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Youngest brother has been indoctrinated into a Religious Cult. How do I inform youngest that our mom has removed him from all inheritance or do we just wait until Mom passes when he thinks he is getting his share?
I agree about waiting. When your mother dies, if you think your brother should inherit something, you can "disclaim" part of your inheritance and give it to the brother.
A will and other estate plan is private confidential information. A DPOA empoers you to make financial decisions that your mother would have likely made in her own behalf. But you have an absolute legal duty to NOT discuss any of your Mom's personal information with any family members. You may only discuss relevant information with professionals like attorneys, bankers, accountants, etc. Are you named as your Mom's executor in her will? Only the executor may disclose what is in the will after she passes.
Say nothing. He will hate you both and accuse you of talking your mom into removing him to keep all the money to yourself. She may change her mind and put him back in.
Katrina6033, while my Mom was still in good health and able to make decisions on her own, the Elder Care Lawyer say to it that her decision to disinherit my youngest brother. I did not ask her reasons, so as POA I didn't have to share with him the contents of her Will/Trust. As DPOA, I am not the Trustee/Executor who will have the responsibility of informing heirs of Mom's wishes. The will should clearly state the disinheritance, and even if it's contested, I don't believe the Will can be broken. Double check with your Mother's attorney who established your POA. He will probably have the will, and can verify for you the state's rules regarding contesting a will and disinheritance.
Since a will is done here, Urevilpt, it doesn't matter what state this is.
Some states divide estate between spouse and siblings equally IN THE ABSENSE of a will, but no state will insist that a sibling get an inheritance when he or she is disinherited specifically by an elder.
Were I the OP I would be hesitant to answer your question, because it seems sort of out of the blue phishing that could indicate that this OP's query is being followed by the actual sibling, or another who suspects he is disinherited (odd and rare as THAT would be).
You might want to elaborate a bit for the OP if your question is asked in all innocence, or with the intent to provide helpful information regarding disinheriting/wills/etc. Just a suggestion. You must do as you please. And welcome to the Forum. Remember, the more information you provide here, the better answers you may receive.
Agree with what others here have said. I have POA for everything, am also conservator of my mother's person (meaning for her physical care; attorney said financial was not needed due to already having POA and would have less hassles) as well as am trustee of my mom's trust and executor of her will, which is in her trust. That said, it is your mom's right to do what she wants as far as who inherits what and she can change her mind anytime. I would not tell the heir anything at this point.
Personally (and it is just my opinion so can be taken or rejected, and I'm aware you didn't ask for opinions) I think it is not great anytime a parent decides to disinherit a child because of their personal choices, whether it be being involved in a cult or not being financially responsible, etc. She could always provide an allowance for them to be held in a trust established upon the death of the parent, much like you'd do that for a minor child - I know a person whose parent did precisely that and it was a positive way of handling the situation. Regardless of whether a parent agrees about the child's choices, they're still their child and heir and too often we hear about parent's holding this over their child's head, which might be well-intentioned but can also be cruel manipulation. When a parent leaves a child out of their will, it is like the parent's final punishment for that child, without remedy.
My brother was estranged from the entire family. He crapped on EVERYONE - several wives, his son, my younger brother, me, his nephews (MY sons), and my parents... My Dad was the last person to stay in touch, until he too disinherited my brother, with the constant lying, cheating, stealing over the years. Final straw for my Dad, though, was brother threatening to kill him. Disinheritance by both parents was just, and protected the two remaining children from having to deal with a mentally disturbed, hateful human being.
The horse has already left the barn it seems by reading your post. Others have explained the role of POA/Executor,
I have so many questions and thoughts about how families become so broken and how we spend our time in judgment on what is clearly none of our business and how we do truly always hurt the ones we love. I wanted to give you a hug and to warn you to take care of you in all this.
I wonder about the pronouns in your post…
Who is them? My assumption is a not so treasured DIL, perhaps grands she doesn’t approve of?
Who is we? Your Other brother or your DH? Have you already spoken of the will to others and it will be YB who will be the only one not knowing that he’s been banished?
These are just thoughts that come to mind. As always there is a back story and from years of reading these posts I sometimes make assumptions and wonder how you will manage.
