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My Mom lives in Texas. She’s 84 and has Alzheimer’s and high blood pressure and a few other health issues. Over the last year she has developed a terrible nervous habit of scratching herself. Her arms and thighs are literally covered in horrible open sores and bruises and scars. She often gets infections. We know for sure it’s not a rash or skin condition. She’s been on many meds and lotions including for OCD. None worked and all made her like a zombie. Mom’s Doctor is very open to giving her CBD oil. He feels it has great potential and has no side effects. I searched and studied and found one that is very reputable. My husband and I both have been taking it and have had amazing results with relief from aches and pains, anxiety and sleep issues. So, I feel very comfortable giving it to my Mother, however the Med nurses where she lives aren’t allowed to dispense it. The CBD oil has no THC in it and is legal in Texas but the corporate office refuses to consider it. We have to have their help. It needs to be taken a couple of times a day consistently to work. Alzheimer’s is just heart breaking anyway but it really pains me to see my Mom literally tearing herself apart. You can buy CBD oil in the mall and shops are popping up everywhere. Last year her Doctors prescribed B12 vitamins and she also has a standing order for Tylenol if needed. Both are purchased at local stores and are dispensed by the Med nurses. What legal rights do we have?

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Wont it be great when this nonsense all comes to a stop and folks with these terrible diseases can be treated with a natural healing flower. It is ridiculous and quite obvious that big pharma is doing everything possible to keep a proven natural cure out of the hands of those that need it most while we pour thousands of dollars into synthetic drugs that make our elderly zombies. Alzheimers is one of the 21 approved conditions here in Ohio that folks can get a medical prescription for cannabis yet less than 2 percent are actually signed up to receive the proven game changer. I know its a matter of time, I just hope folks that are reading these blogs get educated and start speaking up as its time we stop treating a natural healer in the same way we do opiates that have killed thousands.
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Do you visit often enough to give it to her yourself? That's what I would do; you don't have to make a big production out of it. When I visited my Mom, I would give her ibuprofen and tylenol when the caregivers were too busy to administer it. She needed it for various aches and pains, and readily took it liquid form with a dropper ; no single care giver ever said one word, I matter-of factly said I was going to give it , and then just did it. I was the POA and Medical POA. The facility was a private home-setting, with only eight residents and two caregivers during the day, and one caregiver at night.
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There is a lawyer outfit called Legal Shield. You pay them a small monthly bill, so you don't have to pay out at any time. I do believe, you can stop it at anytime. You might try Legal Aid. If they can't help, I'm sure they will send you in the right direction.
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I just wanted to mention this...if your mom is taking any codeine products, it may be that the itching is a side effect. If I take 5 mg, no problem. If I take the next pill "too soon", I am insane with itching. Check her drugs to see if itching is a side effect. I have found CBDs to be totally without useful effect for me and I am also allergic to those plant products, and I hate being loaded in any way. If I end up with any THC in my system at all, I have to have medical intervention for the anxiety is produces. All CBD products are NOT THE SAME. The dosage is difficult to get correct. And you may be able to find a CBD that you can put on her skin like an ointment rather than edible or oral route, and it would be just like you putting hand lotion on her dry skin on her arm, who would know? I agree that you should have the right to try it. But legally, you would be in serious trouble if you got caught. I cannot even give my mother an antacid, melatonin, NOTHING, on my own or I will be barred from visitation from the NH. So...dont be like me. Be smart, make sure you are knowledgeable about the product, the dosage, monitor symptoms, give the smallest dose, try to apply topically to small area first, remember smaller dose is sometimes MUCH more effective than larger dose...but most importantly, try to solve a problem before you treat a symptom. See what drugs she is on that could be making her itch. Oten a lower dose or a different brand of pain medicine can be effective at this...and other drugs can cause itching like this too. Good luck!
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Daisy9 Jul 2019
I'm with you; I did a lot of things on the sly for my mother in the NH years. But I've also worked in NHs. Lotion will not be applied twice daily. Most residents are lucky if lotion is applied after their bath or shower, which is once every three days. NHs are notoriously understaffed and most technicians don't have time to do more than what is absolute necessary, even if is is a good NH and the technicians care about their residents.
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Ask your doctor to prescribe Marinol it is a synthetic CBD.
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DesertCatlady Jul 2019
do you mean synthetic THC? cbds are plant extracts that do not get you high, from hemp plents.
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My understanding is that the Federal government does not allow it at this point. Nursing homes usually have State and Federal funding. So, they are not legally allowed to administer CBD. It is a shame because dementia patients have good results with it without the zombie look.
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If it’s legal in your state and her doctor prescribes it, how could it be refused?

