What to do with Mom when no nursing homes will take her?

unfortunately things have not gotten better. The staff thinks its a joke now and making fun of my mom, laughing and caring on about her an talking loud about it. SHe heard them say just wait we will get rid of her yet. I also found out that they on many nights have only had one staff member there with 30 plus people, I was told they have at least two, but most nights just one is there, how can that be safe.This I had to call my attorney on friday as the director threaten to kick my mom out and then the ombudsman sent someone out to investigate. THis place was is horrible, they advertise that its new is is so wonderful, but I have seen abuse when I have been there, and I did report it. I am afraid of how this is going to turn out. I fear for my mom and the others in this plae.

Mismell. I am sorry to hear of
The difficulty you are having.
I find it very unacceptable the
nursing homes attitude and care.
I feel we are getting close to neglect and abuse and the making of false medical reports.
In my state, such an incident
Would prompt the state to
Issue an emergency order on
The whole facility, which would
also include a hold on all state
Medicade payments.

Has the ombudsman or the state
Given you any direction, the same
with your attorney.

I wish both you and your mom well.

I understand your frustration...but it would be best for you and your mother if you try to calm the situation. Do you really want to stay, where you and your mother are not welcome? Here is a thought...pursue a mental health facility and take the steps to have her placed there...1) you should feel relieved that your mother will be getting the proper care from people who are trained and accustomed to handling such patients...2) inform the NH that you are pursuing a mental health facility. This should reduce or stop the elevated tone (threats) from the NH...3) It will quite possibly ensure better attention and care of your mother while she is still at the NH. 4) A mental health facility is the correct place for your mother. Placing her in such a facility should stop this ongoing grind of seeking out new NHs and then fighting with them later when they have had enough.

I would assume that you haven't had the time, with your job etc., to pursue a mental health facility and/or don't want to since it may be further away for you to visit...but you have said she has "major mental health issues" and "is abusive". A nursing home is not the right place for her. It has also been a revolving door of placing her in various nursing homes. STOP THE CYCLE. Aren't you tired? Don't you think you and your mother deserve better, than waiting for the next shoe to drop (the next NH to eject her) Put an end to it once and for all. Take time off of your job...investigate mental health facilities and get her appropriate care in an appropriate facility and hopefully that will stop this cycle. Do it for your mother...do it for you and your mental health. Set that as your goal and actively pursue it immediately. Say...'Enough!' and make some major changes that will bring improvement to your life and your mothers'. Take the bull by the horns and get some things done...permanently.

Good luck...I wish you peace and hope you seek-out a better solution than getting mad, sick, not eating etc. Stop dancing with nursing homes...pursue a mental health facility. That is the right thing to do.

Missmel, I do not have any advice except to tell you that your post makes me so sad and angry because we are going though something very similar.

Now they are sitting around laughing at her and making fun of her - really? Can you not take calls for a while and send someone else in to check on her? Maybe even the attorney.

Hugs to you!!!

so here we go again. I got a call yesterday at work informing me from the director of the nh that my mom HAD to leave by 6:00 pm. I told them I was not and could not get her . He said I had to I told her i had rights and they could not kick her out, THat started a war, so I had to call the attorney in tears wondering what was I going to do. Then I had to call the dept of aging and the ombudsmanand they were out in no time. The nursing hime said my my tried to hurt herself and so that is why she had to go which was a lie she never did.They sent her to the hosp which in turn sent her back which mad the nh furious. Now they are sitting around laughing at her and making fun of her, I dont live close to check in on her so I am afraid of what they are going to do to her.The director laughed at me on the phone when I said I was calling my attorney she said bring it on. Needless to say they are pissed at me and my mom and her care is being harmed. My understanding if they cant take care of her then they need to find a place for her. This is making me sick I cant sleep eat, you name it. Any advice

There has got to be a better place for you Mom. Sounds like minimal care & no caring. In the mean time try to just keep going & don't let them beat you down. Have faith.

