How to deal with a hoarder?

Eventually you could get social services involved by voicing your concern about her well being? I don't know.
Adult Protective Services may be useful.

I have a hoarder brother. We’ve done the clean out several times. It’s useless as each time he refills the house worse than the way it was. I’ve finally come to understand that it’s a mental illness that isn’t going to change, he sees nothing wrong and has no desire for anything to be different. You’re right, it is heartbreaking, I’ve wondered many times about if a fire happened....well it would be tragic. You’re also right, most often hoarders are mentally competent, it’s seen as their choice in living this way. Only when it spills excessively to the yard and neighbors complain do authorities get involved. APS might help, it’s worth a try. Sorry you’re in this position, but glad you care

Do you know anything about her medical situation? Have you ever been with her to a doctor's appointment? Does she have a DPOA or HCPOA? I might consult with an Elder Law attorney to explore the laws, rules, etc in your jurisdiction to get your options. I'd be open to finding out what is really required in the courts. In some places, there is a big focus by the courts if someone can manage their own household. If things are close to being condemned by the county or declared a fire hazard, that might be considered not being able to run her household.

Also, if her doctor is aware of the situation, and thinks it's a danger to her, he may report it to adult protective services. That sometimes happen, because, not only do they have the unsafe house, but, they may have a medical condition that is not being treated.

I'd also do a lot of research about hoarding. It's a very frustrating condition and is resistant to change. I'd explore what you would change, if you were in charge of her and how you would maintain it. It might be quite a daunting and continuing challenge.

I was a child in a hoarder home. I desperately wanted to help mthr all the time I've been out, but only through therapy and my supportive online friends at Children of Hoarders have I been able to grieve the fact that she can't be the mother I needed or deserved. It's like alcoholism with family secrets and shame, and also that there is no cure if the actor does not think she has a problem. You can't fix them, only change how you react.

When I changed how I reacted from trying to fix her to accepting her as she is, things went better. I accepted her adult decision to live in squalor. I accepted her decision to live without much heat, no fridge, no ac (in the south!), and minimal working plumbing. I did not want to be around her because she smelled and because she treated me poorly. I set strong boundaries after working through the book Boundaries by Townsend and Cloud and that has helped me in all aspects of life. I was a possession of hers, and I needed to be a separate person. That was hard for her. She chose to have no contact with me for 8 years.

When she truly hit rock bottom, Adult Protective Services had been called by multiple people with reports of a senior in need of services. They were able to take her to a doctor and find us a couple of states away. She was demented from blood loss from a large colon cancer. We scooped her up and fixed the cancer and installed her in a memory care home near us. She recovered well and is enjoying having heat, ac, running water, a clean bed, and meals and snacks served to her even if she forgets.

My advice: visit your mother at a restaurant or your house (if you want). Set strong boundaries and don't enter her place unless it's sanitary and safe. Wait for an incident when she can be discharged to a care home. Grieve the mom you deserved and wanted, and realize this is what it is. If you get along with her, wonderful! If you don't, join the club. You can use google to find the supportive group I'm in.

She is probably associating things as her "family"

Re: Hoarding
I've turned into a hoarder in the last few years. I credit that to not having enough lifetime to do all the things I want to do, so keep the information, supplies, contact list etc for the "future," while knowing the future is too short, but what if i get the chance and don't have the data, then what?
I also have just so much energy these days and after a lifetime of being the keeper of a house and maintaining it to the standards others prefer, I just dont want to be bothered anymore. So I do enough to keep nosey do-gooders out while all the time knowing a good house fire would not be a bad idea.
Another factor is that I save lots of "stuff" because i know I have some memory lapses, and it it's not written down it might as well not exist. And if I have to round up supplies for another project I;m sure I'll forget something important.
I don't think there is a "cure" for hoarding , as it seems to be connected to self-esteem and/or self-control
Does this help any?

Mother is a hoarder, although she is considered to be an "organized"one. She used to tell me she desperately wanted a more organized space--but in truth, when it came time to actually throw anything away, or donate it she just---couldn't.

