What am I to do?

I am sorry, but the daughter has the problem not you. You and your husband have to do what works for you. Really sad that your daughter cannot see the devotion you have to take care of your mom. That is what love is about! I will pray for you too.

Many years ago when my husband and I divorced, one of my 2 sons lived away and did not understand the situation. Mainly because I didn't now want to include my grown sons on a lot of my decision. However, he didn't send me pictures of his first son and didn't answer my calls - if he wanted to hold my grandson hostage because of my choices that was his choice. I still loved them all no matter what...but I let them be, and stayed the same. My son came around and all worked out fine.
I say that because again...you can still love your grandson and you can still be yourself....just don't let your daughter control you!!!

I am in a similar situation now with my mom...I take care of her..... and when my older son wants to come to town... he knows my mom can't handle the 3 kids running around here ... so if he needs help finding a place to stay I will help. He can bring the kids to visit but they can't stay over night...as much as I love them.

We all have outside battle when taking care of an elderly parent... please choose the battles that affect your daily life the most and the others will fall in line. None of us are super heroes!!

Blessing to you and your husband !!

In my world I would expect my adult children to understand that I am being a good daughter, will take my mom to the finish line and they need to follow the rules in my home. I have and will again tell my daughter if she thinks I was a bad mom she needs counseling and to avoid me. No adult needs to spend time with a parent they think was a bad parent. As adults we can choose what we do and where we go. That stopped my daughters nonsense talk pretty quickly. {she is 50 and still brings up a non corporal punishment when she was 14! Enough! This is your home..if your husbands comfortable with the situation your kids need to stay at a motel when they visit. The their children need to behave reasonably and respect their grandparents. Schedule a lunch when possible …even halfway…. between your homes for some quality time with your daughter. Put your mental health first.

Sandrawhocares: Imho, perhaps the daughter(s) and you could have some alone time in the form of a meet up for lunch, shopping, etc.

Sandra, when the 5 year old comes over, is he allowed to behave the way you described the 2 of them behaving?

I ask because this is where the issues could come from. He needs to behave when alone to set the example for his cousin that doesn't get to see you almost daily.

My brothers 5 kids could spend weeks at my house without ever having this problem. The rules were the rules and equally enforced. We are a noisy family under the best circumstances but, we teach the kids that there is a time and place and in the middle of the house is not it. But, it has to apply to them all, individually or in a group. It works this way.

Is it possible for you to go visit your daughter and have time with just her and her family in their home to see what that dynamic looks like?

My take on this. Your daughter wanted to spend some real family time with her mom without it all being about grandma. Right or wrong she just wanted your undivided attention.

I know I got very tired of every family event being about my father’s needs and comfort. Just once I would have liked someone else’s needs or wants to take priority. I can just imagine how my kids felt that everything had to revolve my father. For years…..

Caring for her mother is admirable. But maybe her daughter needs some private time with her mother.

There needs to be compromise all the way around.

It’s her choice, just go along with it. If she cannot control her children and doesn’t see she is being unreasonable then she needs to grow up. Leave her to it, hopefully she will mature when son is older, but maybe she is just part of the current me first generation in spite of you efforts. Talk to her by phone to keep in touch, but hang up telling her you don’t have to listen to her rudeness if she isn’t civil.

Your daughter is being a selfish brat and maybe she needs a “ wake up call”’about how hard this is on YOU. Shame on her for being judgemental.. what are her kids learning from how she’s treating you? I would give her some space and time to think about the way she spoke to you. If she wants things “ changed”‘maybe she could spend some time helping you rather than just lip service. Her behavior is hurtful and disgusting and I’d let her know exactly that. You need support… not ridicule. Bless you💜

Here is my 2 cents worth.

Something I noticed, Your mother seems to spend a lot of time in her recliner. Please watch out for bedsores on her bottom. My neighbor spent a lot of time in a recliner, even sleeping in it, and he got pretty bad bedsores.

Is there somewhere the boys can play with noise, but I would NEVER leave them alone. To be hurt by a cousin who is supposed to love you and to have the adults in your life let it happen, is unconscionable. Do you have an outside place or a garage where they could go and be supervised. Your mother needs to tone it down too. Compromise.