yet another issue, NH called me yesterday and said come get your mom we can;t help her . Well I was on my way to work and said I can't .I decided to contact my attorney to find out what my rights were for my mom. I found out that by laugh the nh can not kick her out. They have to have written documation that shows the issues and why they cant take or help her. They told me to take her to the state hosp which is three hours away.one way. they said you have to take her not us. So after contacting my attorny I called them back but they refused to talk to me. They also told me that morning that my mom was refusing to eat or take her meds. That was a lie. They have not been giving her meds to her at times if she is asleep they leave them on the table and most times they are gone when she wakes up. I have called and reported them so will see. I lived two hours away so I can;t just pop in but try once a week. My attorney said if I sigh her out that it becomes my problem so that is why the nh is pushing for me to do it so they dont have to. Wow what a bunch of garbage . They are suppose to be helping me and now all it is , is misery on my part. I am afraid now what else I will find out

@ shakingdustoff: I too believe in the sanctity of life from the moment of conception to the last natural breath. The key word here is "natural". I was not at any time alluding to euthanasia as some have misconstrued. I just do not believe in the artificial concept of keeping someone going through medication or other artificial means. Re your Mother's soul, that is between her and her God. It is not for us to intervein with our wishes & beliefs. No matter how well ment. My heart goes out to you. May you find strength to allow Gods will.

@ sunflo - that is what I experienced. Only when I was suffering PTSD attacks, was in tears and saying I could not do this any longer did the "system" step in. In our system, the stress of the caregiver is factored in - not too soon, I might add.

@missmel - your mother needs professional mental health care, and a geriatric psychiatrist. As sunflo says, as long as you accept her back the system will continue to dump her on you. Be firm that you can no longer deal with her. I have found that social workers will try to palm things off on you. Don't accept that. My mother never said she loved me either. Due to her disorder, she is incapable of normal love. It is something I have had to accept, and grieve for the mother I needed and never had.
Keep in touch and do something good for you today. ((((((hugs)))))

Consult her physician who has the medical history with her including her psychiatrist or neurologist. Have them refer you or her to geriatric psychiatrist.

Also speak with the NH. Typically they can't just discharge your mom without her having a care plan if she is not competent. That said....they will pressure YOU and family to take her. Don't. Refuse their calls and refuse to assume discharge and responsibility.

They can consult with local behavioral center, etc. to find suitable placement. There are limited geriatric psych care facilities and they may not be located near where she lives or near family, but at least they exist and you have choices. I've heared to always visit and get references as some are better than others.

Sorry you and your mom are going thru yet another crisis. You both need help, and mom will get what she needs. If you take charge, the system will continue to dump on you just to get her out of their system...don't take her, is my advice otherwise the entire onus is on you to secure care for her and you need more help at this point.

I just read the other posts, including the additional info you provided, missmel....first of all, you have not failed. I understand why you may think you have, though. I think it must be a common trait in children with a parent who has a mental illness. I, also, have spent years blaming myself for every thing that goes wrong for my mom. The truth is, neither of us have "failed". We are in what feels like a no-win situation. We cannot be blamed for this. We have a severely flawed system that falls far short of meeting the needs of people in this predicament. So please do not blame yourself. It's like being given a job to do, but only given one quarter of the tools necessary to do it with. The only time we "fail" is when we do not care. Obviously, you care a great deal, and you always have.

Your mom never said she loved you.....and you know what? Neither did mine. I cannot remember a single time in my childhood when my mom ever acted loving toward me. But don't believe that the love doesn't exist, because it does, I assure you. Some people are completely incapable of showing any form of affection whatsoever. I don't know why, but I do know that you and I both have experienced this from our own moms. It was hard (if not impossible) for me to form bonds with other women. Took me years. How could I, when the primary nurturer in my life never showed me how that's done? I got through all this, and so will you.

Now that I know more of what you're dealing with, I can see that my first post was premature and not of any help. The other people posting here all have awesome advice.

