Hi everyone. I stopped working with home health care agencies 5 1/2 years ago to help care for my father. He's gone and I'm now helping care for our mother. I have 5 brothers and 2 sisters. My closest sibling, Susan, has moved in with our mother. She being single and able to work from home is a slam dunk to helping our mother and her staying at home.
She had a bad fall earlier this month-- so this has triggered the need of informing the family and beginning of all around family communication in helping my sister and I and yes, our mother. The difficult issue is that my mother is a private person and doesn't want anyone knowing her business. UGH!
Everything has started to snowball.. meaning 2 of my brother's spouses have texted each other about my mother's fall. UGH(again).
I'm seeking out counsel about having a family meeting. This meeting is for the purpose of caring for my mother and helping out the main caregiver - my sister living with my mother. My purpose is supporting and helping my mother and sister.
I have knowledge, but am asking for guidance, simple answers ie) why my siblings spouses are not to attend the actual meeting, and your prayers.
Our elderly need best care possible while maintaining their independence and dignity- this is a monumental task when it's your own mother of 8 kids.
Much appreciated ahead of time for your personal counsel!
So are both you and your sister taking care of your Mom? And neither of you work? Are you wanting to get paid for taking care of your Mom? You really have lost out on a lot of benefits by not being employed, such as: having your employer pay for your health insurance, adding to your retirement fund, increasing your Social Security benefits, and so forth.
Are all of the siblings going to be at the meeting in person? {EDIT: NO, your siblings' spouses DO NOT need to be at the meeting. Have the meeting some place where the spouses can wait in another room while you and your siblings meet. } Are you wanting ALL of the siblings to VOTE so that you can see how many siblings agree with your Plan of Care for your Mom? What will you do if your siblings do not agree with your Plan of Care for your Mom? Sometimes it is BEST if the people GIVING THE CARE TAKE CONTROL and just inform the other siblings of what is happening. You can get yourself in lots of trouble if you put every decision to a "Majority Vote". There are plenty of postings on this site about siblings who try to tell the caregivers what to do. You might want to look at some of those before the meeting so you know what you might have to deal with at YOUR MEETING.
Who is your Mom's POA? Is it Durable or Springing POA? Who is your Mom's POA-Health Care and does your Mom have a Living Will or Advance Directive? Is your sister a co-owner of your Mom's bank accounts and mutual funds?
How has the fall affected your Mom? Is she needing more assistance than what your sister can give by herself? Are you having to modify your Mom's house to accommodate a wheelchair or other equipment- a Hoyer or Easy lift, hospital bed, add a ramp to the front of the house, add a chair lift to the indoor stairs? Do you need to hire agency caregivers?
People your Mom's age are private because that is how they were raised--you did not talk about anything publicly. (You whispered about it behind closed doors and some subjects were NEVER talked about at all.) So you need to respect your Mom's wish for privacy by not talking about certain aspects of her care or talking about it in general terms only.
So what if "the my brother's spouses have texted each other about my mother's fall"? It is their right to talk about whatever they want. How did you find out what they are texting each other--did your brothers tell you? If so, they should not have told you what their wives are saying. You cannot stop them from talking so "JUST IGNORE IT" (unless what they are saying is untrue or hurtful towards your Mom, Sister or yourself. Then you need to calmly tell them that what they are texting to each other is hurtful to you and ask them to stop.
We really need more information to be able to give you supportive and appropriate counsel.
If I was married to one of your brothers, I personally ~wouldn't~ want to put in my two cents.
But if they are close and care about your mother it's hard ~not~ to include them at least a little.
I tried to think of some *ways* to exclude the SIL's, but I cant think of how you can do that w/o sounding offensive.
I think its best to include everyone, because from the get-go you could make people upset. and then that could end up causing more friction, than you originally expected to avoid. that's just my opinion, like I said if was me as a SIL I would butt out anyway.
I am my moms POA and I always try to include my sister, because if she suspected I was trying to NOT include her, there would be ...trouble...
edit. I just think if you try to exclude, then they going to PUSH harder and hold a grudge- so if you just include them, you take away that 'fight'
Your mom is private, okay, tell them no Facebook postings and ask for discretion as mom doesn't want everyone to know her personal business. Mom doesn't need to know what they know.
I would never interfere with my husband and his helping his family, but I would think you were trying to create a separation and I would think you had a lot of nerve to try and separate us.
Let them come if they choose, open the meeting with some ground rules about privacy and deal with things as they come up, alot of "what ifs" never materialize.
Hard feelings last a long time, please try to avoid creating any with your siblings spouses. The wives may be more hands on help then your brothers, so you could essentially be cutting your helpers in half.
