Does anyone else have trouble mentally connecting with the person they care for?

Avatar, that is. Sheesh!!!

I too am envious of people who have spouses, or adult children, or close friends that provide some genuine support. It's often the "unencumbered" adult child who becomes responsible for the parent. Geez, if I'd known I'd end up tied down this way anyway, I'd have had kids. Or stayed married. My failed marriage, in retrospect, was so much more enjoyable than this. At least he provided some benefits - someone to talk to, to go to social events with, and someone who took care of me when I was sick. This relationship is all give and no get back. That's the reason for my screamy-faced atavar.

Something I realized after writing that is that it may explain why children from emotionally cold homes often become animal lovers. The pets can provide them with a warm connection that they need. Nothing says loving like Fido bounding up to you when you come home, so happy to see you. It's like a big hug.

Well said Jessie!

Carla, that sounds just like what we are talking about here. I don't so much like the duty and obligation part, because we caregiver types can often feel like we're responsible for the world. One day "they" will probably come up with a personality disorder for people who feel overly responsible. I have a feeling that many caregivers could be poster children for the disorder.

I do think it helps a lot on the caregiving side to try to approach it like a professional when there's no mental connection. That way all the medicine is dispensed and all the meals are served. But it doesn't make life so warm and snuggly for the caregiver. I am envious of the people who have good marriages. They can get the warmth from their spouses. We single/divorced folks don't have a ready supply available from anywhere. Pets are good, but when they die it is terrible. (I'm really having trouble after losing my sweet bunny on Memorial Day.)

A propos of this question - the dilemma of lack of affection for the care recipient was identified as a problem by gerontologists at least 30 years ago. In 1985 there was an article in The Gerontologist entitled "Caregiving within Kinship Systems: Is Affection Really Necessary?" The author acknowledged that caregivers often lose (or lack entirely) the emotional connection with the care recipient, and this causes motivation and morale to plummet. His solution - that caregivers should be guided to "reframe" the experience of caregiving as one based in duty and obligation, not affection or closeness. Supposedly that would help caregivers feel better about devoting their lives to someone they can't connect to emotionally. Meh!

If anyone is interested the cite is here: Jarrett, WH—Caregiving within Kinship Systems: Is Affection Really Necessary? 25 (1985), pp. 5–10

Its hard to feel close to a dementia patient, despite that you had a close relationship 30 years ago, so for all of you with moms who were always cold and mean - don't let yourself feel like you should change things now, you can't. Mom was once loving, she isn't now. They are not the same person, and their world is so narrow, their conversation so limited! For the past 8 years, the topics of conversation with Mom have been exactly the same, every visit - no deviation except as the years go on, they are much much narrower. At first it was constant complaints about wanting her house and car, and how sorry she feels for herself and pity for my daughter who cannot move out of her state because of custody laws, obsession with her bowels and a lot of "isn't that awful" when she was lucid enough to understand the news. The last five years these are the only topics - ten times a day: blink blink, I need glasses (we explain it is a catarac and six years ago she freaked out and refused to have surgery and now its too late) five minutes later - blink blink, I need glasses, etc ; I feel sorry for Kris because S__ won't let her move (the children are grown but she's still on the topic ); how is your dear husband; how are you, didn't you break your hip? (I broke my ankle 3 months ago but I got 4 phone calls last night asking about my hip); I don't feel good; I never thought this would happen to me, I've always been healthy; I hate it here; I'm depressed; did you have lunch; I haven't seen you in weeks (it was 2 days ago). I feel totally helpless when I visit. I don't know what to say, what to talk about because she can't hear half of it, doesn't understand it and I have to repeat it five minutes later anyway. Thank God Mom is not aware of what she has become. It would devastate her. The worst for us was when she went through a couple of months where she would call several times a day saying it was so awful because my daughter died, or because my brother-in-law died, wasn't true, but she couldn't remember it each time we told her. Poor thing, she can't help it, her mind is gone, it is on a loop of memories, many imagined and those fading every day. Soon she won't know who we are. She no longer recognizes my husband. I feel pity, compassion but she is no longer Mom. She isn't antagonistic to us any more, she is just sad, existing in this awful empty world. But, saying all that, yes, it is hard to relate to her or to feel warmth toward her, she no longer wants to be touched or needs hugs and neither do I. Getting this old with absolutely no joy in life is not a gift, it is a curse for the person and sadness, a sense of loss and hopelessness and confusion for the family, wondering what we are supposed to do, say to make it better to make her happy when we can't. So please, those of you with mothers who never treated you right - you shouldn't be feeling guilty if you only feel a familial obligation.

