Grandmother smells of pee and sweat because she refuses to bathe. Any advice?

Sweetheart, your Grandmom is frightened and embarrassed about her loss of control. Plus it's hard to reach down there and get every spot. My advice, look her right in the eye, and say "Grandmom I love you, let me help you like you have always helped me." Establish trust, that you won't judge, criticise, or threaten. Don't tell her what to do, ask. "What do you need to keep clean?" "How can we help you?"

This situation can't go on. Hygiene is crucial to keeping your Grandmom out of a nursing home. Skin is an organ like the lungs and heart, it wears out as you age. Much easier to prevent bedsores and rashes before they start. It's an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure situation. Say that to her. It's old fashioned advice, she will understand. Be honest not harsh. Does she want bedsores? Don't let tears stop you from insisting on cleanliness.

You are not alone. This is a constant battle between my Dad and I. When I help him get dressed, I hand him a washcloth that is warm, morning and night. If there is a pee smell those clothes get washed. Just take them and wash them. Good luck.

In my opinion weird kids, are the best kids. Stay true to yourself. I think you are a fantastic loving person for caring for your Grandmom. Don't forget to laugh, and enjoy each other. Humor goes a long way to solving problems.

You are an amazing and loving person and I admire your love for your grandma. She is so very blessed to have someone I her life like you. Your insight into her situation is way beyond your years. It sounds like your grandma might need additional assistance from a from a professional caregiver or to be placed in an assisted living facility. Please have your mom read the advice that will be listed here. I would recommend that you Mom talk with your grandma doctor about care options. I am saying prayers for you, your mom and your grandma.

I was astonished when you said you are 15 years old....You are a wonderful person to be so concerned about Grams....I don't know what advice to offer..I just want to say "well done".
Bob

I want to say Thank you! We need more kids like you.

Talk with her doctor, or have your mom do that. He can send out home health care to help her with her bath. Depending on the circumstances, they will come out twice a week or maybe even three times for a limited length of time. If that doesn't work, contact the senior center in your area and ask if there are senior services that will send someone into the home. This can be touchy because Grandma doesn't see you or your mom as being the "authority". Sometimes a stranger in a medical smock makes all the difference.

We had the same situation with my Mother when she lived with me. I found that remembering to bathe every other day was too confusing, she always thought she showered "yesterday", so she was never showering . After having the hard conversations about not wanting bedsores,( because the odor thing just made her angry since she couldn't smell it), we got her showering everyday and once it became habit she was ok. As for the pee smell in her clothing, try soaking them in a bucket with water and 1/4 cup listerine (more if needed) before laundering, that will take the smell out, I suppose you could use that to clean the couch cushions as well. Keep your chin up, your doing the best you can for her. Prayers and hugs.

maybe she will use warm disposable wipes to keep clean but keep pushing the adult pull ups or pads in a nice way by taking away her other options and leaving them out for her. maybe she thinks they cost to much.

My dad has prostrate problems, common in elderly men. bowel problem happened occasionally sometimes even often just after he had showered. Then we 'bribe' him and tell him we will take him out to get him to shower again. He also went through two or three days, but the bribing helps. They get very tired and find it an exhausting effort, it appears.
Good luck to you and your kind young heart, for helping your grandma. :)

I have discovered that this is a common problem in taking care of the elderly. My mother is not cooperative when it is time to take a shower. Since your grandmother thinks she bathed in the morning, start keeping accurate records and let her know you are doing so, as to when she actually does shower. Then you can say to her in so many words, "no, it has been two or three days already, and you have to consider other people. Also, other people have to sit on the furniture, and you are not being fair." Keep track of how many diapers there are and when you have given them to her. You can then tell her that she is not using them. Another thing that helps is using personal wipes from Walmart or a similar store, and/or a wash cloth. Make bathing as enjoyable and quick as possible. My mother never seems to enjoy bathing too much anymore, unfortunately. Also, offering her a reward afterwards, such as her favorite candy, taking her somewhere, or some other reward that she would like, is also helpful. Best of luck.

When my grandmother lived with us my mother put cushions on all of the upholstered furniture and a heavy throw on the sofa. She told Grandma that was because of the little house dog we had at the time and asked her to be careful to leave them in place so that if the dog got on the furniture.

Refusing to bathe is so common, even among people who are not at a very advanced stage of dementia. I know people who have not taken a proper bath or shower in months. Persuasive strategies can help (especially the ones that focus only on their desires rather than consideration for others having to smell them or clean up after them). But often, no amount of reasoning, begging or even bullying will work.