She has very poor relationships with all 5 of us kids (oldest son is deceased) and so I know she equates "stuff" that one of us have given her as being "us". A rotted plastic frog given to her by a grandson she hasn't seen in 10 years "becomes" him. To throw out the frog would nearly be the same as disowning this grandson.

I have tried and tried to help her, studying up on how to talk to her, how to bring this up--and I was as gentle as could be, but in the end, other than the stuff I personally hauled to the Goodwill, it all found its way back into her home.

While I have certainly seen worse living conditions,it makes me sad that her already small apartment is now so hoarded out that she cannot have another person in the apartment when she's there.

I have insisted that she remove all throw rugs and extension cords running hither and yon....and I think her stove is disconnected...so it's safe for her. It's just really, really smelly and grimy.

We had a huge family fight about 10 months ago and I was kicked to the curb as a "housekeeper". I have only been in her house twice since then. She's no way capable of cleaning or maintaining this place, but nobody cares, and she actually said she hated my methods of cleaning, so I walked out.

Yes, I could call APS, but I don't think they'd do more than write up a couple small code violations.

Sadly, if and elder refuses help and is content to live in an apartment that reeks of stale urine and filthy birds and rotting food---it's not the end of the world.

MrsC, this is so hard to deal with! Great responses you’ve gotten here. Her not having working heat (or AC - where is she located?) seems like a big issue and one you should act on. I think you can comfortable calling adult protective services and just denying it if she asks you. When a parent refuses to let you in, to me that’s ‘drawing first blood’ and what you do next is for her safety. Do you have reason to be sure she’s even getting food and eating? Bless you and her.

All that stuff and rotted food are fire and disease hazards for herself and her neighbors. If you notify the city/county they'd likely investigate and force a cleanout. That might be less messy than involving APS.

My sister in law doesn't have much money but has filled five storage units with junk. She tried to start a sixth unit but the storage place refused to rent her another. She's been paying storage bills for years and could have bought a house with that money. Her hoarding caused my brother to move out.

This isn't a curable disorder. You're being pilloried for tying to help. Wouldn't blame you for staying away.

What appears to be another person's hoarding is in reality the "hoarder's" treasure.

My DH & I are/were both "hoarders" of our treasures. Tread lightly as I never made DH get rid of his treasures and he never made me get rid of mine.

Unless it is to the point of being a health hazard, leave your mother's "treasures" alone.
Believe me - she will not only miss them, she will know exactly what is missing. Not worth upsetting the apple-cart.

You could be turning a pliable personality into a violent one when you remove another person's belongings - especially when they aren't causing the person any discomfort or health hazard. What appears as junk to you, are in reality memories for her.

RE: heat: this needs to be addressed with winter approaching. I am guessing Mom won't let you into her home because you keep trying to throw out her stuff. Promise to leave her hoard alone and she should allow you entry again.

My mother is also a hoarder and this is only one of her many issues. My last straw was when she wanted to have a yard sale and then refused to let any of the stuff go. So I don't go there with her anymore.
She's not dirty by any means....but the clutter is overwhelming and the placement of everything creates a falls risk for her. But either the physical therapist she had for a week or myself could convince her of the danger, I know that when she passes, I will have my work cut out for me in terms of getting rid of the stuff. This was an interesting post. Thank you for sharing.

My mother owns 3 houses and each time she moved from one to the other, she left some of her hoard there but rented out the premises. When I divorced, she let me and my children move into one of the houses. At that time, there were a few pieces of furniture (including a baby grand piano) and some boxes in the basement. Eventually, my family built an apartment where the attached garage used to be at my home. My mother moved into it, bringing all the junk and clutter from her 15 room farmhouse to my 7 room ranch. We got rid of a lot of junk, but she still had too much stuff. Now my basement and pole barn are packed to the rafters with useless trash that she refuses to part with. For example: the aforementioned piano is falling apart - it has been underwater a few times during flood season, a knitting machine from the 60s that followed her through 3 moves and was used only a handful of times, five trashbags full of shoes, broken furniture and appliances, bushels of yarn, thousands of magazines, and three fake Christmas trees. Due to dementia, she had to be relocated to a memory care facility 2 years ago. Since being there, she has been in trouble with the management several times for her piles of clothing, shoes, toiletries, paperbacks, magazines and food. She has never in her life cleaned a whole house - not sure she knows how - and can't even take care of one small room and a bath. I know hoarding is a psychological problem, but how do you make a hoarder see what a hazardous thing it can be as well?