My mom has always been very bossy and controlling. Now that she turned 87 she is even worse. I keep having to bail her out from over drafts on her bank account (she pays me back...but still). I stayed with her for 3 months after she had a knee replacement in Oct of 2014. She was ungrateful and mean to me. when I last took her to her primary care Dr. mom was telling the Dr how much she could do for herself. The Dr asked her why I was still there. My mom told her because I keep doing everything. So I decided it was time to go home. She would then call me to come spend the night because she was lonely. She has made enemies of all her old friends with the outspoken mean way she treats people. I live almost an hour away from her and do not plan on spending the night with her at all. My biggest problem with her at the moment is trying to convince her to let me show her a better way to handle her bank account. She just tells me how she has been doing it without my help and doesn't need it now. She spends money like she has it to spend (which she does not). I even asked her Dr to help me get Social Security to let me handle her money. That didn't work. They sent someone out to evaluate her. Of course the few hours they were there no checking problems arose so she was considered able to take care of herself. My only sibling is a younger brother. He said he would have sent her to a home as soon as she needed to recover from the knee surgery and left her there. She will never be welcome to live with me. My personal Dr. wanted me to see a psychiatrist because I could not stop crying. I felt so trapped when I was staying with her...like she was 'sucking the life out of me'. I HAD to leave to save myself!

Jessiebelle we definitely have the same mother no doubt about it. My mother wants me to go to church though with her. Well hells bells if I went to church with mother the doors would melt shut at the sight of me!!! Mums church friends are a bit like the dolly parton(?) song - "I go to church on a sunday the vows that I make I break them on Monday the rest of the week I do as I please then come sunday morn I pray on my knees"

As such I cannot be doing with them so no offence to you true believers but that's not for me. that ALWAYS ends up as a negative conversation but today its her eyes. She has had a cataract removed in one eyes (both have them but they only do one at a time) and this morning the patch came off. Boy have we been miserable today - she expected to suddenly have 20:20 vision again something she hasnt had for 75 years for heavens sake. negativity rules and now my sone and grandson are here to help me. Son is in bed and asleep cos hes tired!!!!!- its 19:47 here - welcome to my world son you have no idea. Im 62 and have been on the go since 5 am You are 40 and have been on the go since 5am - the difference? I still have another 5 hours to go before I can even think about sleep

Amen, daughter52. I am always so bright and cheery to my mother. I probably get on her nerves with this false self. I know I get on my own nerves. I would love to talk politics or ethics to my mother, but that's a no go. So we end up talking about the weather or my brother's family or her church. A lot of times the conversation about my brother or church goes negative. I tell her I don't want to talk bad about these things, that it makes me feel bad. But then she goes right back to the negative talking. Sigh. Wouldn't it be wonderful if there was a pill that people could take and see only the sunny side of life? I know I would want a prescription for myself.