If someone in your family is willing to do the hands-on bathing, I'd suggest just starting the process rather than talking about it beforehand. Like "Come with me, Mom" and then just take her to the bathroom and begin to bathe her, explaining as they go, but not opening it for discussion (and refusal). Keep it pleasant and light. Or, I'd arrange for someone to come once or twice a week (don't bother dreaming about daily baths, it's setting your goals too high). I'd say that her doctor was concerned about something s/he saw on grandmother's skin and has 'ordered' the bathing 'treatments'.

It really eats away at me that I sometimes have to manipulate my father, but if it's something important, you "gotta do what you gotta do" to get the job done. For example, to get him to take a new medication to treat a condition he is certain he doesn't have, I simply tell him the doctor has prescribed it for a condition he acknowledges and complains about. Look for your grandmother's motivators and use them.

The current advice in working with someone who has dementia is to "enter their reality." So, encourage everyone to see things as your grandmother is seeing them and work from that perspective.

Great advice as always.

I do think pride comes into this, massively.
As a mum, it was out jobs to wash and change our babies (then mag them as older kids to clean their teeth properly, shower daily! I have this right now with my 11 year old son!)
The idea that oneday my son may have to change my diaper/ waah me appals me.

We had this with my mum, who did not have dementia/alzs, but was incontinent, and got more and more immobile as time went on.

First off, I bought pretty floral chair covers to protect the chairs (as the seat cushions are the main odour culprit!!) These covers are soft one side, waterproof the other, so brilliant for chairs and car seats! And the floral one looks nice
ebay.uk/itm/301094739773


My mum would not let me wash her 'down below' even when incapable and starting to whiff(she was mortified at the idea of smelling too)
I asked if she would prefer a stranger (ie a carer) to wash her than me... she said yes.
Even though I said it was now my time to look after her, and that I was a mum so it did not phase me, she still said no.
You may have to respect that.

The danger here is regards infection.
UTIs (urinary tract infections) are a major problem in elderly, and huge cause of hospitalisation.
(Mum did let me wipe her backside after the loo, and pull up her diaper pants, but she'd always do the front)
You add in the fact that you have to inject her thighs and that is a very real contamination/infection risk.

Is your nan aware enough to have discussions around the risks to her of UTIs and Cellulitis caused by poor hygiene?
Most folk abhor the idea of hospitals, maybe that is something you need to discuss.


Is there an option for her to have a carer come in once a day or every other day to wash her?

There does come a time you have to be more firm with nan. Some things (like her injections) simply have to be done, to keep her safe and well. Your mum could explain this is the same level of seriousness as that.
You may not be able to overcome her 'forgetting' to wear her diapers, but you can insist on changing her clothes and ensuring she has clean ones.
(maybe with her permission remove all her panties so her only option is her diaper pants???
Put some in her pantie drawer as well as the bathroom to remind her?
(She does not need panties anymore I am guessing?)

Mum eventually let me wash her top half and her legs and feet, but I'd only expose the part I was washing, so she never felt 'naked'
I'd then hand her a warm flannel with some feminine wash on it (Lactacyd, soap free esp for genitals) and turn my back whilst she washed her bits.
Then I'd pass her a clean warm wet flannel to rinse off.
Then a soft towel.
Then help her on with her diaper pants (we called them her big pants, mum hated the fact that she had to wear those hideous incontinence pants... US term 'diaper' is even worse!)

I washed her flannies and hand towels daily.
daily, Easy to have a good stock of flannies and hand towels)

Your nan sounds a little more mobile but a little less lucid than my mum though.
So I suspect the professional carer option to pop in and wash her may be the best option.
May not need to be daily.
(May get to a stage she'll let you wash her instead.)
They know exactly how to manage this.
Use a reputable agency, maybe if you can say the region you live in the folk on here can suggest some good ones?

A LOT of experience is on here for you.
What a great grandchild you are!
Big hug to you and your mum.

You really are to be commended for writing us and telling us about your grandmother. Ask your mother to buy some pads you can put on the furniture that are leak proof and washable, then when she leaks, you can wash them. Her doctor can also prescribe a medication to help with her leaking, or you can get a patch at Walmart called Oxytrol she wears on her abdomen that will help with urinating so much. You could hand her a basin filled with warm water and Ivory soap with wash cloth and help her wash under her arms. So what if she cries? Your family needs to live there too and you will just have to make some rules about her cleanliness. Hang in there and show this to your mother.

