POA blocking family from information. Is there any recourse?

The first question that popped into my mind is the one SelfishSiblings asked. Is there money involved here? Someone worried about an inheritence? Concerned about how Grandmother's money is being spent? If those are the main issues here, see a lawyer.

I assume that your Aunt was the fulltime caregiver when she "did not wish to care for her any longer." Is that correct? As the POA and Medical Proxy, Aunt had the legal authority and the moral obligation to decide what level of care would be in Grandmother's best interest. As the caregiver she also had the most intimate knowledge of the situation. Aunt's responsibility was to determine what was best for Grandmother, not to hand out opportunities to other family members. Sometimes care in a private home is NOT the best option, no matter how many well-meaning relatives are willing to provide it.

So maybe Aunt is a selfish, spiteful person who just wants to antagonize other family members for her own reasons and she placed Grandmother in a NH as part of that agenda. And maybe she made an excruitatingly difficult decisions based on her close knowledge in the best interests of her mother. We on this board certainly don't have enough information to judge that. Maybe you do. But maybe your judgment is clouded a bit by the filter of the "family rift."

You say that "up until now, the nursing home never had any issue with us calling and visiting." Do you mean that out of the blue, with no provocation or incident or reason, Aunt just suddenly decided to pull rank out of pettiness? That seems a little unlikely to me, but I suppose it is possible. You say that "my family only want what is best for" Grandmother, and I have no reason to doubt that. But I also know that in a family of 6, there can be 7 opinions of what is "best." One person, and one person alone, has the final responsibility for deciding and acting upon what is "best." Your Aunt does not need to take a survey or a vote or listen to other people's opinions. She must decide. In families where there is not a "rift." the POA will often listen to the ideas of other family members. But when it comes down to making a decision, even in the most loving and functional families, the POA is in the same position as Harry Truman was when he said, "The buck stops here."

If this is about money, or there really is evidence-based concern that Aunt is not acting in Grandmother's best interest, get a lawyer.

If this is about sadness over the rift in the family, show Grandmother your love by visiting, sending cards, calling her directly (not the NH staff), and maintaining the best relationship you can in spite of family obstacles. You can't make any decisions about her treatment, so does it really matter that the NH won't tell you if she has a uti or is declining rapidly or has an improved appetite? Unlike your Aunt, you have the luxury of treating this oldest family member only as your beloved Grandmother, and not as a patient or a dependent. You don't need the medical detail to continue to show your love, and to receive the love Grandmother can offer.

Grandmother's life is in the home stretch. Use the time left to share cherished memories and to build some new ones. There will be time enough for all the acrimony and family strife after she is gone.

that's terrible. sounds alot like what i have been going through. two of my siblings tried to leave my dad in a nursing home because they didn't want my parents to come and live with me. control freaks or greedy freaks. my mother was still alive thank heaven and i convinced her to get him out. she wished afterward that she had done it sooner. unfortunately, your mom put her trust in the wrong child. a child too jealous of other siblings to allow her mother to live with one of them. sicko. you know if you can't act like an adult than you shouldn't be a poa or anything else. all of your mother's children deserve to know the truth. it is a question of morals though rather than legal although there are many moral laws. your mother is suffering the consequences of giving too much power to one child. i would call and visit your mother alot. who cares who's in charge but the one in charge that is! nursing homes do a better job if someone is visiting frequently and staggering the days so they don't know when you may show up. even show up on weekends. you may get to know some of the nurses and they may tip you off in spite of your mean sisters instructions. ;)

Did anyone help "with daughter" who previously was doing all the work? Maybe she was just burnt out and couldn't take it anymore because no one was helping her. Sorry, if that was not the case, but I don't think we have the whole story here. Fill us in!! Is this about money?

And can you just go see her in the home? I think, if the grandmother is that important to you, you'd want to see with your own eyes how she is doing. I don't think the NH can refuse for you to see her. Just get in the car or get on a plane and go!

I have to agree with JeanneG, Selfish and Equinox.