meowser, your story reminds me in some ways of my great-grandmother; she, too, had a stroke I believe when she was probably the age your mother was when she had hers; I really didn't know her then, not sure I was even born, just know that I don't think I remember her from before she had it, just know she lived to be 96, I believe. Not sure if anything else happened to her or not, like you mom, that I hate that so bad, especially at her age, because I know somebody who had that when somewhat old, but not nearly that age who came through it and got over it, but anyway for whatever reason she wound up either being placed or let stay in a NH; not sure they even had rehab back then. Now I'm not sure how much was her or the place since I was told she was rather a controlling person back in the day but she certainly wasn't by the time I knew her but when we - my mom and grandmother would go see her - would go see her they would say the nh was controlling her to keep her, I guess, from being controlling herself; I wonder if it's because she didn't have family caring for her before; my grandmother was a widow and had to work, not really sure why my mom didn't though not so sure but what it wasn't a good idea, considering what I saw of her later with my grandmother but anyway before she went into the nh pretty sure my great-grandfather was still alive to keep her at home, not exactly sure who actually took care of her but believe was told they at least had some help coming into their home to at least take care of the house, if not her, who she probably couldn't control so she probably got used to not being able to do so - could be maybe we don't do them any favors by taking care of them the way we do? I'm pretty sure we certainly didn't go every day and so definitely didn't spend large portions of days with her, though when we did go we did. I'm not sure how her meals were typically done, although I do know she was bedridden when we were there, something they would talk about and I know that at least she wasn't always before she went because I have pictures of me with her from before she went where she wasn't, so it wasn't like she could go get it herself but she didn't wither away and die so she must have been getting fed some; I just know we certainly didn't go every day and do it; now the dentures thing, that was my dad! but he would have done it himself - yea, and pulled everything loose he was hooked up to doing it - does seem like they could do things a little more like a dentist office and have things closer to them so they could take care of things like that themselves if they want to. But also in addition to being bedridden she didn't - couldn't? talk, which was something else they talked about like she did before, although I don't remember her ever talking much or at all, really, but at least according to them she did more than she was at least as I remember her, so there certainly were no conversations with her but more to a point here that's been brought up is that it was said of my mother that she "certainly was no hand to carry on a conversation" so not only was there not one with my great-grandmother but there wasn't one between my grandmother - who certainly could - and my mother - and they sure didn't try to carry on one with me - mom rarely did and I guess grandmother wouldn't with her around since she and I certainly did when she wasn't! So though not really sure what my great-grandmother's interests were, although I never really got the idea she really had any, I know my mom, though she had them, was never really interested in anything you could really carry on a conversation about; now my grandmother, the things I learned about her later that I wish she'd talked about with me; again, I wonder if it was because of my mom that she didn't. Although I do wonder if it was more just a matter of it being my grandmother, her being the oldest child that, as I understood, her role had always been to take care of the 7 younger ones that, as they say, just kept coming out, and she was never really given any attention - at least, until she got typhoid fever when she was 17 - but also she was the only daughter who stayed around and we know what's been said about that; it wasn't her who put her in the nh, however that works when you have that many kids; it was her youngest, who, as they say, when her dad died, swooped down from out of state, swooped up her mother and dropped her in the nh and left and never came back, basically, at least, to see her or anything but yet she was always the "golden daughter" so whether she could have given commands or nay or whether she was just used to basically ignoring my grandmother since there was nobody else for her to take care of for her that's the way it seemed to be anyway. I do somewhat think that if she were - if indeed that was the issue - able to talk she possibly would have been the way your mother is so maybe, again, if that was the case, it was a good thing that possibly she couldn't, in that sense. But I'm just now realizing how old you were when you started this journey, still just in your 50s then like I am now and mine, at least with my parents, is already over (so, yea, I know, why am I here? well, I signed up on this when I was going through it and it's started showing up on my newsfeed/inbox, whatever, so in my what started off as being somewhat spare time, thought I would just check in, see if I could be of any help, having already gone through it; if not, just let me know and I'll check it out, though not like I don't have other things to do, like now)obviously - I think - my mom didn't live as long as yours; she died when your was just starting her journey but then I think she may have started earlier too because she did have something happen to her - a stroke? - 10 yrs. before so maybe I did have my 10 yr. journey as well, just started earlier and younger and at the end we probably should have put her in a nh; at least her last year things were pretty hairy and complicated but we had somewhat those same issues of not connecting but it did make it better that we started off that year on a pretty good foot, with her thanking me for what I'd been doing for her the year before, for whatever brought that up

Jude, I have trouble with people saying "It's not them, it's the disease." Some things are the disease, but other things are them. When we know the person, we understand these things.

It wouldn't bother me to be taped as long as I knew it. I would be on my best behavior, however, and not my real self. I wouldn't want something I did or said to come back and bite me in the butt later. For example, what if a false accusation was made and they have you on tape saying you want to wring your parent's neck sometimes. Our own words could be used to convict us. We do have to walk carefully when caring for someone to avoid even the appearance of abuse.

