Help, my heart is breaking. How do I tell Dad?

This is a serious situation. I do NOT think YOU should tell him. I think this is best handled by a professional, like a doctor. But have arrangements in place at once to move him to safety where will have to stay. That way he can't blame it on you - just humor him that you will speak to the doctors, etc. and when they say he can come home, you'll get him.

sorry for the issues, but you say "we can't afford".....if that means YOU personally, YOU are not responsible for their placement.  Check with an elder attorney or elder assistance because if they don't have the funds, they can get Medicaid to pay for their placement. its tough but let them know they are close as they can be for the moment until other arrangements can be made.  this might satisfy them for the time being and maybe won't question it later.  my father went into a nursing facility in 2014 and they had been married for 70 years, he just recently passed in 2020 at 97 and they would have been married for 76 years.  Mom knew it was the best thing for him at the time (he had dementia and she could no longer care for him), he had no issues as we told him when he went there, that he had to stay until the doctor said it was okay to go home.  he never questioned it after that.  they will forget.  its a terrible disease.  wishing you luck.

OMG Tex! How frightening to get that call. I cannot imagine. Thank goodness all are safe.

Margaret, there are many compassionate police officers, most of them. Unfortunately, the bad apples get the press and media attention. Talks about defunding police departments all over the country are nuts. We need them. And there are most often doing their jobs properly and lawfully.

There are many stories of the wonderful things the police do in their communities, on and off duty.

Dear Tex and Marylepete, these are the nicest comments I have heard about USA police. We usually hear the difficult things, and I’m so glad that yours have helped so much.

Update for “How to Tell Dad”


Everyone, thank you for your advice and sorry for the confusion. Prior to Dad’s pivotal event, my siblings and I discovered that Dad had called Mom’s PCM/doctor saying she was in a lot of pain, presumably from her rheumatoid arthritis. Without even seeing Mom or ordering any test, her ?doctor? prescribed an opioid 3x a day for 30 days with the admonition to call for refills — no follow up appointment mentioned. She had been taking them for over a week. We talked to Mom & Dad about the danger of opioids and Mom agreed to go see the doctor the next morning for a medication review and checkup.

However, the next morning, Mom’s memory failed her, she got up and went to Walmart. When Dad called her inquiring about going to the appointment with her, she said she didn’t think she needed to see the doctor, she felt fine and had never agreed to go anyway. When she returned home she discovered Dad’s dementia, need to control/take charge and a psychotic break all combined in an irrational and dangerous way. 

He had poured gasoline in the house and garage. Somehow this was supposed to convince her how serious he was about her going to the doctor. He didn’t say anything to her or restrict her from leaving, he just kept emptying the gas can onto the kitchen floor. Thankfully, Mom immediately went outside and dialed 911. When the police arrived, he sat calmly in a chair and refused to speak except to say, take me wherever you need to.

He was taken to the hospital where he was diagnosed with dementia with the addition of being a danger to himself or others. I hope this helps those who needed more information. The doctors have said he will not get better, his dementia will continue to get worse.

If he truly has some kind of cognitive decline (dementia), is there really a NEED to tell him any of these things (not going home, mom/wife has dementia, lost license, etc)? He may forget, it may upset him enough to cause issues, etc. Why not stick with what works? I always try to keep the responses vague, and leave the "door" open to anything mom asks about. Blame others. Ensure him that until the docs give the ok, you are making sure mom is taken care of and going to the appts. He should focus on getting healthy! You are his "lifeline" and support!

Hopefully the guardianship process will work out and also hopefully he will be able to stay at the VA to help defray costs. I can't say one way or the other if your mom would qualify for the VA as well - some here say yes, some say no.

The only experience I had with the VA was after dad passed and mom was going down the dementia path. Had I known about it before (mom was still "in charge", I only helped by getting appointment with EC atty, which she had been going on about for months), we might have been able to secure funds or even VA placement for dad, instead of the place she ended up getting him into. It might have saved some money for them as well! I believe he did get some Medicaid, but they took his pension and SS. The third party group I started with (no charge for their "help") sent me the forms and I had to gather all the info, including getting his military records. All might have been good and we could have gotten the Aid and Attendance (was about $1100/month at that time), however the person sent me expired forms. It took some calls and wrangling to find out what the actual denial was. When I pointed this out, she DENIED sending me those forms! I was in the middle of getting mom into MC, trying to manage all that, her finances, etc and deal with her condo - way too much on my plate. In the meantime, I got the new forms, but it wasn't a simple transfer of the information - all the $ amounts had changed (inc in SS and pension, Medicare and ins costs changed, rent at facility, other expenses, etc), and I was getting no real help from my brothers, so I let this go. Sadly they later instituted a similar "look back" like Medicaid has, so I suspected it would be declined. I didn't want to put in ALL that effort for nothing!