There is a reason why daughter # 1 was chosen by mom as POA over the others when mom was still competent and cognitive. If you had issues with it, you should have challenged it then. That was mom's wishes then and Daughter # 1 acted for mom's best interests and I would imagine mom's needs changed to the point that a NH was needed. Admission into a NH is something that is not done easily and mom had to meet a certain level of medical necessity in order to be there and stay there. The POA has no responsibility to let you know what the reasons were and HIPPA laws have to be enforced by the NH and all of mom's health providers.

To get mom to change POA that could stand up in court now would be highly unlikely as mom likely has moved into decline significant enough that she is now in a NH and not competent or cognitive. I've been executrix twice and spend more hours in probate court than I could have ever imagined, and probate court is also most often where they hear guardianship requests and it's all open court so you get to hear all kinds of things. I will say in the time I sat around waiting for our docket to come up, changing an existing POA to a guardianship once the person is in a NH and the POA has seemed to do everything according to the norm, just does not happen. The judge is going to view the POA as valid and is not likely to be changed as the elders competency and judgement is impaired. Guardianship is not likely to be granted if the POA can show that proper care is being provided which being in a licensed NH does. The only ones who make out by this are the attorneys who get paid. Keep in mind, that if the elder has any $ the POA can use that $ to get an attorney to fight your challenge to the POA. You have to spend your own $ to do this. Costs do add up. Also my experience is that if the family is not all kum-ba-ya on mom's care, the judge will appoint an outsider to be the guardian - it will be an attorney, and the judges have a short list of those that are ready to do this asap - and once that happens the family can pretty well kiss goodbye becoming guardian or conservator for the elder for at least 6 months.

Guardianship isn't automatic and the judge can require all sorts of background checks, bonding, etc. for one to become guardian. After all this, the original POA could get appointed guardian anyway, too.

There was no $$$ fight going on either. This was just a brother who wanted to call the shots and could not see past his own ego. Other distant family started a petition on my mom's behalf and my brother called it cruel as we fought to remove Haldol from her daily life? I guess when his turn comes I can only hope Haldol is on his RX list so he can feel the truth then.

"she was dumped in the nursing home by a daughter who wanted the glory with none of the work"

Oh my goodness. This statement by terrimerritts literally brought tears to my eyes. I had to go on to other things for a while before I could address this.

I belong to a support group for caregivers of persons with Lewy Body Dementia. One of the hardest facts of our lives is that in all probability our loved ones' needs will outstrip our ability to satisfy at home. I have seen husbands, wives, sons, and daughters absolutely agonize over and become physically sick at the recognition that they can no longer provide the best physical care for their loved ones and I've watched them go through the transition from being 24/7 hands-on caregiver to being advocate, oversight providers, and once again loving spouse or child.

I have had very painful discussions with my husband in his more lucid periods, assuring him that I will never ever abandon him and that I will always see that he has the best care possible and that I'll be there for him always. We both acknowledge that the day may come when the best care is in a professional setting.

If (when) the time comes and I determine that a long term care setting is where my husband will get the best care for the stage he is in, I will to everything in my power to see that it happens. I would fight relentlessly anyone who thought they were more qualified than I to make the final decision, or that they could provide better care in their home than I could provide in mine. I want to do WHAT IS BEST FOR MY LOVED ONE. To have the angonizing, heart-breaking decision to place a loved one in a care facility described as "dumping" someone for "glory with none of the work," literally makes me cry.

I suppose that there are really instances of "dumping" out there. But to automatically assume that that is always what is going on when someone is placed in long term care is heartless and misinformed.

As my husband declines, I dread creeping closer and closer to the point where I may have to give up primary caregiver position, for his own good. Fortunately all of our family have been involved enough in his care that I don't expect any opposition to any decisions I make. But knowing that there are many people out there willing (and apparently eager) to judgementally declare that I've "dumped" him adds to the burden that already feels overwhelming.

For several years, the aunt in question was the primary caretaker for both my grandparents. When my grandfather passed away my grandmother went to live with another aunt who could be home with her. The months prior to her entering the nursing home she lived with me and my mother. Those months were very difficult because of an alteration in medication- very physically and emotionally demanding. That's when the topic of assistance came up. She definitely required help but was still not at a point where she needed full time care. We were advised to explore all options- at home care and physical therapy, as well as the nursing home. My aunt would consider nothing other than the home since at home care would require her living with me permanently. So under the guise of taking my grandmother to a follow up doctor's appointment, my aunt took my grandmother from my home and checked her into the psych ward at the hospital. She was discharged from the hospital and went directly to the home. In the months since my aunt has allowed another family member to move into my grandmother's home, thus ensuring that there is nowhere for my grandmother to live other than the home.