I so like the idea of a better way to care for people with dementia. Is it Denmark that has the Alzheimer's village paid for by the government? People with Alzheimer's can live somewhat normally because everyone working there is dementia aware and know what to do. I'm sure it cost the government a bundle, but maybe no more than private citizens, insurance, and the governments pay for dementia care in the US now. .

As I read these comments, I find a little bit of the situation with my mom and myself. This morning I am intrigued by two things: One is the distant relationship one has with the person they care for. Hard to connect with one whose scope of things has diminished so greatly. Hard to converse about things that are brought up daily (I call it a hamster wheel) and feel like even responding---same people, same situations, same bodily aches and pains. If you try to bring up a thoughtful subject you get very superficial responses (if any). Mine always brings a weather response like, "Another beautiful day" or "Have you heard a weather report"? You start to avoid communications at all cause they are fruitless.
The other thing I recognize (at least in myself) is the lack of desire to have my mother show affection toward me. I don't feel close to her at all. In my case, since I am sole live-in caregiver, I am subject to alot of negative behavior toward me. She can absolutely say nasty things about me to my face and loudly behind my back but then she turns and tries to say how much she's 'grateful for me'. It's a kind of emotional abuse and I don't feel warm fuzzies toward her. So I've developed a kind of distant coldness toward her. My shrink tells me I am 'objectifying' my mother. I am.
Anyway, nice to hear people similarly experiencing these things---these emotions.

Jude, my heart goes out to you. There is a special place in heaven for you. To me, you have summarized the agony of being a caregiver better than I have ever heard. Living in the UK is really not that much different than here. The government promises help, but almost all the tax money is wasted and so much goes to able bodied people and non-citizens who don't contribute. Very little goes to care for those who spent their lives contributing when they are too old and sick to care for themselves. If you don't have money for assisted living (very expensive) you end up a burden on your children, just like in the UK. And then social workers try to twist your brain (when you are either a senior yourself or almost there) into thinking you can deal with it - deal with a person that, in AL or memory care would have a staff (which changes every 8 hours so they can walk away) A staff that is needed to deal with the same problems you handle alone 24/7. My sister and I are fortunate because 100 year old Mom is in AL (enough money from stepfather, thank God) because neither of us is healthy enough to take her on full time. I try not to think about what is going to happen to me, with osteoporosis, seriously bad back, vertigo - at 69, what will I be at 79 and who will take care of me? Not enough money for a nice AL, my husband is 8 years older than I am, one daughter might be moving to UK (she might want to re-think that!) and the other will have to work until she is 79 because she has no savings. Getting old is so frightening and the future is so scary.

Jessie Belle we share a mother I am sure we do. Except mine disagrees with everything I do and then tells people it was her idea that I do it. So frustrating. I have just spent about 250$ your money in getting the garden ready in order to sell the house. It wasn't easy I did most of the work myself and brought in a gardener to do the heavy and high stuff. When did I find time? Usually between 4.30 am and 6 am because after that Mother wants me. So yesterday the realtor (We call them estate agents) came to take pics and said Your garden is your selling point your daughter musthave green fingers. My mother's reply....she's useless wouldnt know a weed if she fell on it I paid a gardener to do all this because she wont do it.

I said nothing but I feel abused, cheapened and in a way even though I KNOW BEYOND ALL DOUBT that I am doing a good job I am starting to take on board the negativity of it all. I am trying to stay conscious of my thoughts because I fear that I am slipping into a deep depression here. My doctor doesn't want to prescribe unless she has to (well that's reasonable if I dont need it I dont want it). So off to the carers help training we go. Mum will be looked after while I learn new techniques to help me manage caring for her.

I have to say I went with negative eyes, but it was really good to be in a room with 5 other really intelligent carers. It was also very interesting. There were two professionals there both clinical psychologists. Their opening gambit was we want you to be able to continue caring. Well that went down like a lead balloon. Of course you do said all of us en masse. You couldnt afford the round the clock care we give could you.
We understand dementia care better than most.....oh really said this adorable very elderly man who looks after his wife. Have you ever looked after someone with dementia 24/7 for 5 years without a break? No? Then what gives you the right to assume you have even a vague clue of what we are going through? BRAVO my man