Anyway, bottom line is if your dad had lengthy service OR was in service during a war, she could qualify, at the least, for this Aid and Attendance, maybe more. While working with the VA (hopefully you get someone assigned who can answer questions and help you through the process!) you could ask about applying for this to help defray the cost of her AL/MC or see if she can move in too.

The little bit I picked up today is that the requirements may vary as to who can live in a VA place. Again, it would be best to talk with a VA rep to find out what help is available for BOTH of your parents. They would be the best source. A VERY good EC atty may also be able to help.

We moved all mom's liquid assets to an irrevocable trust and later added the proceeds from her condo sale. The nice part for that trust is if you look at the 2 year graph, ignoring the dip this March, it is almost flat, as if we haven't touched it! We certainly have, as the pension and SS don't even cover 1/2 the cost of the facility, never mind any other necessities (there is a substantial draw every month, and every so often more for a specific need, but so far I am VERY happy with how it's managed!) If both are beyond capability of signing legal docs, the EC atty would be best consult for how to manage the assets. We had most documents in place for her with dad, but had to revisit them when she developed early dementia. The atty had a private talk with her and was satisfied that she understood enough to sign everything, so we could proceed. For your parents, you may need to seek guardianship for both, but EC atty can help with that too.

I think this is one for the doctors to tell him. He will erupt at you and put you in possible danger. Let the professionals handle this situation. And I feel you must place your mother if she has dementia. For anyone to have someone with dementia living with them would be hell. Don't do it.

Haven't made it through all comments yet, but for this:
"I am unfamiliar with Conservator and will research as advised."

Guardianship gives you legal control over your dad and various life issues/decisions.

Conservatorship gives you legal control over his finances, etc.

Here's a better description found online:

"What is the difference between guardianship and conservatorship?

While a guardianship gives one or more people the authority to make health-related decisions for another person, a conservatorship is a legal relationship that gives one or more individuals the authority to make financial decisions on behalf of an incompetent or incapacitated person."

That brilliance can be likened to fireworks.
Brilliant people, can soar to beautiful heights and be creative, math, spatial sense, art, the list goes on and can cover many topics, we stand in awe. But fireworks either come down or fizzil away. That’s life that’s how it is.

my MIL & her son were this way. His Dad was a good ol boy and happy to be so. My husband now has cognitive impairment and numerous health issues, his mom did the same before passing.

we’ll work with them and the declining situation because we love them. Our love goes beyond how brilliant they were. This is the way things are NOW.

Tex,
I've been through this. my Dad had dementia and was in the VA ward at Ft Wipple, AZ. I also went to self-help classes there with a wonderful social worker and it was a great help for my Mom and me. The man of the house and marriage wanting to take care of his spouse is pretty common. When I moved to AZ to help take care of my Dad, and help my Mom to realize what was going on, I soon realized that I was going to now become the head of the family. This becomes clear when you have power of attorney, legal authority over their care, medical decisions, etc. At first I could see that my Dad was a bit angry and confused that I was taking over but at some point it was a reasurrance to him that someone else he trusted was taking over to make sure Mom and all the details were being taken care of. I think you just need to reassure your Dad that "you've got this" and he doesn't need to worry. Then you just need to move forward as difficult as that may be. Taking time for yourself and good self-care including a vacation or weekends off goes a long way too. You have a long road ahead of you.

My heart is with you though this journey. Hope what I share with you will give you some peace. First off, I am not a believer of a lot of drugs, but there are medications that can be a wonderful help. Not a cure but help if they find the right one.

My brother in law was taken by very compassionate police to a mental hospital for evaluation after he called them during one of his really strange episodes. He had been living alone after his wife died and depression, etc had gotten to be too much for his very intelligent brain to handle. They got his medication regulated and after two weeks they released him to his son. Not sure what the total diagnosis was or medications, but dementia was foremost. He continued to live a more normal/dementia life for 5 years. If it had not been for those police officers being compassionate and taking him in I do not know what would have happened for all of his family lived states away from him and had no control.

