I'm at my wits end with his behaviour now.
I could probably write a book with some of the things he's done last few years and how downright selfish he's been. Its got the point now where I dread speaking to him on the phone, dread visiting him because every encounter he manages to wind me up.
He's 84 now and lives alone. 30-40 mins drive from me. Health wise his legs are not great but for his age he's pretty good.
I visit him whenever I can and phone him often. Over the years, I've sorted walk in shower, stair lift, scooter for him. I work full time, my wife has health problems, we've got a teenager with aspergers (see my other posts!) and a 5 year old. Like a lot of people I've got a lot going on and a lot of worries!
BUT, as far as Dad is concerned he is number one priority for me. He's even said he expects this.
I've tried to explain to him the other issues I have to deal with. BUT, its as if he's saying "ah that's not good but what about me". He is manipulative and tries to blackmail me ALL the time.
He completely ignores his grandchildren. To him they are just something that is a distraction taking my attention away from him. (He even says I shouldn't have had last child at my age!).
My wife has now washed her hands of him. I can't blame her shes spot on - his behaviour has been terrible at times. When he's visited us at xmas he's been rude to her, rude to everyone else, and generally completely selfish.
One big bugbear is his attempts to manipulate. He'll phone me and ask me if I'm visiting at the weekend. Generally I will say probably. Then he'll say he's got no food in the house, so I'll have to come to do his shopping. Any doubt and I'll get well I need someone to help me and can't you spare any time for me?
I do on call at work and I've told him time and time again that if I get called then that might mean I have to change my plans. In one ear and out the other. His attitude is "well work will have to understand I needed you to help me out". Same with kids/wife- woe betide they've got something on that affects my ability to visit him. In the past when I said I cant visit x day because daugher has a party he'll say "well she'll have other parties to go to if she misses this one". (He ignores my kids- they just take away my focus from him so I think he doesnt like this)
He will manipulate the situation to get what he wants. It's like a game where Im forced to justify everything. He seems to have no qualms as long as he gets what he wants. Every single time I speak to him I end up annoyed that he's tried it on once again.
The food thing is a joke. Hes got a chest freezer that is 5% full. Goes mad if I buy more than about £15-£20 worth of food to put in there. I'm constantly telling him I'll get home delivery from tesco sorted so there are no emergencies when I'm not available but he refuses. Of course, having a freezer full of food or the ability for me to get it order takes away his biggest bargaining chip.
Like I said, I've tried to explain to him but he is just not interested.
Its really sad because he was such a great Dad. But honestly, it can't go on like this. Any suggestions?
One thread a while ago asked if there were more narcissists now than in past years. My take is that when they are younger, narcissists work hard to find a cheer group. Your wonderful single Dad reminds me of my first marriage split, when we each provided genuine half-time care for our daughters. I was told more than once how wonderful he was being, and how lucky I was!
In the past, narcissists didn’t age, they died. Now they age to the stage when the demands fall on three or four people with a life time experience, who don’t cheer as loudly. When demands aren’t met, they get frantic about proving how important they are. Hence they pull more and more ‘tricks’, which like you say are totally unnecessary. Yell back!
It is truly possible that your father will finally be more reasonable if you don’t jump, but it will take a whole lot more than one time for the penny to drop. It would be in his own best interests in the longer term. In the meantime, it will save your own sanity.
Yours in sympathy.
Its taking me time to realise what he is. Realised the other day that he wants to get involved, want to give approval for everything I do for some reason. I'm 50 years old yet if I say I'm doing something he'll want to know what, if I take time off work he'll want to know if I've sorted it with work.
Brother is away in spain and his flight home got cancelled. Delayed by 4 days. He was supposed to moving to a new department. Apparently, Dad has been ragging on him about make sure its sorted, why did you risk going away so close to the start date etc etc. It crazy that he gets involved.
His answer is always "Well you're wife should understand I need you to help me". Always one my Dad to think he can tell people how to think.
Deep down I think he'd be glad if I got divorced. One less hurdle in him getting 100% of my attention. Thats just so sad.
I'll be honest, at the moment, he does not give a monkeys about me, my wellbeing, my family or anyone else apart from himself.
It saddens me too that hes like this when theres no need to be. Of course, I'd go to see him anyway and of course I'd do things for him but it makes me so resentful that he pulls these tricks all the time.
And I've said a lot of the issues are do damn easy to fix at times if he wasn't so stubborn. I find it so frustrating.