Your grandmother needs some nursing care, so ask your mother if she can find out if her mother's insurance will cover visiting nurses or home health aides or if your grandmother can afford them herself. A visiting nurse can clean and dress your grandmother, instruct her in the use of adult diapers and change them for her as well. This should be done at least once a day if not more. As others have noted, if this situation isn't addressed your grandmother could develop sores and infections if she hasn't already; the bad odor is the least of it! Changing diapers isn't pleasant for family members, so a visiting nurse can not only take that burden off the family but make sure no problems are developing that may require antibiotics and such. Grandma is at the point, like many of the elderly, where she can't or won't take proper care of herself, so it has to be done for her. In addition to nurses, I would get thick washable bed pads for the bed and wherever she sits, as well as disposable pads. The nurse can administer whatever ointments may be required. Again, caring for an elderly incontinent person is tough work and not for a 15 year old, so contact visiting nurses and get some help. Medicare or medicaid should cover it. Good luck!

not trying to be mean but you can always throw away any regular underwear and only keep depends in house.

Great love and way to go! Dementia is a complicated thing and often when issues present themselves it leaves you being somewhat of a detective. Trying to find out why and also trying to find a solution. What has worked for others is putting up a schedule and possibly a calendar showing what day she is to shower/bathe. Also perhaps having your mom not mention it's time to shower and say I need your help with something in the bathroom would you help me? Give her control and helps her feel important. Have your mom start to wash her own face and hand gram a cloth and say something like show me how. Or for a bath perhaps guide her to the tub and have the tub ready and say something like I bought a new soap or shampoo and would like you to tell me if you like it. If you tell them they need a bath or say ahead of time lets go have a bath they may get offended because they don't think they have a problem and feel they don't need help however if you guide them there and do an "oh by the way would you test this bath water for me?" It eases her anxiety and feeling like she is not doing something right. Just a few suggestions to tailor or try. Good luck. Hugs!

You are so caring. Your mom and grandmother should be very proud of you. Caregiving is not easy. Every morning I would have a warm container of water with a little liquid soap in it while mom was in the bathroom. I would start by saying here is a nice warm rag can you give yourself a quick wipe in the front. Then let me help get your underpants, pants, socks and shoes on. Have the rag ready again. Once she stands up, just say let me give your butt a quick wipe. I would also suggest putting a pad in her regular underpants. By not really giving the person time to think about it makes it easy and no battle. When done i would always say thanks for letting me help you cause I know if I needed help you would be right there. I would take slow steps. Next day, let me put some cream on your legs, give a quick wipe and cream up. Once she knows you only want to help a shower may be possible. A shower chair and hair rails are a must. There are many excellent suggestions for help in these posts .

Oh, you sweetheart! That's a big burden for you! I think all the advice given so far has been very helpful. The fact you are even "on board" with caring for your Gram is beautiful. My 15 yo niece is very involved in caring for my mother, who lives with her. She helps her to bathe, or just brings her warmed "bath in a package" wipes that hospitals use. She just chatters on about what's going on in her active life and Mother eats it up. She'll offer to do Mother's hair & often helps her off or on with her "diapers". A shower with a shower chair is often less frightening to an elderly person as they are not as likely to fall--hand her a warm, soapy washcloth so she can wash herself. Also, often the elsderly lose their sense of smell to a degree,, and if she lives with the smell--she's used to it. Bless you for caring! You are amazing!

*forgot this--Mother LOVES new scented lotions and shampoos and body washes. Better than old soap and water..and she feels she being "fussed".

Another thing to remember is failure to initiate isn't failure. It's very common for people with dementia to forget the steps of any process. So may not know even how to start the process something else to think about. Perhaps having someone there breaking down the steps.

Maybe you can try to have a caregiver come in and give her a shower 3 times a week. This way, she does not have to be embarrassed by having the family take care of her in such a private way.

OMGosh I don't know how you all do it. When my mother started losing control of her bladder and bowels that did it for me, and on the white carpet no less. I could not take the stench and cleaning up after an adult like that. I loved my mom but I guess not enough to be able to do that. She went right over to a home after a couple of episodes of that. I think that may have hastened her death too, But I am not bent in that direction of work. I had come down with shingles and a twisted bowels as a result of the stress. Cleaning up after an adult is way worse in my opinion than a child. Bless you all for what you do.

When you yell at her & she cries, it is a form of manipulation. She doesn't want to hear it & she knows the only way to make you stop yelling at her is to cry & throw a big guilt trip on you. Since she is that stubborn, you're going to have to yell at her & stop feeling guilty when she cries. Despite the fact that she gets offended and angry if something is said to her, it must be said to her continuously. She needs to know that the horrible smell of urine is offending you!!!

Even though she is 90, you CAN force her. When she in bed, go into her room & take her clothes away to wash them. When you give her the injection, expose more to see if she is wearing adult diapers. This is the very worst thing for an elderly person to have to go through----the loss of bladder & bowel function. It is humiliating & strips that person of their dignity. But, she must acknowledge it & not be in denial about it, pretending that it doesn't exist.