It is so hard when you are in the middle of everything, all at once, but the main thing is to take care of yourself. I find as a caregiver, I write things down (really in my computer) appointments, who I spoke to, my feelings, etc. It helps keep things straight and somewhat releases it from my brain. Other wise it feels like fish swimming around in my brain bumping into each other. This helps to take one step at a time. I am sure the VA will be a very big help to you. My thoughts are with you.

Since we don't really know what he did to land himself at the VA, my questions would be more about his living arrangement there. Is he alone in a locked room by himself right now? Or is he sharing a room and allowed to roam around other patients? If he's among other people, why his he not a danger to them?

Talk to the doctor over his care at VA to find out if mom can be in the same facility as he is so they can still see each other with the same kind of monitoring and observation that he is currently receiving.

Is it possible your father always had a controlling, and perhaps, explosive personality? Maybe he just exploded a little too big this time or someone outside the family witnessed it? I ask that because most of the time people with dementia do not say they went to far because they don't remember all of the details of the episode or even why they had an episode.

If they can at least be in the same facility for visitation purposes, you could always tell dad that mom is the one with issues and has to be in a room by herself.

Overall, this is a little strange. A doctor saying he has dementia and a danger to himself/others while you are being allowed to get documents signed by him. He either knows what is going on or doesn't and the medical documentation could be the very thing that nullifies documents you are getting signed. If there are other family members who would have an interest in an inheritance somewhere down the road, these discrepancies will surface in the future.

This is a very difficult situation for all of you. You may want to start by telling him that your Mom has to go to an assisted living facility and that she will be close to him and able to visit. And you might mention the expense of her facility. See if he understands what this means for their finances. Some people who have dementia don't realize that they have it. He may be one of them. Dementia usually gets worse over time. He sounds like he needs to be in a safe place where he will be cared for by professionals. People who lose their sense of place and wander and get lost can be a danger to themselves.

If he's on statins, they typically lead to dementia. The brain contains a lot of cholesterol, and cholesterol drugs mess with the brain. I would consider taking him off statins.

Be careful of letting him use the phone. Calling banks, lawyers, insurance companies, federal benefits, the VA, etc. Heck, sounds like he's still sharp enough to make a reservation at a hotel and call a taxi to take him there.

Somersaunt is correct. The program is the VA Aid and Dependence. It is financial and other assistance to dependents of veterans who themselves need assistance with daily living, institutional care. It is a separate check to the dependent. You must talk with a VA counselor, who is not the nursing home, assistant living, or a doctor person. See the local medical facility staff for assistance/ phone number for the VA Counselor. There are financial caps on this, although I was told at a seminar on VA Aid and Dependence Program that there is no cap on $$ for this program, although now I hear there is. I never did myself go to this counselor so don't know any more info, but do check this out for both
of your loved ones.

Also, you should get written letter from the doctor who said your dad is a danger to himself, and should not handle financial, medical, and other daily living processes. You should have had some kind of document long before this that you would be the one to be responsible for your parents and what and kind of responsibility you had. If not, get this as soon as possible. If your Dad is able to realize and be cognizant at times, get to agree to these documents as soon as possible because it's only downhill from now on. I'm glad we took care of this at least 10 years before my husband became mentally incapacitated. Also you should have these documents for your Mom as well. Good luck and God Bless.

Don't tell him. You have to get it clear in your head, that was then (Mensa level dad), and this is now (dementia dad). Dementia doesn't care how smart you used to be, it will ravage your brain. My mom has two master's degrees. She's 95 now, god bless!, and she lives in the moment. I'm so grateful that she recognizes me and is well cared for in Memory Care.
My point is, when people have dementia, they don't remember, so there is often no point in telling them. That's only for you, and they won't remember what you told them, so just live in the moment WITH them.
For your mom and dad, I would talk to the Social Worker, the admin, and whoever will listen. Can one of them visit the other on a daily or very regular basis? Is there some kind of transport that would allow them to be together? Even though they each have to live at their facility, what if mom could have lunch and dinner with dad every day? Or vice versa? That's what I would try to shoot for.
Obvi the best solution would be a facility where they can be together. Don't give up on that, it may be possible, but you'll have to spend a lot of time and effort to make it happen.

Do they have a specific reason why your mom cannot live there? My dad and mom both moved into the veteran's home in July and my dad is the only one who is a veteran. They accept veteran's and spouses, and I was told they would have even taken my mom alone if my dad wasn't ready.

