funds, preserving mom's in conservative investments or however she wants her part of the money to be looked after?
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Sorry, autocorrect scrambled your name!
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PayPal, I have not seen those reports of anyone trying to drop taxable estates to one million dollars, recently. Again, a citation would be helpful, as I would like to be informed, rather than panicked uneccessessarily.
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Igloo, yes gold prices have been driven down pegged against the dollar and is definitely not a "natural" occuring economic cycle. everything is manipulated in every market these days. Especially with the devaluation of our currency.
That said Im still pleased with the 418% that I have gotten from my investment and on average about 37% a year beats any other investment market. I love the fact that the gov cant inflate my gains away also.
The MyIRA plan that O is offering at 2.2% doesnt even keep up with real inflation and you lose about 7% value of actual PPI (purchasing power) a year with it. Inflation is just another way that they try to punish savers. Its not gold that changes value for the last 5000 years but currencies that change purchasing power.
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Babalou, they are trying to drop that to 1 mill. In this day and age 1 mill is not really very much when you consider it is total assets.
For example a small farm is well over 1 million when you consider land, buildings and equipment. This is a agri grab by the gov. Can you imagine a son having to come up with $500,000.00 to keep the land that he has worked on since he was small.
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I would check on the accuracy of a 57% inheritance tax. I do not believe that this is a fact. I would appreciate a citation beyond "the radio". IRS regs seem to state that for the 2014 tax year, only estates in excess of 5 million dollars are required to file. I'm not sure that pertains to any of us.
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Now the Republicans have taken the House and Senate, we all should worry what the government might do.
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The POA i got my parents to initial and sign has been a great help to me. They checked the boxes agreeing to let me make decisions as soon as they start not having the answers.
Have used it several times. Sold a house, cleaned it out, hired someone to go through everything, She rescued many pictures from 4 generations of family.
If mom had any money to worry about, I would go see a lawyer for advice. She is gradually using up the last few thousands of savings and then we are. Looking at medicaid in the next year. Still researching what I need to do. Heard on the radio today that Obama tagged a 57% task on money people leave to their kids.
You gotta get help putting it in a sheltered account where the gov. Can't take it from your family!!
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Thank you all so much! Many things to consider. I will let you know the next part of this ongoing saga. Blessings ;-)
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NOW!! ANSWER IS NOW....Get POA and send mom and pops on vacation or a day outing. Make a weekly outing for them, they are getting bored. Make it fun for them. If you can.
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It may be Dad's money, but it's Mom's future too. As for keeping money at home - one of my neighbors, very elderly, fell and broke her hip and after rehab returned home to find her stash of $100,000 cleared out. She had been very careful to let no one know she had that kind of money, much less that it was hidden at home, but someone figured it out.
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Don't wait like I did. I now had to put hubby in nursing home. We are only on two ss checks. W two pension checks. .have nothing in bank. He spent his whole retirement monies 35,000 on lottery tickets. I am trying to make ends meet now he is on mass health medicaid low income prescription Medicare. .get to your pocket. Physical. Have him get evaluated by. Cognitive psych. Dr..get in touch w an elder army. Sign a no pay waiver to them if needed lk us..now I can at least sleep peacefully. W/out worrying that he w be buying more tickets..registry got called by Ddr regarding his dangers of driving. .he can't now..we sold his truck...now its where it shd be..in a place where I don't have to worry anymore. Make yourself POW and health care proxy.. just do not wait lk me
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Your Dad or Mother or both could possibly need that money in the near future for assisted living/nursing home. So he should keep it where you all can get quick access to it. Keeping it in the local bank is probably the best place at their ages. Not really sure why he is so worried about it...but I think the elderly do get that way whether they have dementia or not. I'm kinda getting that way and I'm no where near 90! I have to keep telling myself why have I saved all this money..I need to start spending it!!
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Sonny...sounds like you have a trust similar to what my Dad set up for he and my Mom. At least it seems to be set up in a very similar manner....except there is only you in at this point. Once Dad was placed in memory care, and we used his half of the assets, and he qualified for Medicaid, then all the remaining assets went into a new trust, just in Mom's name, to provide for her. That just happened last April. Now, it's time to consider how to redo planning to assure she can remain in the home, with helpers as a short term goal, but as resources run out doing that, she would also have to get qualified for Medicaid to, if she lives long enough and her Alzheimer's gets too much worse....at that point, if both are still alive, my long term goal would be to have them both placed in memory care together. My mom is so sad about all this, with Dad being gone from home for two years now....all she really wants is to be able to sleep in bed with him again....yet it's not possible for him to be at home with her as the expense of 24/7 care is more than they have. And she cannot do any of his care herself. This end of life stuff really SUCKS in lots of ways!
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I totally agree with Sonny. The reasons not to keep your money at home, even in a safe, are theft, fire and scams.
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I got the impression that Mom was NOT in line with Dads attempts to manage the money? If mom of clear mind? Mention was made of becoming a marriage counciler too? So don;t let Mom out of these debates, she has a right to worry about her own future security
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Well, first of all about all the financial advice....I think that is important at this stage. Perhaps Dad understands more about markets and politics and world economy than you know! In our family, we are saving in gold and keeping money at home. We dropped accounts at banks a couple years ago and all is with a credit union now, because the fed gov't has their hands in banks. I would say, a good time to help him understand that an app't with an eldercare attorney or a financial advisor is appropriate because so much can change so fast with the elderly as far as health goes, and it wouldn't hurt for you to sit in on the discussion as POA so you understand Dad's wishes AND the other's recommendations. My understanding of my own POA, is that it is acceptable to have the parent keep control of whatever they are able, and just be their eyes and ears, help them write checks, keep financial stuff organized, if they are able. If it's frustrating them, or they are not able, then you move to sharing it. I sort of share with Mom. She doesn't want to pay bills, but she wants to know what's happening. She's made some not so good decisions with money, so know accepts that a good answer with sales people is to say, 'Give me your number and I'll have my daughter call you because she pays all the bills' if she's not wanting to deal with them. Or if she thinks it's something worth looking at, she will get the info and have me check them out. She agrees to nothing by phone or at the door. But she has her credit cards and she has an OK to go to the bank and draw money out of the account when she needs money and she is essentially happy if I just tell her...." Mom, just want you to know all the bills are paid..." But when she wanted a new floor, or new hearing aides....she wanted to be involved in all the pricing, visits, choosing designs and all that.....so fine.....we go with what she wants as long as it makes sense. Sometimes she fights potential decisions, and then I have their attorney call her in for a meeting and he becomes the teacher, the 'explainer' or sometimes, even the 'bad guy' who says, it's time to sell something she doesn't want to sell....or that this or that is the way to look at the investments in order to prepare for Medicaid applications down the road. There are just too many things that cost in the end of life, and some decisions can totally delay getting approved for benefits if a person must be placed and money is running low....so for everyone to look at all the possible things up front is good. My parents had a very specific living trust for the elderly that was so helpful in all this they've faced....as it divides the estate and saves half for the spouse at home if one has to be placed in a facility. One can be on Medicaid and placed, while the other one still has half of all the assets to provide for them as time goes on....It was put together by their eldercare attorney.
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I completely agree 100% with you, 'Litldogtoo Give a Hug'. It isn't a topic friends want to get me started on when the complain about being fearful their parents won't have anything left after paying for their assisted living/nursing home expenses. PLEASE, PLEASE PEOPLE they earned their money, they are entitled to use it for themselves!!
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