5 boys and 2 girls. And the two sisters are the ones who want to get everyone together to help out your mother's main caregiver (your sister).
5 brothers should mean a lot of manpower and a lot of help. But will it? And will your mother refuse any help from them, insisting that they are too "busy"? (Yes, a number of elders think elder caregiving is women's work.)
Are all of your brothers local? Have you made a list of all of the things that would help your sister out? I take it that you are already helping your sister.
Be prepared that the way it is now (the girls helping the mother) is probably the way your brothers like it.
I heard a statistic that people who have four or more daughters and/or daughters-in-law are less likely to need nursing home care. Now this was about ten years ago, so maybe many more men are stepping up and providing the kind of care that keeps one from going to the nursing home. But that is not the experience I have or have seen in the families of my friends.
But maybe you and your sister do not want anyone else providing hands on care. You said the meeting was to design ways to support your sister. I wish you the best of luck. If you are asking your brothers for their time, or their money, they are most probably going to need to discuss it with their wives. You may get more cooperation from the wives if you haven't made them feel as though they are not part of your family.
So how can you control the scope and duration of the meeting with everyone there? I would suggest approaching this just like I would hold a meeting at work, and collaborate with your sister to develop a good agenda:
1- Have your sister detail the current state: what does she (and you perhaps) do for your Mom on a daily basis. Hygiene, feeding, dressing, shopping, cleaning, whatever. How much do these services cost your sister? Cost your mom? Is money a problem? Who has POA? Can she show a current budget with expenses if asked? Is your Mom happy? Is sister happy? Is she healthy and thriving? How is the current state working out for her?
2- What does your sister need help with right now? Money? Respite? Someone to handle dr appts? Shopping? Appointments? Ideas?
3- What do you see as your Moms future needs? More help at home? Assisted living? Nursing home? Medicaid? When do you see these changes happening? Timetable? What will she need to make that happen?
If she can can develop an agenda and stick to it, you both might get the most out of a meeting with the entire family.
Rewind. Is almost always a good idea.
You seem to have some negative expectations hovering around - what's the issue with your SILs' texting one another? Shouldn't they?
Aim is to support mother and primary caregiver sister, good.
Have you a sort of SWOT list you could share with us? What contributions/obstacles are you hoping for/dreading from the rest of the family?
When the tide turns and the children are having to be more supportive and provide more proxy care of the parents (be it moving in with or housing aging parents; more hands on care and daily monitoring; attending medical appointments; managing of the finances and household; financial support, etc), it makes more sense to involve both the children and their spouses. As a number of other respondents have mentioned, husbands, and wives for that matter, should discuss with their spouses both time and monetary commitments that may be needed to assist with the care and support of aging parents/family members. It will impact their marriages and their immediate families. Not everyone is coming to the table in the same position (young children at home versus empty nesters; stay at home versus full-time working versus flexible remote worker; healthy and physically capable versus dealing with own health issues; financial status, etc). And everyone should be supported that what THEY FEEL is the best they can offer to the situation is accepted and appreciated. The one thing I have found over the past dozen years is that no matter what the situation, and it does evolve over time, it takes a Village.
While, yes, there will still need to be one or two of you to take point on managing/coordinating the day to day, your siblings and spouses may have various talents to assist that can help ease the burdens of feeling that it all falls on your shoulders. Home maintenance, scheduling/transporting to doctor's appointments, grocery shopping, bill paying, yard work, etcetera, become even more challenging. And if finances are an issue for your mother having family members pitch in with what they can do helps them feel a part of her support system and spread her resources further.
And speaking of finances...if there is a need for your mother to have financial support for her care needs, then this needs to be transparent to those being expected to contribute. It is hard to get behind the "Mom doesn't have enough finances, so just give us money" attitude if you don't know how Mom is fixed financially and where the expenses are going. I am not saying that is what you and your sister are doing, it just does happen in a lot of families.
The open communication can assist with supporting each other as you go through the process, and it may even bring the family closer as they rally together to support your mother versus create feelings of alienation by being intentionally left out of the loop.
Best of luck to all of you!
Since your mother has dementia, I hope POAs and a will have already been taken care of. If so, I think it's appropriate to announce these documents exist and who has them. I think it would be appropriate to list some expenses Mom now has related to her declining health (like respite care or home modification) and whether Mom has the money to support these extra expenses or whether the family needs to help (by providing respite care or making as many of the home modifications as skills sets allow).
If you can involve everyone in doing some small task at your mother's home, it will allow them to be on the team, to "see" what's happening and avoid making people feel left out. Mowing the yard, raking the leaves, delivering the groceries, washing windows, help with deep cleaning, other tasks that get pushed out by daily care giving are good ones to engage help. A brother and SIL coming over one night a week for "dinner and a movie" with mom while you and your sister have a few hours off would also be good.
