Mom is broke and manipulative. Any advice?

ill bet if you dont send a dime she'll have some kind of employment in a matter of weeks .
just sayin .
if youll start sending me money i wont work either ..

I am 61. My kids are 31, 29 and 26. I can't imagine asking my kids for money. Your mother is barely a senior citizen. She can't even collect her SS, yet. In fact, she needs to find work to increase her retirement benefits. You really have to show tough love, now. Set boundaries. Do not answer every phone call. You have your own life. As an RN, I bet you can ask some friends for advice and they will tell you the same things that we will tell you here. Do not send money.

That is what my best friend says. My grandmother (her mother in law) also refused to give her extra money. We used to be very close and this issue has created a lot of strife. This week is the first week I have said no and she started saying very mean and hurtful things to make me feel guilty--like how she raised me herself, sent me to college (although I paid for it myself with loans), sent me to girl scouts when I was younger etc. She basically inflicts these guilt trips on me, saying I should help out family. Im not sure how to deal with this--She doesn't drink or do drugs, but she has some non-diagnosed mental health issues---wont go to a doctor.
Is it better to completely cut her off and hope she gets a job? Or getsput on the street?
Ive tried setting a firm limit with her. I agreed to pay her phone bill and her insurance. I thought this would be better for me anyway---no doesn't work. When she calls, she complains about having to bathe in cold water and not having a stove (she is using an electric skillet)---I cannot have a conversation with her anymore. Its so bad now that I don't even tell her when I go have a burger after work---or when I go grocery shopping.

my son has quit my masonry business 50 times in the last 15 years . rough economys ass . he just seems to walk up to someones place of business and start working . they shrug their shoulders and put him on the payroll ..

The thing that came to my mind was the thought that it is better to give a man a fishing pole instead of a fish. Giving him a fish means that he will soon be without again. Your mother probably doesn't want a fishing pole, but she does need a paycheck. Does she have any barriers to employment that you could help her overcome, e.g. clothes or nervousness? There are places that hire older workers. The Family Dollar stores come to my mind right away. Maybe you can do a mental inventory of where she lives and see what may be available for her. It is not easy for an older worker to get a job, but they are out there. She just has to know where to look. Maybe you can help her brush up her resume'.

I don't envy you this task. Sending her enough money to support herself in another household is probably something that you can't afford to keep doing. And I have a feeling that bringing her to live with you is inviting disaster. I hope she is able to find a job or to create her own job soon.

Just. Stop. It.

Stop enabling your mother.

Brutal? Ya. So is not being able to live your own life.

Don't even consider having her move in with you. Tell her that outright. Make it clear that that isn't her ace in the hole. If she thinks she can guilt you into that it is a perfect goal for her.

I'm not so heartless that I don't feel sorry for your mother. She probably does have a mental illness. That it sad. We don't always know how to help our mentally ill. But what you are doing is not helping her and it is hurting you. So stop!

It is sad that Mom has no friends. Not your fault.

It is sad that she has an undiagnosed mental illness. Not your fault.

It is sad that she hasn't been able to land a job. Not your fault.

Helping someone out while they get on their feet is one thing. Helping them out while they plot to come and live off of you is quite another.

I agree with Jeanne, your best friend and your grandmother. There are agencies in your mother's locality...if she gets food stamps, does she have a caseworker? It sounds as though she needs to apply for further relief, perhaps go on welfare for a while until she gets things together. SUPPORT I'M HER IS NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY. She is refusing to help herself, and in fact she's the one behaving like a spoiled princess.

I am bothered by the number of posts suggesting throwing you mother under the bus. If she gets food stamps doesn't that indicate she is on welfare? You might get better answers if you indicate which state is applicable.

YOU COULD BE RESPONSIBLE:

Filial responsibility laws (filial support laws, filial piety laws) are laws that impose a duty upon third parties, usually (but not always) adult children for the support of their impoverished parents or other relatives.[1] In some cases the duty is extended to other relatives. Such laws may be enforced by governmental or private entities and may be at the state or national level. While most fillial responsibility laws contemplate civil enforcement, some include criminal penalties for adult children or close relatives who fail to provide for family members when challenged to do so. The key concept is impoverished, as there is no requirement that the parent be aged. For non-Western societies, the term "filial piety" has been applied to family responsibilities toward elders.