How does this play out in real time? YB (and the mysterious them) not invited to family events? What happens when she goes to the hospital? Is put on hospice? You need an extra pair of hands to sit with her? will that be in the back of your mind that she doesn’t want him in her life? What happens when she Dies? Is he to be notified? Are you to be complicit in this whole affair going forward? Does mother realize what she is asking of you? I mean for her to disinherit YB this must be a pretty big deal. Does she expect you to share in her judgment. I suppose the will could just be putting a fine point on an already fractured family dynamic? Somehow your post reads like you are concerned for YB so maybe he is still on the scene in your own life? I would not want to be in your shoes today, much less when the will is read.
What happens if you decide to go rouge? Buy a Ford instead of a Chevy? Bob your hair? Plan a vacation? What if one of your children marry outside their race or gender? Just where does maw draw the line on whose life needs enhancing?
Does she have “that” much money? I mean if YB knew would he suddenly become re indoctrinated to all things mom? Would it make a difference? Somehow I doubt it.
If your mother is paying someone to take care of her, chances are there will be nothing left to inherit. Her bio shows quite a few comorbidities. She may not live to be very old and the will may be read next month. Or she may need every penny for care and her labor intensive diseases may escalate and she may linger requiring more and more care to the point where facility care is needed, house must be sold, etc etc and no need for the probate of the will as the estate has been used for elder care as was needed.
Your mom’s disinheritance may be for life changing sums or just a widows meager savings. It is hard to know what difference the inheritance would make in YB life or the others included in “them” but it is harder to imagine “them” ever forgetting what a vindictive controlling parent chose as her last meaningful act for her youngest son.
I helped my DH aunt plan her will, beneficiaries for bank accounts, 401s, etc. I remember her spending time gathering her 13 nieces and nephews social security numbers, birth dates etc. there was one nephew who had to be mentioned as receiving nothing. This because he was on disability and Medicaid. Time passes, dementia, incontinence, home maintenance, private care, hospice, ALF, NH, Rehabs, hospitalizations. All that takes a toll on any inheritance and by default the caregiver/POA/Executors life. She has seen only two of those nieces and nephews over the past two years and you know it’s the one who had to be written out that seems to really care about her. It is amazing what it takes to sort out the last years of a life whether an inheritance is involved or not.
I hope you spend some time thinking about what is really important to you and your family and that you don’t allow yourself to be used and abused.
Do not tell brother. As executer you can actually set up that any semi-annual money goes through the attorney, you do not have to deal with it at all. Stay out of it if he is abusive/volatile.
EXACTLY. Whomever the executor is will communicate this fact to brother after the death. This should be done by an attorney letter. The brother can then decide whether or not he contests the will. If he does so it will make little difference other than to hold up the payout to the beneficiaries while the case works its long way through the courts.
he should be expecting rewards from his cult deity, not the mortals he probably thinks of as heathens! also why court trouble before you have to . Either way he will be mad, but he can make you miserable for the remaining days of Mom's life if you tell hime now.
Just wait. It’s not really your job. Let the will do the talking. If they ask if you knew about this, just lie and say no. It wasn’t your decision to disinherit them, so you don’t need to announce it or defend it.
The way I look at it that is information for only Mom to share if she chooses and for the executor of her estate (sounds like you) to share after her death when necessary. You aren’t technically executor yet because there is nothing to execute until she passes. Now if you feel it’s important for your sibling to know you could urge Mom to tell him and tell him why but depending on the personalities involved that could be a can of worms and given that your mom has chosen not to disclose this so far my guess is it’s a can of worms she doesn’t want to stress over for the rest of her life.
POA is not personal representative or executor of the will. That is the person who will be charged with informing all devisees and heirs of their legacy when the will is probated. If you are POA now, that expires at the death of the individual for whom you have power of attorney. The minute the individual's death is reported--when there is a death certificate filed--you will lose access to all accounts for which you are POA and all real property. Then the executor or personal rep--same, different states use different language for this--will be in charge of the will. If that is also you, well, then is when this gets discussed. If it is not you, then it is off your plate [perhaps conveniently in this case].
I have the same question! Except that I am to give my brother as much money as I feel like giving to him and not all at once because he will spend it. He's an alcoholic and abusive to the family. Mom has not passed yet but I worry about telling him every day because he has a temper and can be scary. I look forward to reading the answers here....
I hate to say it but the whole Will Thing Is messy . It creates havoc and chaos and we have People who Grab Power as POA and go about messing with other Peoples worlds .