As you approach this with the facility officials, try not to get mired down in your opinions (same as mine) and stick strictly to absolute fact.

”This is a new prescription for Mom, provided by her personal physician”.

Are YOU allowed to purchase the PRESCRIPTION meds that Mom takes on a regular basis? (we are not, in my state). If so, buy the product WITH her prescription at a pharmacy (not OTC) , and bring it in a bag stapled shut at the pharmacy with the paper script stapled to the bag.

A huge PITN for you, I know, but the choice is having it or NOT having it, so well worth the extra aggravation if you chose to take it on.

May not be covered as a pharmaceutical treatment BUT, once you are able to demonstrate its VALUE TO HER, you may be able to skirt the rules a bit.

Remember, keep any discourse with the facility factual, cut-and-dried, and MATTER OF FACT.

Please post again with your results using this approach.

Updating. Shaner after reading all of the posts I realize the wall you are up against. I think I might STILL try as I’ve described above, having the seller staple the bag shut with the physician’s recommendation.

Hoping you are are able to provide your mother with something that will ease her suffering SOON.
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worriedinCali Jul 2019
The OP has already stated that the doctor won’t prescribe CBD.
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I am adding that at one time it was not legal in certain states.
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Nurses only give meds by medical orders only. You can have her doctor add it to your mother medication regimen. Or you can give it your self. I once had this issue as an Rn and refused unless I had the order written by MD. Mother got it done, I must also add that it has worked wonders for a brain damaged client with seizures. Progress in everything improved drastically over time including the sezures which were contantly going on in her brain as I have seen the spikes on the EEG and the reports.
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give it to her yourself.....screw them nurses/Doctors. It's not like they are going to give it to you nor her for that matter. Do what's best for your mom...it's organic and it's not harmful nor dangerous and it's also non narcotic.. so what's the deal?
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gemswinner12 Sep 2019
Agreed! I gave my mom tylenol and ibuprofen when I visited; I matter-of-factly told the caregivers what I was doing and then just did it; no one ever said boo. They would just make sure she wasn't over dosed by writing down that "daughter gave dose". in the med record. No biggie.
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The staff must follow the protocol given.
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Whether because of company policy or law (simply being legal doesn't mean Med Techs are permitted to administer it), you'll have to accept that they cannot do it.

I think your best bet will be to persist with the corporate office for an exception if one is possible. Or, as others have suggested, enroll your Mom in hospice. That is often different staff.
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Johnny13 Jun 2019
I dont think Hospice staff will administer meds, they normally leave it to the AL staff
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Would hospice do it for you? She sounds like a candidate if you aren't already enrolled. Maybe she could also use some type of gloves or arm protection so she isn't hurting herself. Otherwise, go once a day and do it yourself - I know it's supposed to be twice, but once is better than none.
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worriedinCali Jun 2019
Hospice wouldn’t administer it as often as the OP wants. They won’t come multiple times a day just to administer CBD oil.
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Picking & scratching at the skin is a sign of dementia. I find it hard to believe there’s anything to stop that. I just have to consistently tell my mother “ stop picking”!
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Please note that CBD oil is not FDA approved. Thus, it is buyer beware if one plans to use this oil.
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inneedindeed Jun 2019
yes it is FDA approved....they have in prescriptions. where do you get your info?
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Read Alvadeer below. CBD may be legal in Texas, but if you are caught with it and it contains the THC, you can be charged. There are many, many sellers of CBD online and claim their product has no THC when, in fact, it does.