States with filial responsibility laws
Alaska, Arkansas, California, Connecticut, Delaware, Georgia, Idaho, Indiana, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Massachusetts, Mississippi, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Tennessee, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia.
In addition, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico also has filial responsibility laws.

No one threw her under the bus !!!! She layed down under the bus herself with her hand out.... and her daughter was simply trying to help, in the beginning... now it is different..... the mom EXPECTS the daughter to help....

Onlychild, take the others suggestions....one at a time.... first set boundaries with your mom..... then proceed on with your life... she is not going to like it. so be prepared to stand your ground.....as you set each boundary you will get stronger for the next one..... let us know how this goes.....would love to be able to come back and tell you how proud I am that you stopped being the victim here...... hugs and prayers to you...

And, just because she is getting food stamps does not mean she is on welfare... I don't know how it works in your state, but in Texas you can get on food stamps, which I have had to do between jobs, but no welfare unless you have young children living with you.....guess they figure you will find a job eventually..... Hotels and motels hire cleaning people, Homehealth agencies hire in home helpers, ect.... there is a job.... may not be one she likes or wants, but hey, we've all been there.....it gets the bills paid.....

Dave, ladeeM is correct. Food Stamps is entirely different from receiving cash welfare. It's just all handled by the same office. This lady might be able to get Medicaid, depending on her state and what it did about expanding the program under Obamacare, and get to a doctor for some help. I sincerely doubt that she is out every day looking for a job. There are plenty of organizations that could help her become employed...Goodwill, the state unemployment office, etc. If she ends up living in her car or a shelter, ok. Dave, quit trying to scare this young woman with filial responsibility laws. She's been doing more than enough and should stop. Mom either needs to work, apply for disability (she does sound mentally impaired) or suffer through until a crisis sends her to a hospital. Onlychild, don't let her live with you. She's going to get by, or not. You can't fix her. The best you can hope for now is for her to get treated for whatever her problem is. And don't feel you have to carry yet on your back. She'll crush you.

Vegaslady, thanks for saying this young woman does not need FEAR added to her already overloaded back.......so what if she ends up responsible, she'll cross that bridge when she gets to it... there are some 'here and now' solutions she can put into play that will help her NOW....

Might you mom be eligible for Social Security Disability? If she is mentally disabled, that may be the case and might also open up some avenues for supportive/subsidized housing. To be clear, I was not suggesting that you "throw her under the bus". At the same time, there is a fine line between supporting someone who is going through a rough patch and being taken advantage of. Your mom's behavior and attitude of entitlement would seem to indicate deeply engrained narcissism and/or mental illness.

Do not send her anymore cash.
Do not have her come to live with you.
If you feel you need to help in any way have her send you that bill ie electricity and pay that directly, never send the cash. never pay for the phone TV or Internet.
Many things we consider essential people managed without. If she does not have gas and can't bathe buy her an electric ring (order online and have it delivered to her) She can heat water on that and take a strip wash thats what others have to do. if she previously had a stove she has got pots and pans so get a small propane gas ring and use that.
Is there stuff she can sell?
If her house won't sell can she rent her house out and find a room to rent for
herself.
Is she using food banks?
Are there free meals in her areas.
Ask at her local chuches if they offer any help.
Any hospital theat accepts medicare/medicaid has to treat any patient who shows up. Now they will still expect to be paid but you can't get blood out of a stone.
What was her last job?
What is she capable of doing?
Minimum wage is better than nothing,
For Dave it would be wonderful if everyone fulfilled what the States believe to be their filial responsibilities and if they did in this world it would mean other family members would go hungry. I often hear stories of how children help their parents and the parent then feels entitled and expects a free ride.
We certainly should help those less fortunate but not become an enabler and be very sure that contributions are going for their intended use. I do not blindly give to charity but would help out an individual when I truly see the need.
So pull up your big girl panties and take care of yourself the way you take care of your patients and discourage your boyfriend from contributing. He will have to earn the money to pay back those student loans. look to your joint future and plan better than your mother otherwise you will end up as a single Mom and good old mom wan't be there to help you out. Blessings you have a lot of support here.