Yep, power trips are so ugly and not the legal authority people believe they have because they were granted POA for someone that misplaced their trust in them.
There isn’t any need to inform your brother or anyone else about this matter.
Your mother has the right to do as she pleases with her money. It’s a private matter and shouldn’t be discussed until her death.
If your brother has been indoctrinated into a religious cult then your mother has decided that she doesn’t want her money to be handed over to the cult that your brother is involved in.
At one point in time, our state had ‘forced heirship.’ It was voted out, so now people are able to designate where their money will go after their death.
I agree with Alva. This is not your information to divulge. Actually, no one needs to tell a POA or Executor what is in their Will. Its private and better left to the Executor to deal with after the principle dies. At that time Probate requires that all beneficiaries and interested parties be made aware that the Will has been filed sending a copy of the Will along or saying available upon request. Once on file, its public knowledge.
You POA is not in effect until Mom is found incompetent to make informed decisions. I had immediate with Mom and I took over nothing or made decisions for her until I had to. She asked me to take over her bills. Its a tool not a control.
So you don't inform your brother. Your not Executor until Mom passes and Probate has excepted you as Executor. You then will get a Short Certificate allowing you to handle Moms estate. Until then, you can handle nothing. I hope Moms lawyer made the Will un-contestable. That brother was mentioned and told the reason why he was left out.
Your being POA means you have a FIDUCIARY LEGAL DUTY not to be discussing your parent's business with family. Period. This isn't your decision. You stay quiet. You should not be telling ANYONE anything about the will. Unless you are appointed executor this holds true when the parent dies and you have no further business other than to hand over your POA records to the Executor.
So, if you are the executor on passing of parent, you wait. In fact, this is PRIVATE business of the PARENT that only the EXECUTOR should know. Often even the executor doesn't know, and only the attorney who makes the will knows. This should not be for discussion among the family at all, it is the parent's private business. When the will is read hopefully it is WELL written by an attorney in that attorney should make language concerning WHY the child was disinherited. For instance: "I have purposely excluded my son, Norman Bigalow, from inheriting any money from me or my estate because he has joined a religious cult, and I do not trust in his judgement as concerns money" or "I hereby disinherit my son Norman from any inheritance for private and personal reasons of my own". Otherwise the son may file suit after the will is read claiming that the parent MEANT to put his name in and somehow it didn't happen.
Again, this isn't family gossip nor information to be spread around anywhere including to the disinherited child. The parent may or may not have told said child. That is up to the parent. The executor will handle the will when the parent has passed. He is free then to let the child know of his own suspicions as to why he wasn't included, if the child even asks. Those who do stand to inherit as beneficiaries will be notified according to the laws of your state.
Mom could easily change the will back. My mom and dad did this, excluding, then including my OB and YS, both of whom robbed Mom & Dad blind while they were alive. It was sickening.
In the end, mom's final will gave YS her 'full share', while still owing mom $60K. OB had passed and mom opted to not give OB's kids his portion. He owed mom and dad close to $200K.
As a final slap in the face to me, she had added a handwritten 'codicil' to her will that I was to pay the estate $2500 before the will was disbursed. I have to say, I don't know what that was about, and it hurt a lot. Luckily, I knew about before she died, so I had a couple years to digest this.
YB , who was the executor, simply destroyed this 'codicil' and gave me my inheritance. As I knew she didn't really want me to have it, I gifted mine to my YB who took care of mom in his home for a long time.
Wills are not the place to put old unresolved issues and think that 'teaches' the kid a lesson. To this day, IDK what that $2500 was FOR.
I had forgotten about that---you know, it still stings a little. Other than YB with whom she lived, I was her secondary CG and did a LOT for her. Not enough, I guess, to actually be an 'inheritor'. That's why I gave my inheritance away. She obviously didn't want me to have it.
Wow, this is stunning. I had no idea someone could obligate another person like this in their will! Or maybe they can't, if it was handwritten she must have done this on her own. Creative legal work?
I'd be hurt too. My mother informed me that I'm to be the executor of her will, and I'm to serve without compensation. That seemed like a slap in the face after all the hours of work DH and I put in on his parents' estate (you bet we took the pittance of compensation we were allowed on that one). Thankfully, she has already downsized and sold her home to move to an IL apartment so at least it won't be so bad.
