My father is in the ER at the moment, and I'm not sure if I did the right thing. Any thoughts?

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My father is in the ER at the moment, and I'm not sure if I did the right thing. Any thoughts?

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My Father (73) has a plethora of health issues, and has been experiencing cognitive decline. Three days ago he tried to take his own life. I called 911 right away, and he is currently stable though still not awake.

Did I do the right thing calling 911 on a 73-year-old man that has many health issues? What if my actions lead to him suffering even more if he ever wakes up? Given the COVID protocol at the hospital, I am not allowed to visit or stay next to him. If he does wake up and is in worse condition, will he hate me? Will he live the rest of his life blaming me for his suffering?

I have been a lurker on the forums, never posted. Many stories and tips from others have helped in the care of my father and reduce burnout. I care for my father with the help of two private aides.

Emergency Care End of Life Senior Health

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AZ, you did the right thing.

If your dad wishes not to live any longer when he recovers from this suicidal act, he needs to talk to his doctors about no longer treating his physical ailments. He needs to be seen by a psychiatrist to have his depression treated. In short, he needs to approach his end of life issues in a rational way that does not harm those around him.

You have/had no way of knowing if this was a suicidal gesture gone wrong or a real act of "I no longer wish to live". If you found him, he may have assumed you would find him and save him.

Although I would be furious at a parent for doing this, consider that he may be attempting to "not be a burden". Maybe facility living would be a better idea.

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That’s rough. You did the right thing. It’s our normal reaction to try and save a loved one. You did what a normal person would do. Don’t fault yourself for your human reaction.

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Yes, you certainly did do “the right thing”, while keeping in mind that sometimes, maybe even often in elder care, there may be NO “right thing” to choose.

If he is angry when/if he wakes up, it may be because of his own suicide attempt and physical issues rather than your initiative to do right by him.

Be at peace that you did all you could on his behalf.

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When people "attempt" suicide, it is always a cry for help. So yes you did the right thing, and perhaps now your father can get the real help he needs for his depression and suicidal thoughts.
You did what any loving child would do when looking after their parent, so don't beat yourself up, but instead look on the bright side that your father will now receive the help he needs.

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FG, my mom used attempted suicide as a punishment to her family for not giving her her own way.

She only stopped the attempts when she almost succeeded.

So, I have to disagree that it is always a cry for help.

I think in this man's case, he doesn't want to descend into dementia and have no quality of life.

His mistake was doing it where his daughter would find him, that was selfish.

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I do not think this was a cry for help directly, he is scared he has expressed that concern with me many times. He is afraid of suffering, he is afraid his cognitive decline is progressive, he is afraid he will become an empty husk. I know he has discussed ending treatments for his health issues like diabetes, hypertension, high cholesterol, his weight, limited mobility. He is suffering greatly, all lack of treatment will do is speed up the process but that still could take years.

If he makes it out of this and ends up with even more issues I am terrified by how he will look at me. If he does wake up, I will have to place him which is something he has been against for years and I do not blame him. Seeing my grandmother in a NH as a child was rough, my father would cry each and every time. When she passed he was sad but happy cause she is no longer suffering.

My father has always been big on that concept, of living verse existing. As it stands he is just existing, he is not living. I knew how he felt, but I just reacted. I know he is going to call me selfish, that is one of his favorite lines. Families prolong the life of their loved ones because they are afraid of how losing them will make them feel, yet rarely consider how their loved ones feel about being alive.

I do not think this was an attempt, as the doctor told me if I was any later in getting help he would not be here. He is still stable, I will be able to see him for the first time since the event over the weekend.

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Don’t beat yourself up. You did what any normal loving child or spouse would do for their loved ones. How would you be able to just stand by and let him die knowing he was attempting suicide? I know I couldn’t do it. I lost my little brother to suicide when he was 34 and honestly I wish I could turn back time and stop him from taking his own life. Sometimes people do these things on the spur of the moment before they have time to really think about it and some ponder it for a long time before theyDo it but either way, it’s devastating for those left behind. You always have it in your mind why why why why? There are other ways to ease their pain but they don’t realize that at the time. Be kind to yourself. You made a loving choice to help him. You should not have any regrets and he will know that you did it out of love. Good luck to you💜💜

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This is tough; it's hard to say if you did 'the right thing' b/c if it was your father's wish to end his life, then you threw a monkey wrench into his plans. But you did it for the right reason; because you love him and it was your gut reaction to call 911 and get help for him. I can understand your dilemma and I'm so sorry for what you're going thru and the pain you're suffering as a result.