Right now I live in a Winnebago I found in someone's pasture... I talked him down to $200,,,,I call it the Grapes of Wrath wagon.....Nothing in it works, no running water, no stove or fridge..... but like Veronica said... I have figured it out...... I have a microwave.... I have a roof over my head, a bed to sleep in and never asked my wonderful children for anything..... they would have helped... they are great kids.... but I would never ask them to...... not false pride here, just that life is hard, life is tough sometimes.... and SHE needs to pull up her big girl panties and get moving on finding solutions..... copy and paste what Veronica said and send it to her....... if you continue to enable her, you are simply volunteering to be her victim...... many of us have it really hard.... so what.... I also have a ton of things to be grateful for also..... that outweighs the problems any day !!!

Well, really? You don't know for sure how she's living. You're not there. You know what she tells you. If it were me, I'd be on a plane for three days to have a look-see. She can SAY she's looking hard to find a job. Is she? She can SAY she's trying to sell her house. Is she? Is there a Realtor for-sale sign in the front yard? Is it listed at a realistic price? How long has it been for sale without a price adjustment? What kind of financial resources does your mom have? You probably know what she SAYS she has, but is it true?

In short, when someone is asking for financial support from you, you have to insist they throw open their doors and bust open their books so you can have a look yourself.

Does she have a car payment? Is it a newer car? Does she owe money on her credit cards? Is she being financially responsible? You may find out you're the enabler; in which case, that's EASY to stop.

If you find she truly is on hard luck, then go with her to get her help. Has she been claiming all the real estate tax exemptions she's entitled to? Get that house sold. Does she have a mortgage on it? Is she upside down? If she's seriously upside down, tell her to walk away. Help her find a cheap apartment she can afford for the time being. Find out where she's applying for jobs and suggest fast-food places.

I wouldn't "throw mom under the bus" -- she gave you life, after all. But I'd be darned well sure it wasn't of her own making . . . that she's sincerely trying to work out of it . . . and that she's taking advantage of all the public assistance she's entitled to. Otherwise? I'm not giving her a dime.

Just a side note to put things into perspective. Mom is 87 years old. She worked in a factory for thirty years . . . let go when the plant closed. She never made more than $225 a week her whole career. My dad never brought his check home. He was a gambler, and although mom was a saver? He spent them broke without her knowing it twice before she divorced him. She raised me alone.

I just totaled her assets this past year when I took her in to live with me. That little lady has over $300,000 in cash and a paid-off home she's now selling for $145,000. How did she do that? She's been retired for almost thirty years.

Well, she shopped at Good Will stores; never owned a car (she paid people to drive her to/from work; used cabs) so she never had a car payment, upkeep or insurance; she shopped garage sales; she never took fancy vacations; never carried a balance on the one credit card she has; she was frugal, but generous with others; always lived beneath her means; lived in the same house for 53 years.

Get your arms around what's really going on. Devote some "on-site time" to getting her affairs in order . . . wrapping your arms around her REAL situation. And make sure you're not giving her Bingo money. (I'm not kidding.)

Although you're certainly not obligated to do so, conscience is a powerful motivator. If you're so inclined, give her a SET AMOUNT every month for three months. Then tell her she's on her own. There are safety nets out there for people like her. Sounds as if you've been her safety net long enough.

The comments really have been helpful. My mother has been unemployed for the past 2 years-She tells me she applies for 15 jobs a day. I don't know what to believe from her anymore. She has a masters degree for crying out loud. She is in pretty deep with her house and owes a lot of money. But she is also extremely stubborn. She has an ideology that family is supposed to help out family, however what has been going on with us has gone to far...just in the past year she has gotten several thousand from me not to mention I have paid for 2 trips for her to come out to OR of the things I need have gone neglected. I think I will continue to pay her phone bill so that she can do interviews and look for jobs- She is already pissed at me for telling her this but I have to draw a limit to a certain extent. She has turned down 2 jobs in the past that were offered to her. One was here in Oregon that she turned down because she didn't want to leave her house. I think there Is some mental health issues going on but she would never go get treated. She wont even apply for disability. Maybe Its better for me to just limit my contact until she can get herself together? I have not spoken to her today but I think its time for me to put my foot down--I dont think it will be easy but it cannot go on like this any longer. Its very hard to be dealing with something like this, and as the name implies---there's no one else to really confide in.