Please remember that siblings often split over using a parent's money for their care. I'm on the side that a parent's money should be expended for their care and there's only an inheritance if there's something left over. In two generations of my family, I have observed the side that believes using a parent's money for quality care is a "waste" and the primary focus should be on keeping assets in the family. Don't be surprised if some version of this split shows up in your family. If the POA has already been engaged, announce Mom's money will be spent on her care. If some family member wants to make sure some item stays in the family, then make sure they understand the item must be purchased at fair market value because Mom cannot make any gifts because she needs to be able to qualify for Medicaid someday. Since your sister is living in Mom's home, it might be good to discuss when/home your sister will be leaving that home with a time line (6 months after Mom's death or move to SNC?).
Another topic you may need to be prepared to address is whether your sister is paying "rent" or other expenses for living in mom's home. A lot of people think someone should pay to have their sleep interrupted most nights and provide care to a dementia patient. Personally, I think it's reasonable for the care giver to contribute a portion of monthly utility and food expenses but it's inappropriate to pay rent when providing care. If the care giver leaves employment to provide care, then I think even the portion of the monthly expenses should be waived in partial compensation for the care provided.
Good Luck!
Hope this helps. "Outlaws" are usually (hopefully) just trying to get their spouses to recognize that there may be an issue. They also may be the best choice to provide respite for the sister living with Mom as this will give some distance from Mom to her kids and may work in your favor if she is a private person.
Your meeting will mean the end of the secrecy & that could be your mom's biggest adjustment - I would suggest that the family look within itself for whoever has talents & use them [ like someone who works at a bank would take care of the money & give an annual report to all ] - with 8 people [do not count spouses] it could be chaotic so assign actual tasks to some & designate others as backup ie brother #4 takes her to medical appointments but sister#2 does so when he is unavailable etc - good luck
5 of us surviving kids--elderly mom who lives with youngest brother. I was going up 3 days per week to help--he was burned out and not doing the job he signed on for--so I facilitated a meeting last Jan.
WORST IDEA EVER.
I asked for no spouses to come---YB brings his wife, as they are "one".
I had a bullet point agenda and what I thought was a good rule--we each had 5 minutes to talk, and then we'd roundtable all other thoughts. (Just trying to figure out how to help YB and his family and Mother with better care as she ages) No judgment--but that's how he took it.
YB came out swinging. Weirdly, mostly at ME. And remember, I was one of the 2 caregivers!
All that resulted was bad feelings, I have barely spoken to this brother since. I don't care to be in the same room with him. He was so vicious and nasty. My feelings were hurt beyond belief. NOBODY stood up for me (until the next day when I go 3 "gosh, I'm sorry" emails.
We should have had a moderator, I should have remembered that this brother has the worst temper in the world. Even his wife, who is really a mouse, was angry and "shouted" at me.
All I wanted was to set up a better caregiving schedule. It was not about assigning blame and anger towards those sibs who would not help, ever.
We did have a prayer beforehand. I am not the oldest, and so felt like I should allow my sister to kind of take over. She is Dr. No Shot. Amazingly gracious and giving to a fault--yet YB just raged for 90 minutes--not allowing anyone else to say anything. I was personally "fired" from caregiving and I did not go back. Mother's place is dirty and she is lonely and totally dependent on YB taking her places. I am not allowed in his home now. Others need to call first.
It was a fail of the most epic kind. We are fractured as a family and it will not get better. Mother's ONE other caregiver got kicked to the curb. Any ideas of having outside help a couple days a week were kiboshed by YB. He would not allow strangers in his home.
All I wanted was better/more care for mother. What actually happened is that I no longer speak to YB, mother is confused as to why I can't ever come by and still gets no outside help.
These family things often wind up this way, I hear. I know I'm not unusual in this. Sad, so sad.
I hope you get a moderator, take notes and make sure everyone has had their say. Be aware that everyone will NOT agree. Some sibs will have very strong feelings about things, some will not care at all.
I came away sad, depressed and embarrassed for my siblings. Mother will pass, some day, and we will likely all just fracture off into different places.
Hoping your family goes better than ours--it couldn't be worse!
I had a telephone conference call one time with my three brothers about a year and a half ago (after one of my mother's panic/dizziness spells that culminated in an ER visit). It put them on notice of my mother's failing abilities.
But of course nothing changed. I was hoping they would make visits to her more often. My older brother (now retired, as his wife) has made it clear that he will come twice a year. The other one comes about every 4 - 6 months (he is the closest, at 6 hours away). And the other one (aka Sonny No-Show) hasn't been here in 1.5 years...