When she first got to the home, the nursing home told us that anyone could call as well as no limitations on visitors. Now we can no longer get any information when we call and my aunt is not particularly forthcoming with information. Calling to speak to my grandmother directly is not an option as she cannot hear well on the phone. We do visit regularly but it's difficult as we still feel she does not belong there. Keep in mind, prior to her going to the home, she was mobile (with supervision), and her other faculties were intact (when her meds are properly adjusted). Now she spends her day in a wheelchair and gets winded with the slightest exertion. Her meds are now under control so her mental faculties are still intact. And even those visits the POA is trying to control, trying to dictate who goes and when.

This in absolutely no way about money. It's about trying to give my grandmother some peace in her remaining years. My grandmother grew up with an abusive, controlling father; married an abusive, controlling man. And now has an equally controlling child who is using her as a pawn to lash out at her family.

How very, very sad, esne76. And yet, in spite of having other relatives available and of having received caregiving from others as well as this daughter, this daughter is the one your grandmother selected to make decisions for her. If she still has her mental faculties intact, she could change the POA to someone else. Why do you suppose she doesn't? It could be that the daughter is indeed using her for selfish and nasty purposes. But why is Grandmother putting up with that?

There are aspects to this that may never be fully understood. In any case, go about your purpose of giving this poor woman some peace in her remaining years. Keep the family squabbles (or wars) away from her. Visit her where she is and bring a ray of sunshine when you come. I understand why phone calls aren't possible. Cards and visits still are possible, right? Aunt POA might keep the medical details from you, but surely she has no authority to say who visits when, does she? Especially if your grandmother can express her own desires.

It sounds like what you would want to have happen is to remove Grandmother from the NH. Right? An attorney who specializes in Elder Law can give you advice about what actions are available to you, what they will cost, and how likely they are to be successful.

If there is no feasible legal recourse for that first wish, do everything in your power to let Grandmother feel your love where she is right now. Give her the peace she deserves.

I am truly sorry that your family is having this experience.

Igloo572, you are mistaken on more than one point. 1) At the time my aunt was appointed POA, none of us had an issue with it because, as I said, she was the caretaker for a number of years and because we all believed that she would have my grandmother's interest at heart. It is more recently that we have come to realize that is not the case. Her actions now come purely from a vindictive perspective because there are some of us who actually have the audacity to disagree with her. She feels she has more (if not all) say because she is the eldest. 2) My grandmother is competent and cognitive when she is not put on anti-psychotic drugs that she has an adverse reaction to. Just prior to the time she came to live with me, her meds were adjusted and she was prescribed something that gave her medically-induced Parkinson's Disease. In order to correct that she needed to be weaned off that drug completely before being prescribed anything new. The detox from the one drug made her nearly comatose and the new drug they gave her made her violent. So yes, there was a medical necessity for assistance. She needed to be placed on the proper meds and required physical therapy to correct the Parkinson's symptoms. All of which could be done at home. If my aunt truly had my grandmother's wishes in mind she would have recognized that for years my grandmother expressed that she would never want to be in a home because she recalls how her father died in one and it was a fear of hers.

And while you are correct that legally my aunt has no obligation to impart any medical information to the rest of the family, from a moral perspective to not inform my grandmother's five other children of how she is doing is rather pathetic and sad.

HelpMyMom! They were giving my dad Lunesta and it causes hallucinations in some patients and agitation. He couldn't sleep in the nursing home and we went in one day and we couldn't wake him up he was so drugged. Sounds like they might have given him the Haldol. When my mom finally agreed that we were taking my dad and her to my house I read all of the drug side effects and the Lunesta was the only one that could cause it. We took him off of it and he started sleeping a million times better. I didn't give him anything for sleep after that. I just got up and went into him if he woke up. The only time his thinking got out of whack after that was when he was in the hospital and after he got home it took about three days for him to start getting back to normal.