I know someone who was selling online and in bottles to sell directly. The bottle had absolutely no mfg name on it, no ingredients label, and simply said CBD - use 1/2 dropper for anxiety. These instructions were not even a typed or professional looking label. Just someone's handwriting. That has the hint of prescribing medicine without a license in my own opinion and there's no way I would take it or give it to someone or a pet.

You probably need to talk to her doctor about CBD or some sort of antianxiety med that will help with the scratching. That, or take her home and medicate however you choose.
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The staff has to follow their "rules" or they will get fired. I had cancer and had to do Chemo once a week. If you want them to administer go to the top of the organization IE the CEO plead your case and see if you can get an exception.
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Problem with CBD oil (I am a fan, so don't hit me yet) is that it is not completely a benign "drug". There are studies that show that in 10% of the population, liver enzymes are raised. The claim that TCH is completely removed is almost always bogus, because when tested, CBD oil often shows up positive. Not advertising here, but I do have a link that shows which test positive for TCH and which negative. Given that the FDA has not tested (as with all supplements) and approved, I think it will be very very difficult for you to get it administered by someone in a care setting, but do wish you luck if it is helping. Do private message me if you would like to see a link I found on testing oils for cost, presence or not of TCH, etc. I will keep an eye peeled on my private messages. Good luck.
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I was told they can't administer it because of Federal Law prohibiting it. The nurses want this to be legalized because they know the benefits will help dementia patients. I have not heard of the patch - I am going to see if I can do that for my brother.
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AlvaDeer Jun 2019
True. Most CBD oil has a trace at least of TCH in it, and it is federally prohibited. So if it is something that helps you do NOT bring it on an airplane.
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Although I live in a state that permits medical marijuana, the nurning facility where Mom is, will not yet allow any form of CBD - whether it is the legal version made from hemp (the stalk of the plant), or the version (made from the flower of the plant) which needs state permission, as it carries a small amount of THC.

I presented the request to her medical team: the doctor, the head of social work, and the head of nursing of the facility.

I was told that by policy, at this time, they cannot give her the CBD - even the widely accepted, legal version. I was told that if I want Mom to be given CBD, I would have to administer it daily myself. (Since I cannot go there each day, twice a day, that set-up does not work for me.)

This ignorant policy will continue until the federal laws are changed, and until there is a greater understanding of the difference between the legal CBD based on hemp, and the more effective CBD version which medical marijuana offers.

Eventually, this will change. For now, dosing rests as our responsibility once the doctor is informed.