I just want you to know that you're not alone, this is not your fault, you are not responsible for your mother's happiness (only she can take that responsibility) and you will get through this and come out the other side ok. But you must take care of you and put yourself first for a change.

I grew up with a mom who was mentally ill, so I really do know what you're going through. It was h*ll. From my experience, you will need to have a doctor state that she has need to remain hospitalized because she is unstable and is a risk to herself and/or others. If your mom is uncooperative with this, you will have to have a judge court order her to be involuntarily committed. If finances are drained and/or there are no facilities willing to admit her, then most likely she will be ordered by a judge to receive treatment as an inpatient at a state psychiatric hospital, against her will. Most of those hospitals have geriatric units, and this is most likely where she will need to go.

I'm so sorry for what you're going through. My mom wasn't suicidal, but she was psychotic and was in and out of many facilities. Like your mom, most of those places washed their hands of her in the end. You will get through this, I only wish I could say that it was easy. It isn't, and you already know that. I'm wishing you and your mom a good outcome. Don't give up.

I just read back over all the comments and suggestions by the wonderful caring folks on this forum. I am left with deep sorrow for all b/c each of you have been touched by the issues surrounding the care of older adults who present with any number of physical and mental issues that require 'someone' to care for them. It makes me so angry that we have to do so much 'on the job training' without the support and guidelines we need. I finally was referred to a Geriatric Care Manager These folks have masters in the field of geriatric care management and like CFCRochester said, they know all the in/out of the facilities and laws etc. She has saved what sanity I had left after I found her, but at $60.00 an hour, not everyone can afford these services and I am not sure how much longer I can. My husbands son decided we should get his dad an apartment (that his dad was demanding) and then just walk away and eventually someone would call the police on him. Such desperation shows the affect this type of situation has on the family. I am madder than h*ll that we are all out here flailing along, trying to find what works and what is available. Then I look down the road and, hey, we are going to be the ones in need of care! There are thousands of us out here in the same situation and maybe we need to stop being invisible and bring all this to the attention of the movers and shakers…but…we are all so exhausted and overwhelmed that the thought of adding more to our plate just makes me (us) shut down. Sigh. Sorry for venting…wore me out writing it and probably wore ya'll out reading it.

Shakingdust, I happen to agree with you about euthanasia but for entirely different reasons. But I lurch with violent disagreement on the subject of whether you have any right to impose your beliefs on your mother. God gave us free will, did He not? You think you know better?

I know that this is hard on you. But, why does every one always want to call in Adult Services, rely on Mom being medicated, and look to have person put away. Maybe she just wants an end to all of it! Many times our loved ones want to just get it over with . The anger & "abusiveness" could be reaction to not listening or paying attention to their wishes. I do not believe in preserving "life" at all costs, and many of our elders do not either.

(((((((Hugs)))))) missmel - you are in a horrible situation, There are a number of us here whose mothers are not loving, to put it kindly. Mental illness is not dealt with very well in my experience. I am in Canada so the resources may be different, It took 95 years for mother too be diagnosed with a personality disorder, and another several years of increasing paranoia before the medical system got involved. She is nearly 102 now and temporarily in a geriatric psychiatric hospital and will be placed in a mental health care facility (assisted living) in some months. She refuses to take any meds for her condition, and as talked of suicide a few times. That is when the case manager and geriatric psychiatrist jumped into action.

First of all YOU have not failed. The system may have failed, the NH may have failed, your mother may have failed, but you have NOT failed. You have done and are doing everything a loving daughter could do - and more. Again some of our others have passed on the message to us that we have never done enough or well enough. Try to realise that is a lie, and let the guilt go. There are some suggestions above how to get help for your mother.

I am concerned for you -where do you go? You need to protect yourself and your family. A few people here have turned their parent over to the care of the state as they could no longer do it.

It is not your fault that your mother is in this condition, you did not cause it, and only the professionals can provide solutions.