So, if dad survives this, you need to have an honest talk. If he wants to end his life, do you live in a state where assisted suicide is legal? If so, get on board with his wishes. If not, is he going to try to take his life again? And if so, you'd need to promise not to intervene next time, I guess. It's his right to end his life if that is what he wants to do. Just have that talk so both of you are on the same page and agree that you won't call 911 next time.

Try not to play the 'would've/should've/could've' game with yourself now b/c it's a gruesome thing to do to yourself. You called 911 out of love for your father & a desire to save his life; not b/c you were trying to harm in any way. If he comes out of this and is angry with you, explain your stance; let him know how much you love him and how it was an instinctual thing you did. Don't put a big burden of blame on yourself for trying to save your father's life; what daughter wouldn't?

Wishing you the best of luck with a difficult situation. Sending you a hug and a prayer for the best possible outcome here.

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These questions will never have an answer, but it may help you to sit and ask yourself this single question: "If I had not called for help knowing this was a suicide attempt, would I be able to live with myself"?
There are people for whom life is too tough. I understand that, and as a nurse I have seen more than my share of those who have taken their own lives whether because of depression or illness. We can't know if your Dad's depression can be helped, or if he will seek help. We cannot know if he will make more attempts until he is successful, or whether he will be angry or not.
That doesn't change the fact that you had to make a decision and you made the only one you felt you could live with. Second guessing it will leave you in that place that pretends there is a lot of choice and there was "an answer" or "the answer" and had you but known it everything would be all right. It lets us allow the pure grief, because pure grief means we are without an answer. It mean we must sit in absolute helplessness and mourn the pain those we love endure, the pain we cannot change, cannot wipe out, cannot endure.
You did what you thought was right.
If Dad awakens, then tell him that you did the only thing you could at the time, the only thing you could live with. Tell him you are so sorry for his pain. Tell him you care so much about him.
If Dad doesn't awaken then know his mission was one he accomplished. Let yourself mourn your loss. Know he is at peace.
I am so sorry. Not everything has a "fix" and there is so little we are really in charge of. Sometimes there is no answer but tears.

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This answer here is the only one you need to read, it absolutely spot on correct. I have to make the decision to take my mom off of a heart medication drip that will keep her from going into full-blown a fib because she’s at that stage in her life where her heart disease is so incredibly horrible that she just keeps going back-and-forth to her assisted living to the hospital so we decided to put her on hospice and this is the same decision that I am going back-and-forth about that you are because I feel like I’m” killing her” myself by making this decision to let her body take its course. She got Covid and after Covid her bodies never recovered she now has pneumonia and she can barely even talk and breathe at the same time. Her entire family has died of this and she’s 85 and my dad passed away last year and I know it’s her time but the thing is when you can have a conversation with her and she’s clearheaded but still has the dementia but can still have a conversation do you think yourself that you’re killing them because they’re able to look at you and understand things but her quality of life is not good because she can’t do anything anymore. So your question is a valid one and I think the answer to both of our questions is the answer that Alva has given us. I needed the exact same answer that you did , and I found it here. I could think seven different ways to Sunday and what I should do or not do but we’ve decided as a family that this is the right thing for her, I hate it , it feels horrible but I don’t think anything is going to feel good.
I wish you the best of luck with everything you’re going through❤️

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Does he have a living will, and do you know his medical directives? He may not want to be on life support.

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Suicide is considered a mental health issue in the U.S. Taken a suicidal patient to the E.R. is appropriate. You did the right thing. Whether a very sick person who tries to kill himself/herself is or is not rational, is not even considered. A suicidal patient has to have a psychiatric evaluation to comply with the Law. However, many people who are very sick physically do kill themselves in this country. Sometimes, even aided by a family member. In some other countries, a hopelessly sick person is allowed to request a dignified death. Your father won't hate you for doing what is expected in the U.S. However, if your father was rational when he attempted suicide, he might try it again and again until he succeeds. No matter how many psychiatric admissions he has. There are many types of suicidal attempts, but your father's is one of those that probably makes sense.

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If someone truly wants to die, they will find a way to do it. There are many folks (if diagnosed early enough) that chose to take their own life in lieu of existing with dementia. People are fearful of not being in control of their bodies, their actions, etc. I don't condone it, but I understand it.

