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My dad, 77, does not sleep well at night. Over the past year, wakes up hitting my mom, or sees people in the closet. We think that was caused from different meds for relief of pain. There are times he may get up a dozen times to get a drink or use the bathroom, but then mom will find him in the other bedroom looking for something. He tends to go to sleep, with the help of xanax, but will does not stay asleep. He can go into the living room sit in his spot and nap great. My mom believes he could walk out of the house during his confused moments. During game the day, he does not ever seem confused. He would easily nap off and on all day if we were to let him. I'm wondering if this could be sundowner syndrome, and if so, would that mean he has dementia or Alzheimers.

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Game Day ?? Is that Football?? if so, I would get all the football tapes ever made and let him watch to his hearts content...
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Remember also that HYPOGLISEMIC tend to drink because alcohol acts like insulin. Sorry about my spelling. Did not know how to spell those two things and wanted to get the note to you. If he drinks, he is making himself to feel better. A Hypoglisemic person can become an alcoholic. The alcohol, makes them feel better. Opposite of a diabetic.
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Just read the post again. You claim he drinks alot. Not sure if anyone said anything but he could be diabetic. Drinking and urinating alot is one sign. They also get stroke and dementia like. He needs to see a doctor. Eventually he will go into a coma.
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Jan123; Yes, I told them he needed to get to a psychiatrist on 12/1.
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for God's sake take the man to a neurologist and psychiatrist before you find him and your mom dead. whatever is causing his behavior he is dangerous to himself and others. you are responsible as his children to take care of him and your mom. do not let people guess at what is wrong when you can get medical help.
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Yes, jeanne, thanks...this man needs the help of a psychiatrist ASAP.
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Just imagine if someone gets this drug and then the family thinks this someone has lost it and hospitalizes him/her and drug him even more and eventually they end up in a nursing home, all because the relatives or significant partner don't realize it is the Ambien.
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I had two nights with no sleep this last week. Have NO IDEA what caused it. But, I refuse to tell the doctor as that Ambien is horrible. I won't take any sleeping pills ever again.
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Rondo, what you describe is definitely not a part of growing older. Our expert Carol gave you her usual great advice. You need professional guidance in figuring out what is going on. drkernisan's comments are on target, too. Obviously none of us can diagnose your father, but I hope our suggestions help prepare you to talk to the doctor. First choice of doctors = behavioral neuroloigst. Second choice = geriatric psychiatrist. Starting with your dad's PCP MIGHT work OK if that person isn't among the non-specialists who just brush the whole possibility of dementia off.

Llamalover is right that hitting a bed partner is not accepable, but it is extremely common among people who have the sleep disorder drkernisan mentions. RBD is characterized by certain dream patterns, typically being chased by an animal or bad guy, and by acting out the dream, with legs running and arms swinging, etc. This can result in blows to the bed partner or the person throwing himself out of bed. It can be dangerous. Fortunately it is fairly easy to treat once it is diagnosed.

My husband had RBD for many years before other symptoms appeared, and those symptoms included hallucinations, inability to stay in bed, considerable confusion but not consistently -- sometimes he was "normal" and a couple hours later he was definitely not "normal" by anyone's standards. He also exhibited some physical characteristics similar to Parkinson's -- slight tremors, some rigidity, a changed gait. He was diagnosed with Lewy Body Dementia (confirmed after death via autopsy.)

I certainly can't say that your dad has LBD, but I suggest that you and Mom do some reading on the RBD sleep disorder and on LBD, in preparation for talking to the doctor.

This is a scary time for all of you. Help is available once you have a diagnosis.
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He needs to see a doctor now! Hitting your mother bc of his illness is UNACCEPTABLE!
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After what happened to me, I don't take anything without knowing the side affects. It is horrible what they are handing out to seniors. Many of whom I am sure are mis-diagnosed
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Believe me, the Expert is correct. CHECK HIS MEDS. My doctor gave me a sleeping pill that made me sleep walk. It was not funny. I turned on the tea pot with NO water in it. When the fire alarm went off, I woke up wondering what was burning. I went into the kitchen and wondered how that happened. Then went into the bedroom, fell against my end table...BROKE it, thats how hard I hit it, and went to sleep. The next day my cheek hurt. Two days later I was in the ER and I had broken my cheek. This is no laughing matter, no matter the stories you hear. I also saw people. So, get the meds checked. Now my file carries a huge sticker with the drug name and ALERGIC next to it.
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It doesn't sound like sundowning -- which is when people with cognitive impairment develop difficult behaviors in the late afternoon or early evening -- but it does sound very worrisome. Seeing a neurologist and a careful medication review are both excellent ideas.