Stress to her that you're trying to help her, not hurt her. Over time, urine that is not cleaned up will start to excoriate her skin, causing an open route for infection.

Maybe remove underwear from her drawer and replace only with the new depends or diapers that look like underwear. She will yell and be unhappy, but eventually get used to it.

As for the chairs and furnishings, maybe mom or you can make a special cushion that you put a waterproof cover on. Then make a custom cover that slips over it. Tell grandma its a special cushion for her to keep her comfy and prevent bedsores and "that you made it special"...encourage her to use it wherever she is seated. That's what we did for my FIL.

As for the bathing...BRIBE! "Grandma, if you take your bath this morning, we will go out for a donut", ...McDonalds, ice cream". Etc.

As my Mom got older, she stopped taking a bath regularly, too.
When she broke her hip, she stopped taking a bath, due to mobility issues.
Her insurance covered a home care service for a couple of months.
The occupational therapist recommended getting a transfer bench to help her get in and out of the tub, which helped tremendously.
They also supplied someone who would come and give her a bath twice a week.
You may want to look into these bath services in your area.
They are well trained and know exactly what to do.

Great advice here. I set rules for my Dad like he cannot get in my car if he is wet or poopy. I am matter of fact and don't let him argue with me. I lead him by the hand and tell him we are cleaning up first and going from there. Easier said than done. You cannot reason with her, it only leaves everyone frustrated. I'd put covers on the chairs, waterproof pad on bed etc. When my Mom was alive, she had dementia and was terrified of the shower. She was in a nursing home, so we had her switched to sponge baths. I know it's hard, but it has to be done.

What a brave young lady you are taking on the life of caregiver. Most of us here are older and dealing with many of the same issues. You are an inspiration and a blessing to your grandma.

You sound like a very loving, dedicated granddaughter, older mentally than your biological years. Bless your heart for stepping into a very difficult situation. I am an adult caring for my husband, who has dementia, and I can only imagine how difficult it has to be for a young person such as yourself. I do have a suggestion or two.

Tell your grandma that you want her to smell like a rose. That will cause her ears to perk up. Get a washcloth all ready for her, with warm water and soap, and tell her you'll stand by while she washes her privates and you will help her if she wishes you to. Give her that option. If she seems confused at any time, just help her out.

After she is all washed and rinsed and dried down there, show her that you bought ("just for you, grandma") Johnson's baby powder. Tell her "Look, grandma, I'm sprinkling this wonderful, nice-smelling powder on your panties" (be sure to refer to Depends or whatever as "panties") and then hand them to her to put on. If she acts confused, help her slip them on.

Then say, "Oh, grandma, you have no idea how wonderful you smell!!!" Believe me, she will love it. People with dementia LOVE compliments about how they look and how they smell.

As for her bathing, don't ever feel that you have to make a big deal out of it. You can bathe her in bits and pieces. I sponge bathe my husband's torso one day, dry him off, powder his torso, fresh clothes, and that's it. The next day, while he is sitting watching TV, I bring a pan of comfortably warm water, put his feet in it and proceed to bathe him from his upper thighs down to his legs, and feet. After I have thoroughly dried him, I powder between his toes, massage his feet with foot cream, clean socks, and VOILA! If he needs his toenails trimmed, I do that, too.

If you do your grandma in bits and pieces, it is not a chore for you and not at all intimidating for your grandma. Good luck!

HelpingMom82 - we keep a calendar in the bathroom. We take turns showering. In other words, I shower every other day. We keep this info on the calendar. AND, there have actually been times when we've gone to the calendar to look. Have Grandma put an x or watch you put an x or something like her weight on that day. Make sure the calendar has big spaces so they can see what was written.

If the wetting issue is not making it to the bathroom in time, or more leakage than volume, one thing that may be more accepted than "diapers" is nice-looking, well-fitting stretchy briefs and some sort of flat pad or panty-liner (experiment with styles and sizes; I like the longest "always" liner or something similar) but use three at a time--two in a vee front to back, and the third one in the center toward the back. Maybe a fourth one in front if required--or even more. Change them ias necessary at each toileting; often you only have to replace the center one. This way they still have normal panties to wear, and they don't feel like they're sitting on a lump. And of course good wipes or washcloths--there are skin cleaners that don't have soap for bed patients--every time as necessary. Make a wipe or washcloth at face, underarms and other skin folds and a good powder part of the morning dressing routine. Have several similar sets of day clothes so it isn't obvious that they're replaced as often as needed. And a hand-held shower gizmo is great! Not all skin areas need to be washed every day; and it's better for tender skin to not be dried out repeatedly. Make a routine without making a big production out of it.