Part 1 of my response:

My mother wants to stay in her house but she has dementia. If she is moved against her will, she would likely die much sooner and be miserable and horridly distressed the whole time. She refuses the caregiver so I'm trying to find someone she would accept because I need my life back and feel I deserve it. She's ill but has rights like other adults. People who hoard have rights too, and, believe it or not, deserve respect.


So, you're going to be irate with me too. 


Please first remember that earlier generations did not deal with depression, etc., with medicine nor was it evenly discussed openly, probably not even with her doctor. This is how people cope with the tragedies and illnesses in their lives. We know it's shamed in our society. So why would we show others or let them in when they are just going to be nasty or forceful? 


Would you call APS if she were obese? That's quite unhealthy as well but is more accepted in our society, but hoarding is something that people shame others for on worldwide television. I know now this is not accepted in society where other mental issues are. Would you continuously threaten someone who is severely depressed? I hope not. What about someone who is dealing with the death of a loved one, as it was probably part of the cause with me because our dad died when we were kids? That can often be the start of hoarding but the threats come anyway, not empathy and understanding.

That's not okay with me. And it's not okay because I'm hurting and have been for decades about this and the comments. Nobody taught me how to deal with my father's death in a healing or healthy way. I spent decades trying to navigate through the hurt and grief alone. 
 

I am messy, and I could see
myself leaning towards hoarding, even actually hoarding some things too. But I have experienced terribly judgmental comments, horrid treatment and plenty of threats about people want to "throw it all out," "burn it all," and "throw it all onto to the curb." With all due respect, that is not a decent or kind or helpful way to treat someone with depression, or something related. It only makes things worse, much worse, to have everyone treat you like a problem-causing idiot deserving of contempt.


It it took me until I was 55 years old to finally realize that I am a good person. I'm messy, very messy, sometimes disorganized and I have too much. But, believe it or not, that doesn't make me a bad person. 


I was cleaning the top of a dresser a year ago or something. I started to cry, hard, and then I got progressively more angry. "How dare all these people treat me so horribly all my life about this?" "How dare they threaten me?" Then I went into the bathroom to blow my nose and I happened to look in the mirror. What I saw startled me. I didn't see anger or frustration on my face. I saw incredible sadness and hurt on my face instead. Decades of pain of trying to figure this out alone, and from what others said and did to me. 


The only thing that would help me would be a kind, gentle and patient, helpful person that would help me the way I ask them to. I've pleaded and even begged for that for so many years I can't count. My mother would occasionally "help" me but it wouldn't even take her five minutes to start the insults, ridicule and anger. So I'm alone in this again. I can't bring others in because they might instead spread the word and could even report me. 


That's all we get. Threatened, ridiculed, shamed, forced to not have our own choices on what to part with. Nobody in my life has ever been kind and helpful to me so I could start to decide how to part with some things with their assistance. Nobody has ever even offered to help that would act friendly and trustworthy and respectful of my pace and decisions. Nobody that would let me have control of my choices.

Part 2 of my response:

And it would take me time to trust a person that wanted to "help" me so I see that they don't just want to start by being nice and then take over.


In all truthfulness, sometimes all I want is for someone to hold a couple of bags and listen to me. I would make choices and I could say, "okay, this is for the garbage bag" and they put it in the garbage bag. "This is for charity" and I hand it to them for the charity bag, and similar for recycling. Someone who would take the bags to their appropriate places so I wouldn't have to face that too. Someone who could see or hear me get overwhelmed and offer to enjoy a nice break with me. Someone who wouldn't laugh or get angry with me if I cried. I'd probably be crying as part of my grief for my dad and also the threats. Someone who could come and take the bags if I wanted to go through part of this alone.