Put yourself and your children first. Tell the sw, the APS, her doctor, your doctor etc - that you cannot do this any more. It is too much for you, You are done caregiving for years and need a break. Let them take over. You need time to heal and take care of you and your kids. ((((((((((hugs))))))))))) and keep in touch

I also work 40 plus hours a week and have two kids with activities to run them to. THere is no time for me, ever. who know anymore

my mom was diagnosed in 97 with parkinson disease and its been rocky ever since I have had numerous issues with her falling and hurting herself with this. i have no one to help me , I live in another state I am 2 hours away from her right now. This time it all started with an auto accident she has gotten worse since then. SHe has been in 4 places now, one being the state hospital where she was in a area that was short term only and did not deal with geriatrics as patients so I spent hours upon hours searching again only to find this place now which is horrible and should be shut down for abuse and other things , but now they want her to leave here. I have spent my whole life never feeling like I have done the right thing and now years after my dad passed from having kidney disease and dying from a car accident, my mom is sick. I cant find anywhere for her so I feel like I have failed again. She has made numerous sucide attempts all my life and so I dont know what to do anymore. I know mental illness runs in the family , her mother was abusive to her. It is sad to say that I grew up never hearing her tell me that she loved me , and now understand that her mom did the same. where does one go after years of this?

Pay=psy
Sorry, hyperactive auto correct

It sounds like you have been working with wharehouses. I can see why somewhere along this journey has not had a care meeting to discuss this and have some options presented. A person that tries to kill themselves wants/needs help. There are elder behavior facilities. They usually try to stabilize the
PTs with meds and standard pay treatments, if judged useful. I find it funny no professional never made a suggestion what to do.
Seek out a elder pay. Contact your state medical school and ask for assistance in locating one. Also, if Medicare/Medicaid is paying, you may appeal to give you a few days to get your ducks in a row.
Good luck

Chimonger - sounds like your mom had undiagnosed/untreated bipolar illness. The SW who said "You could call APS, but they would only investigate YOU for abusing your elder, which would follow you forever, making other problems" may have been covering her own butt, because an unfounded case does not follow anyone at all, let alone forever, and if you were calling because a person was a danger to themselves, its quite a different investigation in any event. I would also vote for a geropsychiatric facility. A regular skilled nursing facility can't handle what is being described here and has to protect other residents as well. I do not see why they have not suggested that to you, nor why she cannot get Medicaid instead of having you try to cover the full cost of her care!

My heart goes out to you!! I have had 2 family members to be stricken with this awful disease, so I sincerely feel your pain, fear & frustration. Another avenue you could try is Adult Protective Services. There has to be help out there for you. May God be with you!

There are a few things which come to mind (My mother was also kicked out of an Assisted living Memory Care unit). Make sure you have a good psychologist, and make sure your mom takes all the meds s/he prescribes (My mom was eventually able to get on the right meds, she is still living with dad at home for now). Then get in touch with a good Social Worker or Geriatric Case Manager. They know all the ins and outs of the laws in your state, and they will know all the places she could go to. Around here (Upstate NY) we have "locked" geriatric facilities, which are different from "Psycho Wards" for the criminally insane, or other kinds of adult mental disorders. That might be a solution. But the Case Manager will know.