So after a stuttery grim start we got into the feelings we all have. One of the women who was running the class said I hope you dont mind but I am going to tape the class. I stood up, picked up my bag and said enjoy the class. This is supposed to be helping us and I dont trust what will happen to the recording. My experience with social workers is SO bad that from EXPERIENCE there are very few professionals I would trust

Oh you have trust issues do you? I love all 5 of my compadres. The comments came flying

What do you expect? we get nothing from you and have to beg to get respite and have to pay for it (In UK the whole point of National Insurance was that you would be taken care of from cradle to grave its a 1948 thing that everyone believed)

You have earned more in the hour youve been stood here than we get all week and presume that you know about what we go through and we know all our journeys are different - you dont have a clue madam

If the government spent the 173 million pounds on the carers that do the care they would each get an additional 2k a year which would at least go some way to making them feel as though they had some worth

Trust is a two way street and if you want to tape us then you should have informed us well in advance I for one stand with this lady (me) and stood up

At this point 4 of us walked out to go collect our respectives. Now this is going to be problematic because they cant run a class with two people, especially if 4 are so angry that letters are likely to be written so they agreed not to tape the classes.

Well we spent 2 hours in total being told that it is not the person it is the disease we should hate - No? Really?!!! I said this is a massive assumption on your part that a) we dont know that and b) that our respective is a sweety. You haveheard what we said our resective are not sweet they never were and the dementia has emphasised all their bad traits too, almost unleashed them.

Anyway after 2 hours I went back to collect Mum...she is now soaked and I had to change her before we could go home. I got her on to the loo and rushed out to see the Psychs who were just leaving. I gave them a full on blasting for NOT arranging CARE then told them they had better up their game or I would not be back.

Still waiting to hear... I will keep you posted. Next week ...what is dementia? Well that will be interesting!!!! NOT

vstefans, what you wrote made so much sense. It may be self preservation that we can't connect. If we did connect, we would be pulled down in the quicksand of depression or other mental problem that is going on. We can still feel empathy and compassion, but it is more at a distance. Almost like a professional caregiver.

Heart, I do know what you mean about your mother not acknowledging your problems or feelings. With my mother, it can be a competition. If I have something wrong, she has something wrong worse. I usually don't even tell her if I feel bad anymore. I haven't had her turn her back on me when I say the way I feel about something. She generally gets mad right away, but sometimes will let it sink in and act on it the next day. I use this to our advantage now. I'll suggest something in the evening and get a firm no from her, but then the next day she does it. I think she realizes what is a good suggestion, but she isn't going to accept it without a little fight. :)

Oh, well. People on the group now are probably tired of hearing about my complicated mother. I think that she learned to not feel too strongly -- or at least not to show it -- when she was young. Vstefans was spot on with that. Maybe our parents were ridiculed or punished if they let their feelings show, so they just hid them away.

Depression is a terrible disease and it ought to be treated. If it isn't, its contagious. The past generation often went untreated as they had such stigma for mental illness, and it became a lifestyle instead of an illness...I don't know that it is humanly possible to live day in day out with a depressed person who has nothing to give you but bad vibes and unhappiness, and stay OK yourself. Prayers for deliverance for all of you in that situation and strength for as long as it goes on.

Here's a quote from a mom with a child with Down syndrome: lifenews/2015/06/02/mom-posts-10-things-she-hates-about-having-a-child-with-down-syndrome/ "I am 30 years old, and it took me so damn long to learn what ’empathy’ is. It is simply placing yourself in the shoes of another person, and understanding how they feel." Some parents never had that capacity for any number of reasons; feelings were not things you were allowed to have unless they were just happy but not TOO happy and always under control. Sometimes that capacity is lost along with other aspects of brain power due to dementia. But empathy is what lets us connect on a deeper level. Some of us just have to settle for the shallower levels full of getting nails done and gossip and dumb TV shows with our loved ones. I don't how much it helps to be able to realize the depressed, un-empathetic one is the one with the greater problem and the inability, that its not a reflection of your unworthiness. The parent is a powerful mirror to the child...it is not easy to overcome that negative image.