I also have have been quite poor in parts of my life and know I could be again. In those times, having extra things made all the difference to me in making it through. Haven't you ever been to peoples' houses that went through the Great Depression?They have all kinds of things they store for future needs instead of having to buy them again: elastics (rubber bands), extra plastic bags, extra fabric, strings, and so on. That was called being thrifty back then, but now people laugh about it and it is frowned upon these days. 


I also don't remember everything as well as others, so when I get depressed and think I'm worthless I want to have some things to look at that remind me that I actually have accomplished things and have been respected and valued for my work, and have had fun times too. That's been so meaningful and helpful for those periods when I spiral down to those lows.


Another thing that a kind and helpful person could do is help me take pictures of me with some of my things that I want to part with but want to remember by having a photo. I would want that person to help me put the photos together in a nice container so they could be accessed when I desire. Maybe they could tell me a good way to scan receipts so I could recycle them and some other paperwork I might need for my taxes. 


I would like them to help me when I want to choose where to put some things, and even wipe the area and help me put them there. When I find something valuable to me, I want them to listen to my memory about the situation that made it special, and for them to gently clean it or wipe any dust off of it and put it carefully aside to find a place where I could see and enjoy it. 


My cleaning, decluttering, etc., comes in stages. First I see the easier things to part with. Then I take some time and then the next level becomes obvious, and so on. Sometimes I really have to take extra time to find the next group, and some groups are larger or smaller than others.


But nobody ever thinks I'm decent enough to be helped that way. Decades of family, friends, acquaintances, whomever, never once thought I was worth that. Nobody.

Part 1 of my response:

My mother wants to stay in her house but she has dementia. If she is moved against her will, she would likely die much sooner and be miserable and horridly distressed the whole time. She refuses the caregiver so I'm trying to find someone she would accept because I need my life back and feel I deserve it. She's ill but has rights like other adults. People who hoard have rights too, and, believe it or not, deserve respect.


So, you're going to be irate with me too. 


Please first remember that earlier generations did not deal with depression, etc., with medicine nor was it evenly discussed openly, probably not even with her doctor. This is how people cope with the tragedies and illnesses in their lives. We know it's shamed in our society. So why would we show others or let them in when they are just going to be nasty or forceful? 


Would you call APS if she were obese? That's quite unhealthy as well but is more accepted in our society, but hoarding is something that people shame others for on worldwide television. I know now this is not accepted in society where other mental issues are. Would you continuously threaten someone who is severely depressed? I hope not. What about someone who is dealing with the death of a loved one, as it was probably part of the cause with me because our dad died when we were kids? That can often be the start of hoarding but the threats come anyway, not empathy and understanding.

That's not okay with me. And it's not okay because I'm hurting and have been for decades about this and the comments. Nobody taught me how to deal with my father's death in a healing or healthy way. I spent decades trying to navigate through the hurt and grief alone. 
 

I am messy, and I could see
myself leaning towards hoarding, even actually hoarding some things too. But I have experienced terribly judgmental comments, horrid treatment and plenty of threats about people want to "throw it all out," "burn it all," and "throw it all onto to the curb." With all due respect, that is not a decent or kind or helpful way to treat someone with depression, or something related. It only makes things worse, much worse, to have everyone treat you like a problem-causing idiot deserving of contempt.


It it took me until I was 55 years old to finally realize that I am a good person. I'm messy, very messy, sometimes disorganized and I have too much. But, believe it or not, that doesn't make me a bad person. 


I was cleaning the top of a dresser a year ago or something. I started to cry, hard, and then I got progressively more angry. "How dare all these people treat me so horribly all my life about this?" "How dare they threaten me?" Then I went into the bathroom to blow my nose and I happened to look in the mirror. What I saw startled me. I didn't see anger or frustration on my face. I saw incredible sadness and hurt on my face instead. Decades of pain of trying to figure this out alone, and from what others said and did to me. 