In our case, the family dynamics were such that a family meeting would have been a disaster; the emotional issues were too much. (It took that whole year to work it all out, but at the end of the year everybody was speaking to everybody, which was a miracle.)
Families are all different, with different dynamics. What might seem logical on the surface might not work at all, especially with large families with their own histories.
my mom used to say it took one mother to care for 7 children but
it takes 7 children to care for one mother!
just remember some will go above and beyond and others will do minimal - just let it be.
these are the last things you be able to do for your mother and you will cherish that time when its over!
He told us what we should be focusing on, and what problems to let go. Since my Dad had been recently dx with vascular dementia and was very difficult to handle, he did not come to the meeting.
We we were able to get the process going, all had the same knowledge, and got our questions answered.
It hasn’t been all smooth sailing, but without the third party running the meeting, we would not have accomplished anything.
I think if you go into the meeting expecting everyone to help equally, you are going to run into a lot of anger and resentment. Some people just cannot be caregivers, and guilting them into that situation will create a bigger problem.
We we decided there would be no guilt put on anyone. 4 of the siblings had been dealing with Dad and his drama and craziness for 40 years.
Everyone had to be free to decide if they could do anything at all.
Yes, have a family meeting. Tell your siblings that their husbands/wives are not to attend. This is a "family" issue that must be dealt with as your Mom's children.
Your siblings can discuss with spouses 8f they choose afterward. If your in-laws are upset, so be it. Your siblings must be bold enough to explain. Do you think your in-laws would ask you to be involved if the situation was reversed? That probability is most likely 0.
You're very blessed to have 8 siblings to turn to about this.
I would look at it like having to deal with having to make the decision about pulling the plug. ONLY IMMEDIATE FAMILY CAN MAKE THAT DECISION. This isn't any different.
This is an issue for immediate family.
You are being so mindful in managing your mom’s care. You will surely do well by her.
Because she is your mother, it is natural that first responses, from everyone, will be emotional. Care decisions also involve money, which can be a difficult issue to discuss openly with family, and when in-laws/spouses are affected.
Your siblings will want to know details of mom’s fall and be ready to jump into decisions.
But, I suggest that you begin the meeting by getting agreement on one thing first-
This is everyone’s mom, and everyone’s thoughts will be heard without interruption.
Then, come to agreement on what your collective goals are for mom’s care.
This means everyone must be given a chance to speak, and someone must write down the key words that are said.
It would be wonderful if you could ask your Mom ahead of time what she wants for herself so it can be shared with everyone and included.
The list is then prioritized by the group and the group should agree that the list will guide the decisions you make going forward.
The list might look like -
Our goals are that Mom will...
BE SAFE from harm.
BE FREE FROM PAIN
PARTICIPATE IN DECISIONS about her care as long as she is able.
LIVE AT HOME with family for as long as physically or financially possible.
BE SUPPORTED IN DOING things she loves for as long as possible.
NOT HAVE HER AFFAIRS discussed with spouses or other relatives.
When emotionally, morally or financially difficult decisions arise, the list will be your True North. When disagreements arise, your list will be a reminder of what your agreed upon goals are for mom (not for the group), and what mom wants for herself.
There may come a time when you cannot provide or meet every goal on your list. But, if you’re still meeting the higher priority goals, you will find reassurance that your decisions are in her best interests.
Once you have your list, ask family to allow you, without interruption, to explain the current situation. You’ll be starting from a place of agreement and focused on agreed upon goals, which more empowering to everyone.
Later, I suggest that you share the list with everyone in writing, and bring it to any future meetings (along with a POLST or Advance Care Directive if Mom has them) where it can be visible - not as “rules” but, as a reminder of what you collectively want most for your mom.
Lastly, if Mom does not have a Power of Attorney named for 1) financial and 2) healthcare decisions, it would be important to have her do this now. Then, you will all understand who has the legal authority to carry out decisions on mom’s behalf.
Good luck! Your mom is so fortunate to have you.
My former mil has 2 sons, only her dils have ever done anything at all for her.
i cannot imagine not including the spouses of your siblings in the meeting. More so if they have been part of the family for many years. They could well be your biggest supporters.
I do not understand the concern about sils texting each other about your mother’s fall. Of course they should be included in the phone tree. Or do you expect your brothers to not share with their wives? Are you married?
Keep in in mind some will not pitch in at all or minimally. Just keep them in the loop. I used to get annoyed but after Mom passed I realized everyone did what they could do. I may not understand or know the reason but that’s ok.
Praying all goes well.