I did eventually learn that I could not ever get the kind of unconditional love or acceptance from my parents that I craved and hoped for, even until early adulthood. I finally just realized it was a Yes, We Have No Bananas situation where Mom just did not have it to give and Dad was pretty much in the role of the Good Provider and did not challenge mom in the child rearing arena...I learned only later, after he developed dementia, that he not only loved and cared in all the ways he was "allowed" to, but was proud of me and his grandkids too.

There is a hymn we sing at church now and again about the folks that have gone on before us...there is a line about meeting up in heaven, "We shall feel their acceptance, and joy of new life" and I still tend to tear up. Acceptance would have been a nice thing to have in THIS world, no? But, sometimes you just have to plant your own garden and don't let anyone yell at you for displacing a few weeds to do it.

Boy Jessie your mom and mine must come from the same family... Like you, I've been hitting my head against a wall hoping my mother would even 'notice' that she had a daughter. Now that I'm older and had her move by (which became 'in') with me, I"m exhausted... It seems the more I try, the worse it gets. The rejection of a mother hurts so badly (even if they grew up where their mother didn't show any love towards them). Recently, I was sick and my mother said "now, don't pretend you are sick"... Do you ever feel like you can't be shocked by what your mother will say, but then comes another shocker?!... Lately, I tried to tell her how I feel and she just turns her back on me with her silence and walks away. I'm just about in tears tonight because I always wanted to have good memories in case she passes... Now, it seems like the nightmare of her silence will haunt me for the rest of my life... Yep... My house/home feels like a morgue now.

CarlaCB...I just read your post and I had too smile. My mother is only 76 and I pray she will cross over before we have to put her in a nursing home. She can be very needy emotionally. I really do not feel that she would do well in a home where they do not have the time to really pay attention to you.

I am trying to find work outside the home that will bring some joy into my life. I have alot of hobbies, but very little social life. Hoping that eventually will be able to afford to have someone to come in a few days a week and keep mom company. My sister is very helpful financially, but she has a large family and works in the family business, so most of the one on one is for me.

Some days I enjoy the time with my mother, but other days I feel like I am 12yrs old again living with the moody, depressed, controlling wench that I grew up with :)

Wow Meowserkat - I can't imagine doing this for 11 years. My mother is only 84 and I've been her maid/servant/chore fairy for 4.5 years. My mother is the bossy and demanding type too and that drives me crazy and makes me avoid spending time with her.

I don't know what I'll do if my mother lives into her nineties. I can't even contemplate the thought. It frightens me also to think that a person in a nursing home still needs a "helper" waiting in attendance on them. But my mother is the type who always wanted things done for her and I can see myself right there holding the water glass to her lips, spreading the blanket over her and folding it up again. I'm just praying it doesn't last for years on end because you can't really have a life and be doing that, and how do you maintain your spirits, and your enthusiasm for life that way?

I'm glad you found this site and we can all commiserate with each other.

Meow - I feel for you. That is a long, long time to care for someone that there is really no relationship with. I often tell my husband that we are only at the beginning of this journey. There was a stroke and broken hip and then the dementia/ AZ. It scares me to no end that are lives will forever be filled with carrying for others and then we will be too old to have any life left that we ourselves won't need caring for!

MeowserKat, I could feel the anguish in your thread. It can feel like being in an empty box doing chores sometimes. Or like coming home to a morgue when there's no warm feelings or conversation anywhere around. It does give a lot of time for reflecting on how things got to be like they are. You said your biological father left before you were born. I wondered if you ever got to meet or know him and what he might have become after he left. I wondered if there was no love there or if his leaving had taken a big part of your mother with him. Some people take things harder than others. I know a woman who is about 80 now. Her husband cheated on her about 50 years ago. They divorced and she took him to court repeatedly, trying to destroy him from the appearance of it. Since then, she has not been able to form a relationship with a man. She gets closer, then pushes them away. Seeing her life, I wonder if the husband had hurt her that badly or if maybe she had pushed him away to another woman. We can never tell.

Isn't it strange that we can continue to feel responsible for their well-being? I don't know how much time I would spend with my mother if she went into skilled care. As long as I brought her things she wanted, I don't think she would care if I was there. In the past year she has been pulling away from everybody even more than before.

Caregiving can really bring up some very deep issues inside of us. When I wrote the first message of this thread, it made me think of Carly Simon's old song "That's the Way I've Always Heard It Should Be." It is a kind of depressing song, but thinking on the things can be enriching in a way... as long as we don't lose ourselves somehow on a long, isolated journey.