I feel terribly about what you are going through! It should NEVER happen that way, but too often does. There seem to be disconnects and insufficiencies in systems, making them inadequate to deal with long-term mental issues.
We had trouble when Mom lived with us 6 years; I'd known she had 'special' problems all her life, undiagnosed, she simply 'got by'--rather amazingly, sometimes. But her behaviors never allowed her to have sustained good times, very often...depression, hyped-up for projects never finished, running off for days at a time leaving kids alone, at least one official suicide attempt prior to a sibling's wedding, hints at multiple personalities---it's been a crazy train ride.
Here, she kept escalating, to the point of getting physically violent sometimes, making threats [some she made good on], and creating chaos, not just for us, but in her surroundings. It was finally threatening both my partner's and my health; our son moved out never to return for even a visit.
We were told by multiple Social Workers, there was basically no recourse for getting help, told that nursing homes that knew of Mom's behaviors would never allow her to be placed in those, and, if there was a problem, pretty much there was NO protections for Caregivers.
One Social Worker said "You could call APS, but they would only investigate YOU for abusing your elder, which would follow you forever, making other problems". [[I was almost desperate enough to do that]]
After much calling, including contacting the Suicide Prevention Hotline in one episode of extremis, I learned:
==there's no protections for caregivers;
==call 911 to file a formal reports, which starts a file on the person;
==call 911 to request 'wellness-checks' if the elder is living in their own home, or even in yours or a facility;
==call your local Area Agency on Aging to learn what resources or solutions they might suggest;
==call for a Social Worker come to the house to do a 'formal, in-home evaluation' of your elder's situation if they live at home--any home [[we did--basically useless, but good to go through the hoops--Mom was able to hold out showing basically within normal limits for the 2 hrs they were here--then blew her gaskets AFTER they left! Also, The Workers kept asking Mom if she wanted to move out of here to somewhere more appropriate--she said no. They also asked if they could see her room--she refused; and, they let her get away with returning to her room to gather her wits, a few times during the interview--which prevented her showing deficits--she'd return to the interview refreshed.]];
==write a letter to her Doc, using one-liner fact statements, of her behaviors, for her file [[we did this: it resulted in her getting caught-out at 'drug-seeking', which then was on-file--it was otherwise very hard for officials to 'catch-her-out'--so that was one little 'win' at getting some evaluation remark on file]]
==IF elder is hospitalized for an acute medical issue, tell them to please do a Psych evaluation. This will usually fail, unless the elder is flagrantly exhibiting behaviors--mine was cool--able to be a show-timer to the hilt, but it was in her files that it was asked for. The hospital psych eval was very short, but because I'd told them of her [old] suicide attempt, and that she'd threatened more lately, they put a sitter in her room;
==when the person is currently IN a facility of any kind, that facility is legally responsible for that patient--either must figure how to deal with the elder, or find a new place for the elder--they will try hard to force family, even a friend, to take the person home with them, even for a visit---it's a game of 'hot-potato'. IF family tells the facility "It's unsafe for her to be here anymore, she is a danger to herself and to us, and we have other issues to deal with that preclude her returning to our home, EVER."
In your instance, she's already in a facility--they may not like it, may lack adequate staff to properly care for her--they MUST find her a proper facility, since she is a danger to herself and/or others.
They are NOT allowed to force family, nor friends, to take her home.
A psychiatrist needs to evaluate her to learn if some medications might be helpful, and prescribe them. That could help staff in facilities, if her mental health issues are under better control.
You can work with them, let them know you are concerned, but that due to your own health issues, and for your Mom's own safety, she needs some level of hospitalization, that you cannot in any way provide.
We got lucky, in a very painfully ugly way, that Mom was so terrified of being placed in some facility, even a nice assisted living or even in her own apartment, that she managed to slowly orchestrate and carry out plans to MAKE other family take her in, then cut us off from family using them. She hasn't spoken a coherent word to me in over 2 years; her anger and delusions can be epic.
It could end up similar for you.
PLEASE avoid feeling guilty for not taking your mom into your home!
FIRST, you must be your own best advocate.
NEXT, you must be your immediate family's best advocate [kids, partner].
AFTER that, you honor your Mom best by getting proper care for her---that is NOT necessarily in one's own home.
Honoring your parents includes placing them in housing or facility that can care for her, to prevent her harming herself or others. You may be running out of nursing homes--have you checked what mental hospitals are anywhere in your region? That may be her best choice.
You are not alone--plenty people with mental issues, behavioral issues are falling through cracks between systems, since most long-term mental hospitals got closed during Reagan's admin.
I truly hope you can find help--keep calling various offices--including Social Work, Welfare, the closest hospitals' mental health department, whatever mental hospitals might exists, her Doc, her Psychiatrist?
Keep trying!
Keep asking, and keep records of her behaviors.
Keep us posted!