I do wonder if it could be REM sleep behavior disorder. That can cause kicking and punching during the night. It is associated with Parkinson's, which is related to Lewy-Body dementia.

Here are some free scholarly articles on sleep problems in older adults. It's always a good idea to do a little homework before seeing a doctor about problems, as it will help you ask better questions:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2842167/

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2748127/

good luck!
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What you asked if this was sundowning. I think not. Sundowning is just that, they get worse after the sun goes down. They can be pretty good during the day but when it gets dark they have problems being with it. You really need to have his meds checked out first. Maybe taking them all away and starting back one at a time to see which one is causing the problem. At that time, have him evaluated for Dementia.
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My surrogate dad was definitely not violent, but he did start gradually acting a little different toward evening. This was very subtle and I had no experience whatsoever with dementia or Alzheimer's patients. Since no one was helping at the time, all we could do was go on about our normal lives as we always did. There eventually became such a change that I started noticing the signs were less subtle and more obvious. Still, no one would help despite what I described to the APS. I was eventually told that they couldn't help without enough information, and I gave them everything I had. It wasn't until much later that I got a knock at my door from an unexpected source. That's when I found that the social worker from APS told me that they had moved dad from the rundown slum and into a nearby retirement facility. This was short-lived, because he was actually hospitalized I guess for pneumonia. When he didn't come home for quite some time, I started investigating only to discover he was moved from his new apartment right into the nearby nursing home. I didn't know this until I started setting up his new up his new apartment and I waited for him to come home because he was supposed to be discharge from the hospital. I didn't know what was really going on until later. That's when I realized that he was never coming home. When I went to see him at the nursing home, he was very angry at having been forced into the nursing home by APS and the guardian. The staff had an awful time with him at mealtime. He was actually used to having me eat with him at home, because we frequently shared meals together. He was definitely not used to being surrounded by total strangers, which triggered some of the behaviors that he was displaying at home usually during the evening. Some of his behaviors started showing up during the day after the nursing home staff were trying to get him to eat. He wasn't used to eating anything outside of his usual chicken TV dinners, and I had to tell them that he has been eating them for years and I could never get him to eat healthy. I told them how he one day decided to bring home a pound of ground round and a pepper. When I fixed that, he gladly excepted it and ate it. We then started adding other things to the ground round, and he was happy with that.

From what I've noticed with dad, I think malnutrition over a period of years probably contributed to him getting dementia or Alzheimer's, because malnutrition for long enough certainly does some very nasty things to the human body, including the brain. This is what I strongly believe probably lead up to dads mind malfunctioning to the point he started acting differently at night.
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I've got 6 ladies that sit for my Mom since the 2nd leg break. We do keep a detailed notebook but ya know the way the system works..that helps but not completely. By the time we told each shift floor nurse, cna's, administrators at the NHm...it is exhausting. Now that I've moved her to AL with the sitters & new home health care for PT she is regaining her strength..the drugs have already done the damage to her brain. She is better but she is a handful now that she is getting better. And I'm sure it is early dementia drug induced..j s..watch but stuff still happens that takes awhile to catch onto & figure out & correct. Most the patients at the NHm had no one to stay with them nor could they afford it. The ones that I say were like me Trust No One even some of the sitters had to be let go..AL isn't perfect & the laws state & federal have changed that now have to be followed & made everything you do more complicated. Thanks for listening. T
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Buy a spiral notebook and keep a daily log of all behavior, meds, care activity, etc. Write what you know and note what you do not/need to know. This will give you specific issues and dates to talk to docs & care helpers. Over time you & docs may see trends that you would otherwise not observe. Also gives you more specific record of care, in case you need to address care givers. They pay more attention if they know you keep a record. My log for my 90-yr old mom has really helped pinpoint meds problems, behavior swings, etc. - and you will never remember all of it so write it down. The records really help mom's docs help her too. Good luck.
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Seeing a neurologist in my area is referral only & that is at least 3 months out. The regular floor doctor or primary care physician at the nursing home that followed my Mom from the hospital when she broke her leg the 1st time then, the second time, sees her less than 5 minutes, charges Medicare from $150 -$250 per visit prescribes, changes, or goes by the exact doses of meds on a piece of paper from the hospital that nearly killed her. I would continue to make the request to the floor nurse but to no avail the minute I leave or hang up they forget or do whatever they want. When I check again because nothing seems to have changed...it wasn't documented or there are 3 shift changes so go figure our precious elders are dying left & right. The nurse practitioner at AL has been more helpful, however, my Mom is better but since we got her meds corrected..she is still very negative, argumentative, defient, & down right nasty at times. I know she has early drug related on set dementia from the anesthesia from surgery & overdoses of meds prescribed. I cant be there all the time & I guess I am thankful for my Dad saving away what I hope is enough to care for my Mom. Ya'll take care, have a great Christmas holiday & Happy Year.
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This could be any number of things, Hope72, so I think she should see a doctor. At age 92, even a small adjustment in medications could make a difference, however, it's true that she could have a form of dementia. Not every case of each type of dementia shows the same symptoms which is why it takes a professional to diagnose what is happening.