Please do not feel guilty over this. You acted as any normal person would...you called for help. You'll just have to wait and see how he is when/if he wakes up. It could swing either way...he could thank you because he had a week moment and regrets it, or he could be angry. Just talk to him and tell him you couldn't bare to let him go.

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There is nothing else you could have done. But now there have to be some further talks with your father about a way forward. My father succeeded in suicide. I would have stopped him if I had known. He left a letter that said he neither wanted to be in pain any longer nor to be a burden. I certainly never felt he was a burden. I think if his doctor and I had known he was in so much pain there would have been better answers. I learned that my father and mother had a suicide plan to go out together, but she kept finding excuses to wait, so he decided it wasn't her time and left alone. After he was gone I cared for my mom with Alzheimer's for 10 years. What's better, to leave the way he did or decline gradually over many years? I guess it depends on the illness and what someone can endure. I did come to understand what he did, but even after understanding, I still would have stopped him from the violent way he went out and helped him to a better solution. I miss both of my parents terribly.

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Yes you did the right thing - I would have called 911 too . Stop beating yourself up . When My Mom could No longer keep her head on the pillow and swallow I called 911 with the Visiting Nurse . When my brother went into a diabetic shock I called the Nurse and then called 911 . Both of them ended up in the hospital and nursing homes and Honestly it was a Blessing because I was pretty worn down . We do Our best - that's all we can do .

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Your father is ill with dementia - he will be confused and mad but that is his problem. You did nothing wrong and you can't take care of him. This is one for the professionals. You don't need to suffer and be a martyr for someone like this. Place him and start living your life free of stress and suffering.

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And if he succeeds with suicide, so be it....why force him to suffer. Just be glad he would be at peace then. I see nothing so bad about it in some cases.

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If he passes in the hospital despite life saving treatment, that is one outcome.
He may not regain consciousness. Or he may. If he is relatively stable, then a nursing home for custodial care comes next.
Talk to his SW or RN care manager or discharge planner or whatever the job title. Maybe ask for a phone appt, for 15 minutes or so. PreCOVID you would have a care conference with providers and family together, so a phone meeting is reasonable. Ask your questions, and note down the answers.
He was in a lot of pain (psychological, emotional, spiritual, existential - why am I here? why am I suffering? etc.). A palliative care/hospice evaluation could help give ideas of how to support him and you, even if he is not verbally responsive.
Additionally, if a patient is on a hospice program the COVID visit restrictions can sometimes be waived...being vaccinated and masked helps.
No matter how this goes, please don't feel guilty. AlvaDeer's response is right on target.

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AZ
my heart goes out to you; you did the right thing, how would you feel now if you hadn’t.
please don’t feel guilty, like many others here I think Alva’s post is on target
xx

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In most facilities, a patient can have visitors if they aren't a COVID patient. In our area there you can request to speak to the AOD (Administrator on Duty) that is always available and can override a protocol and allow visitors in certain cases. It never hurts to try, the worst is they will say no.

I feel you have reasons to request an exception to the rule and be allowed to be with him to advocate for him. Are you concerned he may not survive? Are you concerned he may be totally confused due to his cognitive decline? Some patients with dementia become even more confused whenever admitted to a facility. Can he speak for himself? You may be the only person who can fill in the blanks when he does wake up.

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You definitely did right by calling 911. Take it a day at a time for now.

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God bless you. You completely did the right thing. Talk to someone asap that can help you. Talk to a nurse, his doctor, someone.

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AZGroton, how is your dad?

How are you?

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You did right. If and when he wakes up he can get the help he needs. Be strong.

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My husband tried to take his life, once I revived him best I could he got to the ER. He was put on a hold. Due to hipaa you won't normally be able to know what's going on unless you have health care POA that includes mental health etc. I had that with my husband. My husband was a Viking looking man, so he was ashamed but no hate happened. Medication finally was fixed and he got the diagnosis he needed.

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AZGroton: Any time that an individual attempts to end his own life by his own had is deemed a medical emergency.

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Most people's suicide attempts are actually cries for help. Mayne thinking that this is his cry for help nay ease your mind.

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Your decision to call 911 was the correct, proper, and moral thing to do. If you did not call 911 and suppose he died--the guilt you will suffer would be beyond description. Keep in mind: Depression is a very treatable. You dad just needs to be treated for his depression.

My mom had end-stage Alzheimer's and had this disease for 15 years. She also suffered insulin-dependent diabetes (pills did not work for her) for decades, chronic kidney disease, heart disease, even liver cancer, but she was comfortable and very peaceful to the end--she lived to be 90 years, 3 months. She was very hard work on my part, and on hospice for 2 years but we never had to open that "emergency pack". She was surrounded with love and care, so she was good.