My Dad is not so good at this. He will refuse things which would make his own life and everyone elses life a lot easier. Sometimes for stupid reasons, sometime to just save money.
For instance, we have home shopping where food can be delivered. It costs like (converting from £) $5 delivery. But no he wont do it. Would rather get me to drive 25 mile each way. (And petrol/gas is not so cheap in the UK - $8-$9 a gallon. So even with good mpg it costs me more to drive there and back in fuel alone!).
The worse thing is his attitude to taxis. He will not get a taxi EVER EVER EVER. His idea is that "taxis are not for people like us". Hang on now Dad - are you saying we are lowly peasants or something lol?
In the past hes expected me to travel 60-70 mile home from work rather than pay $12-13 for a taxi home from hospital. (Wouldn't let me pay either). One time he waited 4 hours for free patient transport then blamed me because it made him ill sitting there on a chair for that long.
(To put it into context, I've worked it out, he could get a taxi every day for the next 10 years and still have savings left over)
I was forced into being my mother's chauffeur (I am the only local sib and live 2.5 miles from my mother) when she gave up driving two years ago. She gave me her car, and in exchange for that I was to be her chauffeur. Originally she thought she would tell me where she wanted to go, and I would be given a choice of two times. She was not happy when I set strict boundaries from the very beginning -- she'd get trips to Mass, medical/dental and one shopping trip/week. Before she gave up driving, she was out and about in the community about 5 days out of 7.
She won't ask others for rides, won't ride the senior transportation, etc.
So now she's a shut-in. I take her to chair yoga once a week (my idea; I exercise while she's in class), and she gets her grocery trip immediately afterwards. (If she has a doctor/dental/coumadin clinic appointment, I'll usually stop after that at a grocery store, also), but she doesn't have many of these appointments.)
She is 92, only sees out of one eye, and that one's vision isn't great, has neuropathy and can't feel her legs/feet below her knees, has very poor balance, bad hearing, a-fib, short-term memory loss and her reasoning is going. She can get VERY obsessive about things. She lives alone in a one-story condo, and is now down to showering just once/week, because she doesn't feel safe climbing into and out of the tub. She subsists on cereal, toast, cheese, apples, canned fruit and for dinner Lean Cuisine or Healthy Choice. She refuses to get her bathtub modified, refuses to consider assisted living, etc.
I refuse to be her shower monitor, to cook her meals, etc. We have a bad relationship, and although I spend HOURS when I do my taxi duties, I have been told repeatedly that I "don't do much at all" and that my time isn't worth as much as my Sonny No-Show brother's time. Sonny-No-Show is my brother who can't be bothered to visit (almost 2 years since he visited). I'd suggested HE research more advanced fall alert buttons, and then I was screamed at that HIS time is worth more than mine. Since she is so unappreciative, I avoid her as much as possible.
My brothers (well, the other two; Sonny-No-Show doesn't care) think she is unsafe living alone, and that she should be in assisted living. But no one is able to convince her. And, since the legal standard for mental competence is so low, she calls all the shots.
paulfoel123, it's really okay to leave these selfish elders to their own devices, as long as they haven't been deemed mentally incompetent. Your young children deserve your time and attention more than your father does.
I'll never forget his attitude when I told him. I'll never forget, even when hes gone, how he just is not interested at all in his grandchildren (to him they are an inconvenience that take my time away from focusing on him). I'll never forget his fake illnesses when he didnt get his own way or his self-inflicted injuries either. Never will I forget how he took up hours and hours of my time one xmas day because he was threatening to call an ambulance so I ended up hardly seeing my 3 year old daughter on xmas day.
I've got the same thing with my brother. Hes "ok" doesnt do much but hes the "golden child". Dad worked in a factory all his life. Brother is a welder. I'm an IT consultant so work in an office. Hes never said but you can tell that he thinks office work is not proper work.
He'll make excuses for brother e.g. hes been working 12 hours, hes tired from work. But I dont get the same leeway because in his head its "easy". If brother says he cant do something due to work hes all over that and yes of course. If I say, he says cant you sort something out with work.
As you say, we've got our own lives. I've got a 5 year old daughter.
Yeh my wife has had it with him. He ruined Xmas one year when he came over to us by pretending to be ill (I ended up staying with him for hours when I took him home so didnt see my 3 year hardly at all that xmas). Trouble is when I try to explain to him his attitude is "well they all need to understand I need you, and there'll be other xmases for your kids".