Sweetheart, as the wife of someone who was unemployed recently for 3 years, you don't turn down jobs. You just don't. You accept what is offered because long term, not working is bad for your health, bad for your resume and bad because you get used to not eorking. Is she signed up with any kind of supportive program that will help her with resumes, maybe provide career counselling? I believe that Goodwill has a program like that. If she has degrees, is she in touch with the career office at her Alma Maters? They can provide support, networking and sometimes maintain job banks.

Dear onlychild1223..... I empathize ... I am actually in a similar situation, but not this desperate…and I bet a lot of us are - in this economy... yet the manipulation you accuse your Ma of … is born of FEAR of not being able to live up to what life expects of us, especially again in this harsh economy...
Manipulation is always born of wanting or badly needing something and continuously searching for ways to get it…. If your Mom has no close friends…etc.. there is something wrong… even at age 60 she can get in touch with Senior clubs who have oodles of support contacts for her to explore… and they may find out in short order that she may be in need of Counseling Support and shove her in the right direction…. Once she makes the initial contacts.. ask her for names of the club that to which she went-- and the names of the organizers there who run the thing, especially with whom she spoke …. so that once you call these persons, they will remember her….
They may not give you info on her per se…{privacy-Laws} ...but they can give you info on what all is available in her area so you can contact them and tell your Mom or co-ordinate with them - where she should go and find more assistance…
In my opinion your Mom is of the generation as I… We were brought up to be housewifes, Often well trained in all the chores of running a house and family… but financial matters were secrets not to be divulged or even taught to your own daughters at that time... as the future husband " does that "….
And it left us scared when we had to take that task over, and make life-changing decisions… as in my case my husband died when my daughter and son were young…and I literally had no profession….
In her case it would seem that selling her house should have been done years back, while one still had the basic 3 months worth of savings in one's checking account, suggested now-a-days, as an emergency back-up fund..
Or :Getting in touch with Government agencies that can either help re-educate for certain job-skills and/or asking the unemployment office for locations of support classes that assist with " how to present oneself within job-search" .... There is nothing more frightening to one's self-confidence, than to have to sell oneself interview after interview and getting rejection after rejection... meaning to me, that I wonder if she is even applying for the right, or appropriate jobs , prepares properly, dresses properly to the job-description…etc…???
I would suggest to get your Mom to write over her House to you so you can borrow against this property, in order to assist her….
Somehow she should be eligible for subsidized housing after such a move …
I would suggest to such a Mom to write the house into a Trust to you thru the Elder-Attorney you may find…or just plain encourage her to sell it…under your financial oversight to guard against fraud from any realtor….yet I think the idea of such a life-changing activity scares the H ... out of her.
You need an Elder Lawyer to help you through this mess, and one Appointment should Suffice to get you the right info how to start out ... the steps...and how to conclude this predicament fast and in your Mom's + your favor. If your Mom owns that house outright {no mortgage}… some of it should go as inheritance to you, especially if you are obviously the one who often keeps her afloat…
I would also keep a ledger of all your given support monetary and otherwise, and show this to the Attorney you might find… Ask if these funds are tax-deductible and und what legal circumstances....
Go to a Senior club in your Area to find names of even free advice from Senior problem experienced Attorneys…but find the main-office of such a club, not the many smaller Places they have for different subdivision locals. Yet going to the smaller place may help you find the main-office location for your area.
The Law is like the medical profession… specialized ... so find a lawyer with the right knowledge base…
Do not just "dump" your Mom, as so many seem to suggest here…that will only increase your own feelings of guilt…. instead Go on the attack of a problem, in an honest way, by informing your Mom of your actions as you go along and steadfastly tell her that your continued help comes in this form… without threatening that you may otherwise cut her off,
Although I would decrease monetary help… as I think you can't always be sure of just how little she has... this would be your way of making it clear to her which of your suggested paths she has to follow…
She is still your Mom… who may be mentally to ill equipped to cope with her life… keep trying the turn her into another direction… so you will never have guilt feelings to cope with later…
This is harder to solve long distance, and takes more time…but not impossible… I am doing it now long distance, to my house into my son's trust...
I think your Mom is a lot more desperate than she lets on by phone… and wanting to be close to you also means that she thinks of you as friend, possibly the only one she can trust.
Knowing how to make friends is something you learn as a child…that trust must have been lacking in her young years……she obviously does not trust people enough to make them into friends...
I do wish you all the best outcome possible….!!!