Take comfort in knowing you did the right thing.

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Did you do the right thing?

I don't see you had any alternative. What would we think of anyone who witnessed an attempted suicide and didn't call it in? How would you have lived with that decision?

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My father is stable and awake. It appears he suffered a minor stroke he is unable to move his left arm, but according to the doctors they see no nerve damage. The prognosis is good, but my father is not pleased. Generally told me what I thought he would, that I am selfish for wanting him to suffer longer because I am afraid of losing him. He even asked the doctor to allow him to pass without pain, he wants to die with his memories intact. He was evaluated, they determined he was of sound mind, he is showing signs of MCI, which we have been told does often become full blown dementia or ALZ, especially in his case due to the stroke. He is showing signs of depression, but as my father put it. Yes, he is depressed, he has limited mobility, most likely will end up with a disease that kills the mind, and will most likely forgot all the memories I had of my child. They will be moving him to psych for further evaluation and see what treatment options are available.

I am happy he still said I love you and asked for a hug. Think he is more upset with the situation and not me. I am trying to reach out to his brother since he lives in a state with death with dignity laws. Wish he would have told me how he felt, It would have been painful but I would have understood.

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AZ, I am glad of your update. You are correct, it is life he is upset with , not you. You can readily handle his saying you are "selfish" for wanting him there. You need to tell him that he would put a terrible burden on you for your own life by wanting you to live with knowing that he could have been saved by you but you didn't do it. He has responsibilities to those he loves as well as YOU do.
If your father has no certain diagnosis of an illness that will take him within 6 months then he is unlikely to be able to avail himself of Death With Dignity laws, sadly. However, many seniors choose to stop eating. It is a long process, even without even minimal sips of fluid, over a week in most cases, but some MDs will allow for sedative drugs for the more difficult days when confusion sets in. It is difficult to go through this for both patient and family.
You also can made a "deal" with your father about days you will not call of visit. Say on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday unless he calls you. This gives him a three day period weekly of time to himself; what he does with it would be up to him.
I am sorry. I hope he will try with help of MD, with help of some anti depressants, and etc. But he may choose not to, and that is something that is not in your control.
Thanks again for updating us.

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AZG I am actually now feeling quite angry on your behalf. Who's calling whom selfish?

You didn't call 911 because you're indifferent to your father's future possible suffering and couldn't bear to lose him. You called 911 because you were a responsible citizen responding appropriately to an emergency.

Has your father always been this cruel and manipulative? If he wants to kill himself, he can sign and have witnessed an advance directive refusing all medical intervention. This would relieve you of any responsibility to make impossible choices for him in the future. See he gets it done (or call his bluff, whichever applies).

I expect you think I'm being very harsh. Probably. I suppose I'm overcompensating. Because your emotional wellbeing matters too, you know, and it doesn't look as if it's been given a moment's thought.

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I feel exactly the same way.

I would be angry as all heck for him doing this in such a way that he knew you would find him.

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No you didn’t make a mistake by bringing him to ER. They can check for UTI & perhaps make a medication adjustment. Short term rehab after hospital stay can give you respite. Hugs 🤗

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You did the right thing.

I will say though and this is a VERY personal opinion.
I have told my sister that if I am ever diagnosed with dementia that I plan on taking my life at a time that I chose to do so. So if I call her up one evening and ask her to let the dogs out in the morning she will be aware of my plans. (problem comes when after the diagnosis and I either "forget" my plan or forget to call her 🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️)

If your dad wishes to no longer take medications that are "prolonging" his life that is his decision.
If your dad is getting treatments for any of his conditions and he wishes to discontinue treatments that is his decision.
BUT if this episode came with no discussion previously then the intervention you did was the right thing to do.
It sounds like a long talk with your dad is due. Find out exactly what his wishes are.

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You did the right thing. As others have said, if he wants to end his life, there are ways to do it. If he is mad, he has the rest of his life to get glad in.

I choose to call 911 on my husband earlier this week. Not suicide, but a 90 year old man forgetting how old he was and working out in the backyard in the heat witihout drinking water until his blood pressure was under 75/51. He was recovering when the medics got here and that was what they got. He refused an ambulance to the hospital. That is on him. I called and if he didn't like it, tough.

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My father is in the ER at the moment, and I'm not sure if I did the right thing. Any thoughts?

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