Dad went through a phase of calling me constantly. He also called ambulances, out of hours doctors.Hes had numerous fake falls, difficulty breathing etc. Hes had a few hospital admissions and they found nothing wrong. I've had phone calls in work (I was working away 3 hours from home) from hospital him demanding I pick him up and take him home. 5-6 times this happened. I refuse mostly - its 10 mins in a taxi for him. Even when I offered to pay he sat there once for 5 hours waiting for free patient transport to take him.
He was even ill once and was convinced he should be in hospital. About 2/3 doctors saw him and pretty much told him he had a bit of cold/virus but there was no need. Lo and behold, next day he "hit his head on the cupboard" and ended up in hospital. He was happy then.
Very suspicious looking cut on his head and hes changed the story a few times. Wife is a nurse who works in the community and has experience of things like that. To this day, we're 99% sure if was self inflicted.
Hes now pretty much banned from emergency services - they now refuses to come out. Same with his doctor and the community nurse.
Also, hes a control freak. Im 50 years old, director of my own IT company, have travelled all over the world with work. Yet he still thinks its acceptable to nag me about things like spending money, taking time off work (I'm self-employed of course), how much I spend on the kids for xmas (he managed to air his views on this at the dinner table in front of my wife on year!). Worse one though was when I told him wife was pregnant last time - his answer "what the matter with you two, you're both too old, dont you know kids cost money!". Again in front of my wife.
I've called him out on this. His answer is "Well, I'm old, and you know me, I've got to tell the truth, if people don't like it then that's their problem". Of course, the fact that wife won't have him in the house at xmas because of this very attitude goes in one ear and out the other.
I really have no argument why wife should have to put up with him.
Rethinking the script of a lifetime is very hard, and you have my sympathy and best wishes. Yours, Margaret.
I will have to read more about narcissism because I think you might be right there.
He proved it this weekend again. It seems its all about a bit of power with him. He loves to get people running around for him and generally fussing over him. Which is why he LOVES being in hospital.
Brother is away this week, as is his cousin both of whom he gets to run around for him. He laid the guilt trip on me saying I needed to visit him just in case he wanted anything doing.
But of course he doesn't need anything at all - its just an attempt to get me to go there again.
He seems to get a great deal of comfort from the fact that he has the power to get someone to visit him on demand pretty much. Thats what he likes not that he actually needs anything.
In all honesty, its going to be a nightmare because I can see it being a slippery slope of ending up in a home. Harsh maybe but surely everyone is the same? We're all willing to help elderly parents but they need to help themselves where they can.
Of course, not sure what the real story was here. But I haven't seen much of mother in all those 45+ years.
As I got older though I did realise that Dad, even though his heart was in the right place, made some really bad decisions when we were younger. i.e. Didn't find out the information, decided he couldn't do something, didn't bother to try anything better etc.
BUT, as hes got old, I have seen how awkward he can be and how small-minded and selfish he can also be. It does make me wonder exactly what happened in his marriage to be honest or we ended up in his custody. I guess I'll never know the full story. Part of me wonders if he got lumbered with us and didnt have much choice - which is how Dad is. Things "happen to him" and he sits back and doesnt try to change things for the better.
(He got married and divorced again 10 years later).
Of course, in his head now, we owe him big time....
His views on women/wives don't help much though. Especially his views on how they should behave etc. Hence why he doesn't get on with my wife! I often understand how hes been divorced twice....
I've made progress over the years. He now regards me, I'm sure, as useless son who won't help him. But thats up to him.
BUT, he still plays the same and ups the ante a lot.... When I point things out to him it gets swept under the carpet (like full freezer, ability to get home shopping etc).
No matter what I say seems to make any difference at all. I have to look after him and thats that.
A story from last week that in a strange way has helped me. Its made me realise just how far he will go and that it needs to stop and its not me being uncaring.
I'd accidentally left his wheelchair in my car. Not that hes EVER used it before without me. Anyway, he was asking if I was popping in after work one evening (never keen - its about a 90 min detour with the traffic) and I said no.
Out of the blue, he tells me he needs the wheelchair for Friday because his cousin is taking him to play Bowls and can I drop it back Thursday evening. No can do - got to get home for the kids. So then I get the "well I'll be stuck in the house and can't go out".
Thursday am he phones me. I'd been called out and had been up since 430am in the office. So I said do you REALLY need it and going to use it tommorow? YES.