Hi, You don't have to, correct? The will is the will. It's up to your mother or executor of the will to inform them after her passing. The POA exists to handle the finances and healthcare of a person, in that person's best interests, when they've lost the capacity to manage those on their own. So the will is beyond your scope as POA.
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Double check with your Mother's attorney who established your POA. He will probably have the will, and can verify for you the state's rules regarding contesting a will and disinheritance.
Some states divide estate between spouse and siblings equally IN THE ABSENSE of a will, but no state will insist that a sibling get an inheritance when he or she is disinherited specifically by an elder.
Were I the OP I would be hesitant to answer your question, because it seems sort of out of the blue phishing that could indicate that this OP's query is being followed by the actual sibling, or another who suspects he is disinherited (odd and rare as THAT would be).
You might want to elaborate a bit for the OP if your question is asked in all innocence, or with the intent to provide helpful information regarding disinheriting/wills/etc. Just a suggestion. You must do as you please.
And welcome to the Forum. Remember, the more information you provide here, the better answers you may receive.
Personally (and it is just my opinion so can be taken or rejected, and I'm aware you didn't ask for opinions) I think it is not great anytime a parent decides to disinherit a child because of their personal choices, whether it be being involved in a cult or not being financially responsible, etc. She could always provide an allowance for them to be held in a trust established upon the death of the parent, much like you'd do that for a minor child - I know a person whose parent did precisely that and it was a positive way of handling the situation. Regardless of whether a parent agrees about the child's choices, they're still their child and heir and too often we hear about parent's holding this over their child's head, which might be well-intentioned but can also be cruel manipulation. When a parent leaves a child out of their will, it is like the parent's final punishment for that child, without remedy.
Others have explained the role of POA/Executor,
I have so many questions and thoughts about how families become so broken and how we spend our time in judgment on what is clearly none of our business and how we do truly always hurt the ones we love. I wanted to give you a hug and to warn you to take care of you in all this.
I wonder about the pronouns in your post…
Who is them? My assumption is a not so treasured DIL, perhaps grands she doesn’t approve of?
Who is we? Your Other brother or your DH? Have you already spoken of the will to others and it will be YB who will be the only one not knowing that he’s been banished?
These are just thoughts that come to mind. As always there is a back story and from years of reading these posts I sometimes make assumptions and wonder how you will manage.
How does this play out in real time? YB (and the mysterious them) not invited to family events? What happens when she goes to the hospital? Is put on hospice? You need an extra pair of hands to sit with her? will that be in the back of your mind that she doesn’t want him in her life? What happens when she Dies? Is he to be notified? Are you to be complicit in this whole affair going forward? Does mother realize what she is asking of you? I mean for her to disinherit YB this must be a pretty big deal. Does she expect you to share in her judgment. I suppose the will could just be putting a fine point on an already fractured family dynamic? Somehow your post reads like you are concerned for YB so maybe he is still on the scene in your own life? I would not want to be in your shoes today, much less when the will is read.
What happens if you decide to go rouge? Buy a Ford instead of a Chevy? Bob your hair? Plan a vacation?
What if one of your children marry outside their race or gender? Just where does maw draw the line on whose life needs enhancing?
Does she have “that” much money? I mean if YB knew would he suddenly become re indoctrinated to all things mom? Would it make a difference? Somehow I doubt it.
If your mother is paying someone to take care of her, chances are there will be nothing left to inherit. Her bio shows quite a few comorbidities. She may not live to be very old and the will may be read next month.
Or she may need every penny for care and her labor intensive diseases may escalate and she may linger requiring more and more care to the point where facility care is needed, house must be sold, etc etc and no need for the probate of the will as the estate has been used for elder care as was needed.
Your mom’s disinheritance may be for life changing sums or just a widows meager savings. It is hard to know what difference the inheritance would make in YB life or the others included in “them” but it is harder to imagine “them” ever forgetting what a vindictive controlling parent chose as her last meaningful act for her youngest son.
I helped my DH aunt plan her will, beneficiaries for bank accounts, 401s, etc. I remember her spending time gathering her 13 nieces and nephews social security numbers, birth dates etc. there was one nephew who had to be mentioned as receiving nothing. This because he was on disability and Medicaid. Time passes, dementia, incontinence, home maintenance, private care, hospice, ALF, NH, Rehabs, hospitalizations. All that takes a toll on any inheritance and by default the caregiver/POA/Executors life. She has seen only two of those nieces and nephews over the past two years and you know it’s the one who had to be written out that seems to really care about her.