The only thing that would help me would be a kind, gentle and patient, helpful person that would help me the way I ask them to. I've pleaded and even begged for that for so many years I can't count. My mother would occasionally "help" me but it wouldn't even take her five minutes to start the insults, ridicule and anger. So I'm alone in this again. I can't bring others in because they might instead spread the word and could even report me. 


That's all we get. Threatened, ridiculed, shamed, forced to not have our own choices on what to part with. Nobody in my life has ever been kind and helpful to me so I could start to decide how to part with some things with their assistance. Nobody has ever even offered to help that would act friendly and trustworthy and respectful of my pace and decisions. Nobody that would let me have control of my choices.

My mom is a hoarder also. I have temporary guardianship and going for permanent guardianship. I had to make the decision to send her to a mental evaluation, where she spent a week in a mental facility. I knew that things were “off” with her and she would not cooperate with me at all. I would suggest doing what you have to do, in order to make sure that she is safe and well cared for. Sometimes the “hard way” does lead to better results, especially with a parent that can be ornery and difficult.

My mom wasn't a hoarder when I was growing up but she became a "collector" later in life. We dealt with it by, when helping her move, a lot of stuff got "lost". Also, when she went into the hospital or rehab, we remodeled her house (to make it safer for her) and, again, a lot of stuff got "lost". She did enjoy the new, clean surroundings without all the roaches. Once, before she got dementia, she went on vacation, and my sister and I cleaned her house as a surprise for her. She wasn't happy that time but was reassured when I showed her I had just re-organized and stored her things. Once she saw her "stuff" was safely in boxes, she was ok. (By the way, the same sister that helped me is a terrible animal and junk hoarder. No hope for her!)

Be aware that involving APS can take up to a year or longer to go through the legal process that is required. There will be home visits which for a hoarder may make them act faster.

My uncle was cited by APS for neglecting my aunt. We spent this past year going to multiple court "hearings" regarding my elderly aunt and uncle as Social Services worked through the system to get guardianship for my aunt and uncle whose 2 sons were not willing or able to care for their parents. While they weren't "hoarders" per se, their house was becoming more dangerous due to electrical issues, food storage issues (outdated and dangerous foods in fridge, freezers, and cabinets), dirty laundry (unable to tell what was or wasn't clean), excess papers (sometimes a hoarding issue), trash that they could no longer haul off since my uncle's license was revoked, and their inability to take medicines accurately or eat on schedule (which for my diabetic aunt was needful).

My uncle does have mental illness (extreme paranoia) and it eventually became obvious to the judge and DSS that he's incapable of really caring for himself and his wife. They are now in DSS custody after nearly a full year of frustrating trips to court. At one time DSS did have to go to court for an emergency hearing since they began to recognize the fact that my aunt was at high risk with only my uncle "caring" for her. They were taken by ambulance to a local hospital where they were evaluated and then placed in a nasty assisted living facility. At least now they have medications, meals, and a non-leaking roof. My husband, who is only related to my aunt and uncle by marrying me—has taken on a lot of care for them over the past year or so (my uncle would not accept my help, partly because I'm a female). For now my husband is diligently working with the social worker and the VA officials to try for better benefits for my uncle and get both my aunt and uncle into a "healthier" facility. So we still are in a "wait and see" mode.

Oh no! C2 if she won't let you in the house you have no choice but to get guardianship! Problem what is her reason for not letting you in the House? Sounds like shes not ready for you to take over. This is touchy because you don't know what she will say about you in front of a legal team. Your in an emergency situation. You may have to get the police involved so they can witness this and do a report so that your not blamed for anything. Protect yourself. Proceed with caution. Try and have the police convince her to give you the key to make a copy so you can get in the house. Very serious.