There may or may not be anything that can be done to help her, but she certainly needs to be checked.

Please update us when you know more.
Take care,
Carol
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My mother is 92yrs. With dementia, & has hallucinations. She slept a day & night away, & will immediately fall asleep! Then wants to wander around! Is that Lewy Body dementia?
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Your dad's medications need to be carefully examined because meds can cause these types of issues - complete personality changes, hallucinations, anger, etc. However, a neurologist is important here because some types of dementia can start like this, as well.

If you and/or your mom can keep records while you wait for an appointment, that may help the doctor. Chart when meds are taken, when the activity starts, and anything else that enters your mind. It's possible that a pattern could emerge.

I saw this with my dad while he was hospitalized. Twenty minutes after a dose of the supposedly helpful medications he became so paranoid he thought people were trying to kill him. It was like clockwork. So, yes, tracking can help.

However, if this is a type of dementia that presents with aggression and/or hallucinations, then the doctor will have to do more than change the medications. He or she will have to work with all of you on a care plan.

Please update us when you can. We want to know how you are doing.
Carol
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Please take your dad to a neurologist. Be there with him to help the doctor understand what has been going on. My husband has the same symptoms, and was diagnosed with Frontal Temporal Dementia, but I am leaning more toward Lewy Body now. We will go back to the neurologist in March. Know that you are not alone in this! Blessings
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Yep. I am with Bevvegas
Symptons perfectly describe.LB but many docs do not recognize. Needs a thorough exam from neuro with dementia specialties.
I have been here.
Very sorry.
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Rondo, I really hope you're getting dad to a neurologist very soon for a complete diagnostic workup. Please go with him and describe the symptoms you've shared here.

Sometimes elders tend to minimize their symptoms, and his neurologist needs to know about both the hallucinations and the acting out in dreams, both of which often occur in Lewy Body dementia. We're not physicians; as I said last week, this is not a situation for guessing.
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I first want to say that I hope that my conclusion is incorrect, and it is dimply a case of him suffering the side affects of pain meds. That's possibly an easy fix. Two years ago, my mother was diagnosed with early onset dementia(she just turned 69). As I have had problems with medictions in the past, I immediately began intensive research,looking up everything from the common Alzheimer's research to the obscure and often unheard of ailments, such as Morgellen's disease. This led me to something called Lewy Body Dementia(LBD),which has a tendency to come on with abrupt severity.All of the things you have described(and more) are the symptoms of LBD.But I wouldn't dare give any sort of diagnosis at all, if I were a physician, until an extensive workup is done on your father.The main reason you should look into it yourself is because it is often overlooked or misdiagnosed by doctors who, though meaning well, do not have updated info regarding this particular form of dementia.It often masks its own symptoms with symptoms which seemingly have no connection to dementia.
As for the brain surging, which is why he awakens inside his dream( akin to childhood night terrors), and the reason for his nighttime scavenger hunts, my mom was prescribed Nortryptoline, which helps the neves to rest, allowing for her much needed REM sleep and less surging.Hope I have been of some help,and many blessings in your ongoing search for answers!
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Get away from Xanax try clonapin sleep better less confusion or even Ambien sleep a lot better but that to has side effects,, Clonopin all so good for so for spasms
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Please have him seen by a neurologist soon. This is not a situation for guessing.
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