It is amazing what it takes to sort out the last years of a life whether an inheritance is involved or not.
I hope you spend some time thinking about what is really important to you and your family and that you don’t allow yourself to be used and abused.
This should be done by an attorney letter.
The brother can then decide whether or not he contests the will.
If he does so it will make little difference other than to hold up the payout to the beneficiaries while the case works its long way through the courts.
The client should do it on her own without any help or input from anyone including POA.
This is a giant red flag for anyone to contest a will
That would be a huge red flag
It will be messy but if he's still with this group, he may not react as you'd expect.
Wishing your family the best.
Your mother has the right to do as she pleases with her money. It’s a private matter and shouldn’t be discussed until her death.
If your brother has been indoctrinated into a religious cult then your mother has decided that she doesn’t want her money to be handed over to the cult that your brother is involved in.
At one point in time, our state had ‘forced heirship.’ It was voted out, so now people are able to designate where their money will go after their death.
You POA is not in effect until Mom is found incompetent to make informed decisions. I had immediate with Mom and I took over nothing or made decisions for her until I had to. She asked me to take over her bills. Its a tool not a control.
So you don't inform your brother. Your not Executor until Mom passes and Probate has excepted you as Executor. You then will get a Short Certificate allowing you to handle Moms estate. Until then, you can handle nothing. I hope Moms lawyer made the Will
un-contestable. That brother was mentioned and told the reason why he was left out.
Unless you are appointed executor this holds true when the parent dies and you have no further business other than to hand over your POA records to the Executor.
So, if you are the executor on passing of parent, you wait. In fact, this is PRIVATE business of the PARENT that only the EXECUTOR should know. Often even the executor doesn't know, and only the attorney who makes the will knows. This should not be for discussion among the family at all, it is the parent's private business.
When the will is read hopefully it is WELL written by an attorney in that attorney should make language concerning WHY the child was disinherited. For instance: "I have purposely excluded my son, Norman Bigalow, from inheriting any money from me or my estate because he has joined a religious cult, and I do not trust in his judgement as concerns money" or "I hereby disinherit my son Norman from any inheritance for private and personal reasons of my own".
Otherwise the son may file suit after the will is read claiming that the parent MEANT to put his name in and somehow it didn't happen.
Again, this isn't family gossip nor information to be spread around anywhere including to the disinherited child. The parent may or may not have told said child. That is up to the parent. The executor will handle the will when the parent has passed. He is free then to let the child know of his own suspicions as to why he wasn't included, if the child even asks. Those who do stand to inherit as beneficiaries will be notified according to the laws of your state.
Mom could easily change the will back. My mom and dad did this, excluding, then including my OB and YS, both of whom robbed Mom & Dad blind while they were alive. It was sickening.
In the end, mom's final will gave YS her 'full share', while still owing mom $60K. OB had passed and mom opted to not give OB's kids his portion. He owed mom and dad close to $200K.
As a final slap in the face to me, she had added a handwritten 'codicil' to her will that I was to pay the estate $2500 before the will was disbursed. I have to say, I don't know what that was about, and it hurt a lot. Luckily, I knew about before she died, so I had a couple years to digest this.
YB , who was the executor, simply destroyed this 'codicil' and gave me my inheritance. As I knew she didn't really want me to have it, I gifted mine to my YB who took care of mom in his home for a long time.
Wills are not the place to put old unresolved issues and think that 'teaches' the kid a lesson. To this day, IDK what that $2500 was FOR.
I had forgotten about that---you know, it still stings a little. Other than YB with whom she lived, I was her secondary CG and did a LOT for her. Not enough, I guess, to actually be an 'inheritor'. That's why I gave my inheritance away. She obviously didn't want me to have it.
I'd be hurt too. My mother informed me that I'm to be the executor of her will, and I'm to serve without compensation. That seemed like a slap in the face after all the hours of work DH and I put in on his parents' estate (you bet we took the pittance of compensation we were allowed on that one). Thankfully, she has already downsized and sold her home to move to an IL apartment so at least it won't be so bad.
You don't have to, correct? The will is the will. It's up to your mother or executor of the will to inform them after her passing. The POA exists to handle the finances and healthcare of a person, in that person's best interests, when they've lost the capacity to manage those on their own. So the will is beyond your scope as POA.