Take a page from the Al-Anon book about co-dependency. She is repeatedly attempting to blame you for her own mistakes. I agree with Captain, send nothing more and force her to cope on her own. You could even call Social Services in her county and ask them to check her welfare. Seeing a social worker on her doorstep would be a real eye-opener.

Go online to suicidehotlines and find the phone number where she lives. They will have a listing of the social services resources in her area. Then give your mom this number and have her call to find services. Or you call and get an idea of what your mom might need to do. That way when she calls you can ask her, "Have you called ... . What did they say?" Keep a note book of her responses and talk her through the process. It seems to me she would also need some kind of counseling. At the minimum she had the steam knocked out of her and needs to talk about life as a 60 year old with someone. At the other end, she may have a mental illness, or a depression that has her stalled. The county can refer to a clinic for meds if needed. If all this is not working, you can go there and take her to places yourself.

Do not bring her to your home. Be frank if you must, and tell her that your relationship is too stressful for you to have her there. She will be mean, just expect it.

Get her house cleaned and ready to sell, get an agent (with her permission). Get her into a small apartment or low income housing. Sometimes people use motels. If you spend money on her, pay her rent, buy her a food coupon from a nearby diner. Get her a micro wave and she can heat meals in her room.

Look on line at the rules for social security. She should be able to apply at 62 I think. There is a reduction in benefits for applying early, but at this point it is not that relevant. Get her a payee (also information about this with social security) who will be tasked with paying her rent, etc.

Get the phone numbers for help lines, food boxes etc in her area. Give her a copy, and keep one to keep mailing her when she "looses" she copy. Wallet size is good.

Sum this up with I love you mom, but I can't be around your behaviors toward me. I wish it was different, but it is not. Sorry your mom is the way she is, but you take care of your self.

I am really surprised at the unfeeling comments I read here - does anyone here understand the word medical/psychological problems... If the brain does not work well - you don't just dump a human onto the garbage heap... but I do agree with this [quote from above] "...even call Social Services in her county and ask them to check her welfare." "Seeing a social worker on her doorstep would be a real eye-opener. " It is another way for you to get possible help for her.... and if you are the one getting in touch with that over-worked social worker... you might get more info out of them of your Mom's real condition.... Think of her as a patient who needs help... don't think of her as the Mom who brought you up and helped you to grow up in whatever ways she was capable of... the tide turns as time goes... and she now needs help from professionals... You did not say what her status of physical health is...???

Wow…..dear OnlyChild… you have a lot of good advice to pick from, and I hope you can not only ignore the rather unfeeling hardhead comments, but also the remarks your Mom makes… when she is upset……. Please think of her as a patient who is just venting for effect to state that she is insecure as all get out…..I did not read your 2nd text till just now…Boy, she has a Masters..???
... Had jobs offered to her in your area…??? There is something wrong and the sooner you can get her psych-help, the better….
If she does not go for that… then you may have to cut her cord…but not the cord to the professionals you contact in her behalf…
Let them know that you can't get anywhere with her… keep records of what you discuss with them… by E-mail - hopefully - so you can just print it out and keep it in a folder by dates…This folder will be your proof to yourself, that you've done all things possible... and later leaves you guilt free but surely still sad….if things don't improve…. Again… I wish you well !!!

I am 62. I don't have a master's degree, nor do I have an undergraduate degree. My girls all have these things. Two are nurses as well. I would never, ever, even if I had to live under a bridge, do to you what your mother is doing. If she has the ability to be employed she should take whatever comes along until something better comes along. It is a cruel world out there. Many educated people are unemployed, many non educated people are not employed and can not find work. Times are tough. It is hard for an older person to find work after they lose their job. But there is a difference between helping a family member when they are down and out and enabling someone.