This is an interesting thread because it comes back to that old question "nature vs nurture" doesn't it? We see the pampered "favorite" children especially the sons, who most often turn out to be the least successful, most selfish. (Is it because Mom and Dad created a selfish spoiled adult ,or is it because they could see the weakness in the child and tried to compensate for them?) The man who can't express himself - is it because his parents never taught him to communicate feelings of love and tenderness, put him down, or were cold themselves, or was he neglected - or is it just his inherited nature? I used to think, like Dr. Spock kept saying - it was all about nurture, but after 69 years on this earth, I lean toward - "its in the genes". I know people with five children, two adopted, all raised the same, exactly. One adopted child had health and mental problems, the other is a rebel with tats and nose rings, in trouble, etc. The natural children - successful, educated, healthy families. Why do identical twins, raised apart, end up with similar occupations, hobbies, likes and dislikes? Why are siblings so different (but, you see that one resembles Dad, the other has a personality just like Aunt Martha, etc) You can change the environment, modify behavior, but you can't change the genes, can't change the way a person thinks, etc. Just speculating.............

Wow, Jessiebelle...It's almost like we've lived parallel lives. My mother is distant, too...in fact, I never remember her ever saying that she loves me. She didn't encourage friendships and more or less lived a 'life of purpose'..it always seemed like there was something more important than time spent with others...such as laundry, house cleaning, yard work. My biological father left before I was born, and now that I've lived a lifetime trying to figure it all out, I am wondering if the fact that half of me came from him just made me too difficult to love. She never really wanted to answer any questions about him and the only things that she ever told me about him or his family was negative. So, I like you, am in the middle of this caregiving dilemma....how do I do I all that I have to do for her, and still maintain any 'self'....and who will I be if and when I ever come out of the other side. It's almost 11 years for me, now...she had a stroke when she was 84. She'll be 96 in less than 3 months. This whole year has been an escalating time of declining health for her. She got 'sicker' on January 30th, and we found out that she had a tumor in her colon that ended up being Stage 2 cancer. Since then, she has steadily weakened to where I eventually had to let her stay in the NH that she was admitted to for skilled nursing and rehab. Now, it seems that she is even more controlling than all the other years when I cared for her. Even though she is in a NH, I still end up spending close to 5 hours a day there..and sometimes more, because she 'finds reasons' why I can't leave. At this point, I go in the early morning and help her with breakfast...usually end up spending around 2 hours. I usually detach and go home for a few hours and end up back around 4PM, and remain there until after she has eaten her evening meal and I have cleaned her dentures for her.(She is convinced no one there can do it right!) We don't really hold conversations. I try to talk about family, events going on, she rarely responds and barely shows interest in anything that I talk about. She is more driven to give me commands.....and I, like a trained monkey, am expected to obey! Yesterday afternoon was awful....first it was 'Water!'....and I am supposed to hold the water (that was placed within her reach) for her to drink. When I attempted to sit down, she called for another blanket. She told me that when she called an aid earlier for one, that the aid turned the heater (Mamma's name for the a/c) off and walked out without giving her one. So, I got her a blanket and gently put it over her. Less than 5 minutes later, she was hot and wanted it off. I rolled it down to the foot of the bed and sat again. She then told me that I should fold it because she wasn't going to be needing it. So, I folked it and placed in on top of her chest of drawers, where it managed to slip down to the arm of my chair where I had the audacity to sit! She told me that it slipped and I should place it in a better spot. I put it back on the chest and mentioned that if it slipped again, I'd let it have the chair, where I sat once more. Within minutes, she said that she needed me to put lip balm on her..so, I got up again. And, with that done, the process started all over again with the command for 'Water!' In all honesty, it's becoming harder and harder for me to discipline myself to take that long walk down the hall to her room....but, I will continue. Just wonder if anyone else is experiencing anything like this. I am now 69 years old, and just plain tired....and in need of a life of my own while I am still able to have one! So, Jessiebelle....yes, I do have trouble connecting...and obviously, since I am her only 'child', have trouble disconnecting, too!

notice that too - so....where do we go from here? when there are no other children....