Hope this helps.
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AlvaDeer Jun 2019
Not really an ignorant policy, but one that follows the Federal guidelines set at present. The problem is that this is not FDA tested. Some current testing is showing that most of the oils do contain TCH. There is also testing that suggests liver enzyme increases in approximately 10% of the populace. WebMD has info on administering, and google is full of info. I agree that this will soon be seen as merely a supplement. Even they can be very dangerous when given without great knowledge. If facilities ignore federal laws as they exist at present they will lose their license at once. We think that this is just a money making thing, these facilities, but the reams of regulations they must adhere to, the constant visits of ombudsmen and the loads of daily complaints would not be believed were you to try to run one. I was a hospital based RN for my career, but knew many involved in extended care, and it is NOT a picnic, to be sure.
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Surely you’ve been advised that you can administer. There are many diff strengths and methods some good - some junk. Have you seen improvement with your mom using it? A dr can prescribe but at least facilities I know of will not dispense.
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Shaner10 Jul 2019
I give it to her as often as I can but it needs to be consistent 2-3 x a day. I have to travel a lot so I can't always get it to her.
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It's CBD-Cannabidiol. If necessary-sneak it to her. THC drops, (go low and slow) given at bedtime also works wonders.
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My mom is in memory care and uses the CBD patch. I go every three days to put a new one on. This plan works well.
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KELLYBRED Jun 2019
Interested on what type of CBD patch Name Brand, manufacturing from what state, dose that is used. My dad 90 yrs old, Memory care Thank you all information is appreciated Kelly B from PA.
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Would you mind sharing the brand of CBD oil you researched and use? I have been looking all over the internet for a trusted brand for my sleep. Thank you.
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Abby2018 Jun 2019
Buyer beware.....please make sure you buy from a legitimate dispensary. Many states now have legalized pot for medicinal purposes. They also sell CBD from trusted and reputable suppliers.... and will typically have a pharmacist to help guide you as there are many different potencies. Search Marijuana/Hemp dispensaries for one nearest you. Please don't trust online sources. Good luck.
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I work in a NH and one of the Residents family member wanted her Mother to have this and they do give it the only thing different is they have to provide it.. You might ask them if you buy the CDB oil while they give it to her...This is in New Hampshire ...worth a try good Luck
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Med aides can only give medications with prescription orders. Even if its an OTC med. A med aide needs an order. They are not nurses ( although we need orders as well) and they are employees of the facility not family so they carry the liability if anything were To happened. The only way I see it is you administer it yourself, not sure how close you live to the facility.
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Lostinva Jun 2019
And in turn the nurses are responsible for what the med techs do!! Cover yourself!!! Document, document!!
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Every healthcare facility has their own policy for medication administration. In my experience as a nurse in various settings, if a new med was introduced for whatever reason, facility educators in tandem with physicians then reviewed the literature & researched the proper dose, route of administration, etc. The new policy then needs to be approved by the facility. I am guessing if your mother’s facility is one of a chain, their corporate office probably writes and updates new policy & procedures for consistency.

CBD oil is fairly new to the medical community as far as ordering for patients; the issue is that not all CBD oil is the same so it would be impossible to write a policy to cover all of these unknowns.

If the corporate office is not willing to sort all that out, they can refuse, & rightfully so as the use of CBD is fairly new & they may just want to wait to see how state & federal regs pan out and cite patient safety as a concern. A valid concern as well, because there is just not enough scientific data and studies available about the use of the drug and I would bet minimal studies on CBD oil & effects on the elderly.

Have you discussed using benadryl or vistaril for relief from itching? Oatmeal baths? Is her renal function normal or does she have CKD (kidney disease)? If CKD have the docs check her phosphorus level as if elevated can cause severe itching, as well as itchy skin from kidney disease. Or have her evaluated by a dermatologist if you haven’t already.

Due to liability issues I would not bank on the facility allowing CBD anytime soon.
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All good advice. I think the take away here is that there is still a lot of gray area while the states are trying to figure out the legalities of it and meanwhile big pharma is figuring a way to get their paws on it, and those that might benefit from it won’t. As many questions as there are about it, the bad side effects don’t come close to the meds that have already been prescribed and given to Mom with no concern whatsoever. So frustrating.
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It's probably too early for the facility to be ready to dispense CBD oil, even if it's legal or prescribed. There are very personal reactions & interactions with CBD, with elderly being a sensitive group. It's best to wait for medical protocol at the facility to catch up with very new laws. Liability worries for the facility? Check with an elder attorney.
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CBD oil, while legal, may cause adverse reaction with other meds. If there is a problem, if doc prescribed it, could endanger his license to practice medicine. CBD has not been tested so time for FDA to approve could be many years. There are many unknowns. When I had my golden retriever Macy, she was anxious and completely terrified of thunder and fireworks. I started giving her hemp treats, which seemed to help, for awhile. Then not so much. Is it an addiction that requires dosages to be increased? Who knows.

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/warning-letters-and-test-results-cannabidiol-related-products

https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/what-you-need-know-and-what-were-working-find-out-about-products-containing-cannabis-or-cannabis

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/fda-regulation-cannabis-and-cannabis-derived-products-questions-and-answers
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