Sometimes health issues can cause behavior issues UTI, vitamin deficiencies, diseases etc. and after treated behavior is sometimes better. I hope you are getting guardianship & also is Conservator at same time, so you do not have issues with VA or Probate court in near future. Research on goggle scenarios.

What behavior did your father exhibit that required a psych unit evaluation? Physical harm to your mother? Did he have a meltdown and break with reality?
Why? How was it related to Cancelling his wife’s important doctor visit ? Was her appt for a new condition/concerns or follow up for an already diagnosed ailment.

Knowing what happened will assist those in replying to you issue.

"Dangerous and big" sounds dangerous and big. Was it a weapon? Could he have killed yoyr mom? If so, he's not rational. I think depending on exactly what is wrong with mom and dad, and new treatments, things can change, things can always get better. You can always say that.

As to genius, be careful if he's still capable of being manipulative, planning things, etc.

If dad is psychotic and is controlled with medication perhaps one day he'll be safe around your mom again. So sorry.

Tex, you are in for at least 3 very difficult months. It’s good to have a path to follow, but please come back to us. You are going to need sympathy, and support when you are doing the right thing. This site has many sensible caring people who you can ‘talk’ to in private and in confidence, who can provide help you may need. I’m on an isolated farm in South Australia, I can assure you that you are safe from gossip from me!

OMG, how sad. The VA won't take your mom too and let them live together because they're married? Maybe don't tell him for a while and start bringing your mom by to visit him. Then after he's been there for a while and acclimated you can explain it to him if he asks.

I'm so sorry you're having to go through all this. My mother was also brilliant and still sometimes manages to fool new caretakers in her nursing home into believing that she's only there for her physical disabilities. She has always refused to acknowledge her dementia because she equated it with "being stupid" and that it is somehow her own fault. My solution whenever she asks why she can't remember and is confused has been to explain to her that she has a brain disease that affects her ability to think. I don't ever tell her that it's dementia or Alzheimer's. This has given her a way to understand her confusion without blaming herself for becoming "stupid". It has brought a little more peace into her very turbulent life as she struggles with the loss of her previously huge intellect. (I grieve for that loss as well, because it's so hard to watch her mind decay. If you haven't let yourself grieve for that, please understand that it's normal and you're not alone.) But it also helps me to know that by not using the "dementia" label, she is more peaceful. I can't offer you any other advice for your situation, but I hope this helps. Good luck.

In addition to what Glad recommends, I would stop intervening on behalf with the staff. He needs to ask for what he needs.

I would not be the one to tell dad any of the bad news. That is up to the docs who are treating him. It will come better from someone in "authority".

My heart goes out to you.

Can mom be in the VA facility too?

What started this sequence of events? A trip to the doc became a trip to walmart? Mom decided she did.not need to go to doc? Did dad assault mom at walmart? Others?

What assets are available for their care? See an elder law attorney to help you through all of this. Dad may change his mind on the guardianship and if he appears competent to a judge that could start a whole new chain of events that will be even more difficult.

The Area Agency on Aging may have resource information to help you as well as the VA.

Dear Tex, you aren’t getting too many replies to your difficult situation, so I’ll have a try. First, I can understand your wish to be discrete, but it might be easier to see the limits of ‘possible’ with just a bit more information about how your father ‘messed up’. It’s also a bit hard to understand the financial problem – why would he NOT receive the VA payment? If both parents will be permanently housed in facilities, is there a house to be sold? Will this solve the money issue?

In terms of ‘how to tell Dad’, my suggestion would be to tell him that your mother has been reassessed as requiring a higher level care than he would be able to provide, even with visiting carers. She needs that level of care permanently, so she won’t be able to live at home. For the moment, she is going into the place near him, because it make it easy to arrange visits right now. Unfortunately there is no other choice. It will be hard for him to argue against that, even though it will make him very sad. You can weep with him, it’s truly sad.

Your father is bright enough to work out that if she isn’t ‘at home’, he won’t be going ‘home’ either, but you don’t need to get that far in the first conversation. Get the first bit done, and some visits between them happening, and the final step may come along fairly naturally. Perhaps there is a chance that his diagnosis will improve as he settles down - ‘his need for control’ may drop down when there is less scope for it. That may mean that they can live together in a facility (even side by side rooms, if not shared), and their marriage may continue as well as possible.

Very best wishes to everyone involved, Margaret