I was working as a CNA in a horders house. It would take forever to find anything. You had to look and look. One day another aid got hurt by stuff falling when she rushed to help the patient. So I turned them in to Elder Affairs or Senior Services or whatever it was advised on this site. The patient was completely bedridden, their was mold growing from roof leaks that no one was willing to fix because they couldn't get at anything, and 911 would never be able to get down the hall. Her daughter lived there because she had filled her own home to the point of no return. In the end they told me they couldn't do anything about it because the patient was ok with it. I never worked for the agency again. (I was the on call girl) and I didn't go back to CNA work either. Just my experience. Maybe you could take your mom to lunch...work on her that way. I once ask my patient if I could recycle on stack of plastic (from McDonalds) in the kitchen, she let me, but her daughter noticed. I would never have thought she would with all the crap on the countertops. She yelled at me. I told her you need two plastic containers. Not 2000. I was able to recycle about 90 boxes that were laying around one day with the patients permission. It's crazy...

Mom appeared to hoard. When I started digging into the piles, it became clear to me that she was no longer able to determine if something was important or not or she didn't have the energy to keep up with the things that naturally enter a home these days...junk mail, for example. Emptying her home seemed an insurmountable task, but I just thought about it as one bag at a time. I also encouraged her to gift certain things to people herself, so she could enjoy the giving. She was an artist and had drawings and paintings to share. Little by little and therefore less painfully, the clutter disappeared. In this painstaking process, we found some savings bonds, lovely photographs, and special keepsakes. My mantra to her was, "Let's get rid of the things you don't need so you can better enjoy the things you love. Over time, it was easier to vacuum and sweep. I would call my effort with her a success. But, hoarding in its extreme form is a real danger. I believe the frustration comes when a clean out is attempted in a more rushed manner and maintainance isn't achieved. I had a dear friend who was a terrible hoarder. I would plan a day with her to sort through and throw out things (lots and lots of papers and magazines. We would reach a point where she would just shut down. There were two others who tried at times to help her. One was a firefighter who knew that this hoarding problem could kill her. He advised our headstrong friend that if she couldn't exit her home, to go into the bathtub with a wet cloth over her nose and mouth to await help. Sadly, that day did arrive. While she waited in the bathroom, the heat was so intense, it melted the glasses frames on her face. She survived the fire, but was so compromised from smoke inhalation that she was forced to live out the last two years of her life in a nursing home with frequent hospitalizations for breathing issues. I loved her dearly, tried to help, but her hoarding addiction won.

My mother who is 88 years old and has onset of dementia has always been a hoarder. It is not getting better. It is a funny thing she complains that the sink is not spotless but then she hoards everything in a closet or in spaces. She can open her own clothing store. When I donate my own clothes in a bag she picks them up from the curb and hides them in her closet. She has 5 walk in closets of clothes, tablecloths, mats, rugs, pots and pans, dishes, etc. I think growing up poor has some cause to it. But I also think that you hear from people these days complaining about the economy and how expensive life is costing that really my mom is just saving. I know when her time is gone and I will be cleaning her things out, I can just laugh or smile and all the odds and ends she saved and memories.
Like squirrels gathering their acorns and saving them for the winter until spring time. So if my mom chooses to be a squirrel more power to her!
It could be better but then it can be a lot worse.
I hope you can get a laugh out of this! : )

You need professional help because your mother has a mental illness. Start with the town's social worker.

my grandmothers house had a lot of hoarding she bought so much stuff from qvc and just added up I would help clean and it was overwhelming she would get mad at me t=for throwing out empty boxes from qvc because she felt someone who find her address and steal her packages since shes been in the nursing home,I spent most of the summer cleaning the house out. I must have had over 40 bags of clothes I donated to goodwill I had to get a uhaul van then another day to get rid of all the cardboard boxes and tons of trash I feel your pain

If she's not incompetent, I doubt you could get APS involved, and there are good reasons not to. My guess is if you tried that, she would distance herself from you all the more, regarding your well-intentioned efforts as controlling and intrusive.

Just make sure she has heat for the winter and leave the rest alone.

Unless her living conditions are actually physically dangerous, trying to force her to have a tidy house just isn't worth it, in my opinion.

Maybe she won't let you in because she does not want to be judged.
Why not focus on the heat issue alone? Maybe she doesn't know that utilities can be put on autopay.