You are about my daughters' age. You need a dependable young man before you even think of having a family. You need someone who cares about your welfare. Does your boyfriend fit this description?

I am concerned for you. Having daughters your age, please look out for yourself. Don't accept less. You need to have someone who loves you and would do anything to make sure your life turns out well. That includes both your boyfriend and mother. If they can not do this, do that for yourself. Find people who will help you find the healthiest path for your life. And move on. Good luck.

DHilBe, Please be patient , and don't get upset, as you suggested to OP.... it seems you are a bit naïve.... possibly haven't been in the trenches per se......In a perfect world, we would all love to be a fountain of compassion, empathy, and understanding.... and if some of us were not 'hardheaded' we wouldn't survive what we do everyday...... so while I truly appreciate your comments.... what we were addressing was the fact that the mom is USING her daughter... she knows that and wanted suggestions.... and we gave her our perspective on the situation.....
If we see enabling, which happens a lot on this site, and that person asks a question, then there are some very seasoned and experienced people on here who have walked where she is walking now.....so ya, it's called tough love.... the girl wants a life with her boyfriend... and if mom is capable of laying a guilt trip then she is capable of picking up the phone and making these calls herself.....
Like I said, in a perfect world, we'd all have time and patience..... most days we are too tired and frustrated from not getting any help our self, much less going that extra mile for someone who can do it for themselves.....

MaggieMarshall your mother is amazing and there is much to be learned from her. I tell my girls to live "beneath" their means and be frugal, not cheap.

My girls have introduced me to the thrift stores where I find so many little treasures. We are such a wasteful society.

Great comment Maggie!

Just read that she turned down work. Is that why unemployment stopped. I am 65 now, have a Master's degree. I lost work when I was about 60. I took on-call work without benefits. That networked me into another company with benefits but at 1/2 the wage I used to make. Ya know what, I took the job. It is hard to find work when you are an older person, however, there is work out there. I also sat next to a person with same job who had to give up her home because she could not afford the mortgage even with two jobs. Not sure what is going on with your mom (except that with depression, meds do help). Just have to adjust and know that "It is what it is." Every downward turn has provided me with some kind of personal benefit, which may not be monetary but has had greater value.

DHilBe, I don't think the intent was to be unfeeling or to ignore possible mental health issues. This young lady lives 2000 miles from her mom, their relationship is difficult and my gut says this manipulation is not a new mental health related behaviour. But a lifelong pattern of dealing with her daughter. So the advice has been how to deal with getting Mom help without Mom pulling her daughter into the quagmire with her.

The concept of caring for one's parent is interpreted in wildly different ways by children and their manipulative parent.

Some people's idea of "looking for a job" is dropping off a bunch of applications and resumes to a bunch of big businesses. In today's job market, almost everywhere requires filing applications online, also checking Craig's List or the shopper advertising things like the Green Sheet or Pennysaver. The State Employment people can be helpful, sometimes not. It's tough out there; my grandson graduated from college last spring and has been jobhunting all summer, looks like he got a callback from someplace he applied months ago. But you have to get a foot in the door somewhere. This lady may have iffy referendes and bad credit, which makes it tough. The advice for the daughter to check social service agencies sounds good, but she should NOT let the mom take over her life. One answer to the guilt tripping is that Mom has a responsibility for herself, as well. It's also very possible that if the mom does have mental health problems, there is a good chance that she's also good at "showtiming"--one of my inlaws was in a similar spot with her sister,who made such a "healthy" impression on the disability caseworker that they denied the application.

I find a lot of comments here ask for more or less abandonment for your sake.. This is not just anybody, this is your mother, the one who raised you lovingly. My thoughts are that you and your boyfriend may want to help her prepare her house for sale and find a good realtor. You could, together with your mother, find an inexpensive apartment near where you live and help her get the social assistance she needs. I would help her in her job search and assist her with her budgeting. This would prompt her to take charge of her life and take some pride in herself. With your encouragement and being close by, you could help her in making useful acquaintances for companionship and assistance. There are always clubs, volunteer associations etc. around. This way you can keep an eye on your mom's welfare without putting your own health and happiness at risk.