Frances, it is so interesting that you say that. I noticed that the golden children often don't have anything to do with caregiving. The others seem to be the ones who grow up to be the responsible children when it comes to elder care. I do think there is unintentional conditioning in early life that goes into it.

Interesting way this thread is trending. Looking back on my childhood I recognized that as I was the 2nd daughter born a year after my mom miscarried twin boys I have always felt that I was the result of my parents desire for a son. As such I was not as cherished as my older sister (1st child) or my brother who was born less than 2 years after me. Their 4th child was also a boy (heir and a spare!) who also similar feelings of disengagement and trouble connecting with our parents. Even today when we are all in our 50s and 60s 1st daughter and son are the ones our parents seem most interested in but are the ones who are seldom around. 2nd daughter and son are the ones who get the calls for help. Hmmm.

Veronica, you created an interesting alternative from the cared for person's aspect. It's a good reminder that it's important to consider their viewpoints too, and they may not be what we think is best for them.

I did have a few laughs at your descriptions as well, especially the Mr. Garlic Breath!

Terry, you could say that! - that she didn't have a close relationship with her own mother, that is. I did eventually learn not to blame my mother for how she was; in fact I often felt heartbroken for her; but the knock-on effects on her husband and children took some accepting, I can tell you. Understanding helps acceptance, of course; but it doesn't change a single event.

Jessie I don't know how I missed this thread five whole days ago. I was spared the pain of caring for my mother. As an adult I could not bear to have her touch me. She wanted the hello and goodbye kiss and I just managed to sideswipe her cheek. All her siblings were the same and from an early age just could not bear any of these strange adults I hardly knew to embrace me. mother wanted to know everything about my life and if I inadvertantly left a letter out she would read it without asking. "Oh I saw a letter from N I thought you left it out for me to read" I have no idea what else she got into when I wasn't home and she was watching the kids. When we got married in a hurry she must have written to a friend that she thought we "had to" because the friend wrote back sympathising with her "after all you have done for her" Well that pregnancy lasted 6 years so there. all the above is background for what my husband has been diagnosed with which is "Attachment disorder" he was born early in WW11 and his parent were simply swamped so he spent many hours alone left to cry. he was fed etc and well cared for physically but not emotionally. That has resulted in him not being able to bond with others, especially with our children. It is only by my efforts that they have any connection. Interestingly when he thought he was having a stroke and went to the ER he was afraid he would not be able to talk and told one of the nurses to be sure and tell me he loved me. that meant the world to me and has sustained me through many bouts of bad behavior.
Jessie I wonder if your mother never bonded with her parents and that is why she is unable to bond with you.
As I get older it becomes harder and harder both mentally and physically to get things done and many jobs get started but sit waiting to be finished. it is not because I am not interested but literally don't have the energy or strength.
i really do enjoy being on this site and talking to all my friends. Obviosley caregivers don't want their loved ones on the same site but I wonder if something like this where people being cared for could share their own thoughts and feelings.
Maybe Jessie's mom would write " I wish Jessie would not talk so much, it is really annoying when she shouts at me. Doesn't she know I just love these old songs on Lawrence Welk. Doesn't she know I just want to sit here and watch TV and not walk that stupid dog. it's cold outside and they go too fast for me. makes me feel stupid having to use that walker where everyone can see me" Someone else would write back "I know what you mean jessie's Mom my daughter wants me to go to the senior center on chair exercise day. if i wanted to sit a and squeeze a stupid ball I could do it at home in my comfy recliner not a stupid hard plastic chair in case I pee myself. I can tell you if they make me dance with Mr garlic breath again I will more than pee myself, and the bathroom....well I won't go there because after Mrs S has been in there you can tell what she had for dinner last night. Then there is the knitting group. I don't need triple zero needles to knit a dishcloth, Anyway when I get it home my daughter tells me how much she likes then uses it to wipe that stupid dog's feet. new did have dogs in the house anyway. Give me a herd on Angus and I'm happy. How I miss the farm"
Sorry guys I got on a roll and probably not much comfort for Jessie. I feel as though I am in a kind of no man's land between youth and useless old age.
Mirror mirror on the wall am I really that old?