I don't know what her and your financial situation is, but one of the most helpful things you could do is pay her utilities. That way, you'd be sure she has heat and hot water, and wouldn't that take away the major worry?

Dana, I totally disagree that making sure mom has heat and paying her utilities are responsible things to do. APS *will* get involved if there is no heat or no power. Doing otherwise is enabling further self-abuse. Giving Mom a heater would be even worse- electric space heaters and clutter are a leading cause of house fires in winter.

Offering to go through things probably wont work either, at least it didnt for me.
Mom has a hard time making up her mind about stuff and it can take all day to go through a shoe box of stuff.

there is also the pile of stuff for Goodwill which never leaves..

My current plan is to rent a dumpster when they are no longer in the house

Dana, my mthr had piles several feet high she climbed through, no hot water, and still used a space heater. As long as there was a heater with power supply, APS would not be involved. It's pretty standard to revoke a certificate of occupancy for any house that has no power. Thus, any heater but no power gets attention. Apparently it's not considered elder self abuse as long as the heat can run- but take out the power and no one can live there now. It's a way to force a move so the family can place a hoarder in a safe situation.

Short version:
You can't make someone do something they dont want to do, or they dont see anything wrong or harmful with their behavior. Its mental illness in my opinion, they want to show you they are in control and you can't control them, despite the consequences. Your banging your head against the wall and they don't see what the problem is.

Long version:
I have seen hoarders who have masters degrees and hoard cat feces in their bathtub. It was an eye opener. I never returned and broke off the friendship between us. I couldn't tell her anything because I didn't have a master's degree, she has a trust to live on so money was never a problem, she had education so that wasn't a problem, she had a boyfriend who was also a hoarder, so they accepted one another and had companionship, so that wasn't a problem, she read the bible so she felt she was good person, so that wasn't a problem. Her problem was hoarding, and she didnt even think that was a problem because she had all her other arena's in order. She also seen a therapist , she never told the therapist she was a hoarder, because she didn't trust her. And continued to collect the most filthy stuff. I realized I was the one who had to put a boundary down and break our friendship because of the filth I didn't want to be around her it wasn't safe or sanitary and the smell was putrid. People live this way for years and years they eventually get elderly and other people step in. I am not a hoarder solver, I am not paid to help people with their stinky thinking, that's where they are in their life, whether they are you mother, father, sister or friend, you accept them as they are or you don't accept them. I no longer could accept putting myself in a filthy environment, and broke our friendship off. Save yourself, they are cloudy in their decision making, and only put me down because I didn't have the education or money or religious knowledge they had, so I wasn't qualified to tell them what to do. I am more happy without her friendship then with her friendship, she was toxic, and I thought being kind would win over her it never did.

Unfortunately, a person has "the right to make the wrong decision". I work at a Guardian and Conservatorship office, and we see this all of the time. My own mother is a hoarder, and my sister and I have spent the past several months, clearing out the house, cleaning up dead bugs, donating 32 boxes of miscellaneous books, and repairing damages and old wear and tear on my parents home so that my father could return home SAFELY from having a stroke and later, leaving the nursing facility. She has been some cooperative, but ONLY because she has been made aware of the reality that dad wasn't coming home unless all of the garbage and tremendous amounts of useless crap was gone, and there were exits that could be used in an emergency, etc. By the time we installed ramps, made 4 trips to the dump, repaired 3 different walls that were victim to mold after the roof was damaged, but not repaired when the roof was replaced, all the upgrades, all the new energy smart vinyl windows (that couldn't rust shut ), their house is safe and clean and nearly brand new. Now the real work begins, keepiing it safe. I guess in some ways it is luck that dad needs a caregiver 24 hours for safety awareness, because it means someone at the house to help her with her disorders. Thank goodness she no longer drives (and cant run off to a store and shop) and doesn't know how to use the internet. We would be cleaning for 5 more months. She DID find some small things to smile about during this cleanup when we told her how much the children at the various charities would love the craft items and my elderly clients made use of some of the brand new clothing that were now too big for her and how generous her donations would be and she would make them all smile especially those who have no money to speak of.