I did not mean to state the the mother was actually a danger to herself or others (though she may be and is in the sense of verbal abuse). I was suggesting this sweet beaten down daughter just call and say that her mother was a danger and let the 'system' define that as they will. I call this an intervention for the health of the daughter since no one is helping her and all she gets is another facility kicking her mom to the curb. Granted, the 'right' doctor (good luck) and the 'right' medications (good luck) would be the perfect sceniero but all that takes a long time and there is no guarantee the daughter can find them before her mom is booted out. I know the right doc and Rx can rock your world and make things so much better…it only took me 5 L-O-N-G years to get that combo! I don't think this daughter has five more years to search for that perfect combo of doc and Rx.

I am going to make great assumptions: It sounds like your mother might have both a personality disorder (multiple suicide attempts, aggressive abusive behaviors especially if they were present prior to the Parkinson) along with the Parkinson disease. She might find her value in the fact that others attempt to rescue her, and push them away to test her value to others. Since she internally feels she is worthless, no amount to rescuing is ever going to make her feel adequately valued. That is difficult for those around her, you, hospitals, homes. Reinforcing her perception that she is "helpless, hopeless, and unlovable" by inpatient mental health care may not work. All she would need to do is say she is no longer a danger to herself or others, and the hospital or ER would have to release her.

So, all that being said, you as her caring child are in a very difficult spot. She would have to be committed by the courts as unable to keep herself safe. This currently is very difficult due to lack of housing resources and that the law currently favors individual rights.

Find yourself a counselor, as this will be a long and frightening process. See if you can get her evaluated by Aging and Disabled services who might have placement for her based on finding her in need, which may not happen. See if you can get her connected to a mental health provider who can medicate her for Parkinson, which she might be willing to do, and secondary but maybe more importantly the mental health issues. Some meds conveniently overlap.

The next part is the hard part. She may not remain in treatment or housing. Check with Adult protective services, let them know about the treatment failure of several prior settings. They might be able to appoint a legal guardian for her. Notice in most of this I used the word "might", and for good reason. It also might not work, but do keep letting them know with each episode, have them make a record. The cumulative record might (yep, that word again) make a difference down the road.

Do get some professional help for yourself. I could not manage what you are dealing with, few people could on their own.

I agree with everyone. There are doctors who can treat this as an urgency and give you a letter for submission to what he/she can possibly term the correct facility. Let your doctor guide you and furnish you with the necessary medical documentation for the facility. I hope you find the help you nedd and wish you all the best.

I think you need to get a doctor to arrange a medical and psychological evaluation of your mother. If she attempted to harm herself she should be eligible for a stay at some state hospital with a medical health component.

Long term after the evaluation, you should insist on a placement for her. In this case, you don't want her in your home if she presents a danger to others. The evaluation should reveal the likelihood of her harming herself or others in the future.
Take care.

When all else fails and the patient wasn.t or can't cooperate you can call Adult Protectives Services I have called them myself not that I or anyone else was abusing my mother she was causing the problem herself and when you get them involved they can help with any problem that the patient is causing. They are the state and there will be somewhere they can place your mother. It might mean she may have to be transported to another state for impatient care but this is just about what going to happen if your state doesn't have a place. This is to protect you as well so that things want back fire against you.

I think the nursing home(s) were/are saying that they are not set-up to handle your mother. I agree with others who have suggested you need to pursue the mental health route, those in that field are organized with facilities, staff and treatments for all kinds of behaviors and issues...especially those that are at an elevated level. In general, nursing homes are not intended or designed for patients or issues which your mother has. There's probably regulations and concerns for the safety of their staffs and other patients/residents. There should be a variety of mental health organizations in your area or an organization that can steer you in the right direction to get you started. You may have to consider placing her in a facility that is miles away and will limit your visiting and involvement, but sounds like you and your mother have reached a crossroads for a major life change, and while different, it shouldn't be looked upon as a bad thing, for either of you.

I salute you for your devotion for and care of your mother. I wish you...peace.