So I had to make a 90 minute round trip during my lunchtime that day, I was mega busy that day having been in since 430am - could have done without. Probably should have said no.
Speak to him Saturday and I said how was Bowls and did cousin take you in wheelchair? "No I didn't like to ask cousin to push me in the wheelchair because its a good 10 minutes walk for him, so I decided to walk myself". Honestly, I nearly exploded!
As parents, we should lay down our lives for our children, but we should not ask the same in return from our children, because that sacrifice is reserved for the benefits of our children's children.
There was a Jewish story I heard many years ago on a radio show. It goes something like this.
A father birld was trying to rescue his baby birds and bring them over a raging river to the otherside but there was only time to bring one bird. The father bird took one baby bird and started flying. As he flew he asked what the baby bird would do when it grew up. It replied: "I will take as good a care of you as you did me." The father bird dropped that baby bird into the raging water and flew back to pick up the 2nd one. The father asked the same question, got the same answer and did the same to the 2nd baby bird.
He then took his last bird and asked it the same question. The 3rd baby responded: "I will take as good a care of my children as you did us." The father bird flew that baby bird to safety.
If your father was in his right mind and wasn't selfish, would he ask you to sacrifice yourself and neglect your children?
Yes, you should honor and take care of your dad. But that doesn't mean you yourself have to do all the work. It means you see to it that he gets the care he needs.
Good luck. It's easier said than done. It is for me. I try hard everyday to not let my mother get to my kids. Not easy because she lives with us.
It was vascular dementia, but we did not recognize it as such. He passed all the mini mental and other quick evaluations.
When all of his kids decided to work together and set limits on the demands, that was when it all fell apart. He finally is in a nursing home, safe, clean, getting regular meals, and not sleeping in his own urine soaked clothing.
No way could any one person have met his demands. Even 6 people could not meet his demands.
You will not be able to meet his demands. He cannot manipulate you if you set your limits and stick to them. It is very very difficult, but you have to do it. For your family and your work and your sanity.
Hes just got so used to knowing or thinking hes got to know everything. He even asks how I can afford to take time off work to go away and expects an explanation!
No he is fine. Plenty of food, comfortable living arrangements, Pretty good social life to be honest. With him he can't cope too well with being ill where things like social life means a little more effort.
Yes I agree a care home would be the best place. He loves being fussed and mollycoddled. He loves being in hospital for that every reason.
BUT hes got a big thing that going into a home is the end of it.
In his head, he brought us up so now we owe him and have to do it regardless. We have to "make time" with our own families who need to be told they have to understand. Hes said this. He also said no way are we EVER putting him into a home.
On call for me is nothing as important as healthcare lol. I work in IT - probably more money involved if I dont fix things though! BUT regardless there are expectations involved. Part of the problem is he worked in a factory all his life. I work in an office so must either be a manager or an office clerk - I'm neither. No manual work so it cant be that hard or that important in his head.
The comment you made about him not wanting much food in the freezer got my attention. It's because, with my LO, she was oblivious to food in her fridge, because, she would forget to open the fridge door. And food covered by a lid didn't exist. She wouldn't realize the need to lift the lid. AND she was super demanding. It was like she was the queen of the universe. Only her needs were important and they could change at any time. And then blame me, because, I did what she asked me to do! lol It was mental decline and I wish I had known that earlier. I wasted time trying to figure it out and feeling bad about the situation. Someone suggested that to me once and I said, NO WAY. She's fine mentally. But, I was wrong. That's what it was. Sometimes, it's not about memory, but, personality changes, demanding and unreasonable behavior and poor judgment. At his age, it is a possibility. But, regardless of what it is, you have the right to your own life and peace of mind. I'd focus on that and how to have dad's needs met without making you suffer.
Depending on what you find by staying with him, you can share it with his doctor. He may have something else like vitamin deficiency, UTI, depression or some other illness. Finding out the why would help, though, imo.
Your wife and children are first, no need to explain yourself. Yes, I'll be there or no, I'll not be there, period end of discussion.
Buy food to last and get that freezer stocked up. Let him gripe and groan. He is frightened that you will neglect him if he doesn't have a need. Address that, set a visiting schedule and stick to it.
Get others involved and visiting or calling to help with the neediness.
He is not entitled to your life because he was a good dad, will your children be able to say the same or will they say, he was not around much, you see he had this dad that....
Best of luck getting those boundaries in place and sticking to them, habits are time consuming to change.