I came from a very dysfunctional home and I wasn't a very good mother. I knew it, but didn't know what to do. To make a long story bearable, I finally, told my daughters I was getting therapy to stop the chain of abuse. Some of the things my therapist told me to tell my one daughter when she attacked me verbly was. (1) You could be right! I'll have to think about it. (2) I did the best I knew how to at the time. (3)I Iooked for help. (4) I have learned a lot since then. (5) I did try to keep you children safe. (6) it was over 20 years ago. I did offer to pay for their therapy for awhile, this was done in a loving manner. I have apologized several times for hurting them. I didn't mean to.

Not now when feelings are so raw, but later on, try to find why your 10 year old grandson is acting out. He may have some disabilities you don't know about. Of course he just could be a mean, bratty, kid, they do exist.

I also have one daughter who has decided that I did everything wrong in her childhood and more or less ever since, and who also has two badly behaved children. I did my best to sort this out (going to a counselor etc), and failed. If your daughter is like mine, you will also not have much luck in ‘making up’. The chances are that the next visit will repeat repeat repeat and make things worse. The grandchildren were then dangled like bait, and I decided that I could manage without that set for a while. I’m not going to be ordered around, or have myself and my husband of 20 years disrespected nastily and unreasonably.

My experience suggests that the most workable option right now is to forget about this little bit of the family, and see if time will ‘wound all heels’.

I will go against the majority. Your daughters and your grandchildren deserve your consideration and at times your undivided attention. Make arrangements to spend time with daughters and grandchildren without grandma in the middle of things. Hire a sitter for grandma. Take your daughters and grandchildren out to dinner or somewhere else.

1. kids should be taught to respect your house and your property. they should also be taught to respect each other.
2. they should also be taught to respect their great grandma. And that grandma is not well and they should be a bit better mannered around her. (They can play in the room their mom wants you to move mom to!)
3. If your sister does not want to restrain her kid and respect your house then she can either :
a) not come
b) get a hotel room for the few days she will be there

The one grandchild that is there more often should also follow the same rules that you expect the other to follow.
Yes kids can be noisy but there are noises for Inside the house and noises for Outside. Just like they are told at school...Inside voices. And while inside...Walking feet.

You won't change the set up because it works for you and that is fine. but you can set ground rules for how they behave but you have to be consistent.

Boys are boys. And sounds like they aren't raised to have quiet time. Like if they come will they color or read?
If things work for you then leave it.
The daughter can come up with another location to visit you for a holiday season, before or after the actual holiday. If you and husband can go together or just you or just him.
. Doesn't sound good if 10 year old hurts the 5 year old, there is some issues there with the 10 year old. Prayers for him.
Daughter will have to learn that right now- there is a vulnerable elderly person in the family. Someday she will not be here , and she is then welcome to come to your place, but for now, her inflexibility means boundaries.

I think growing up includes saying out loud the grudges you have against your parents. Eventually, most people realize that childhood desires for perfect parents are unreasonable. If the sins were horrendous, you wouldn't be listening to her complaints. It does sound like she begrudges your attention directed to others' needs above hers. I agree with others that you should explain that you are doing the best you can. If she can offer a solution, other than isolating your mother for long periods, ask her to do so. You are rather overwhelmed and not in shape to generate new solutions easily. Explain this again and ask both of your daughters for positive solutions, saying they are most welcome and do make new ideas welcome for consideration. But don't beat yourself up. If you can manage someone to stay with your mother while you go elsewhere with your daughters together or separately, the break might do all of you some good. Even your Mom.

You see one daughter/grandson every day, so no real problem there. Your other daughter was most likely really looking forward to the Thanksgiving visit, which turned into a disaster. She sounds more sensitive, and her feelings are hurt, because she wants to have the same closeness you share with other daughter/grandson, but cannot. Perhaps, this hurt feeling and possibly jealousy has been picked up by her son and that's why he acts out on the 5 year old?
Regardless, there needs to be some degree of compromise here on everyone's part. The suggestion for noise cancelling headphones for your mom is a good one. There are great wireless versions that my Mom used which allowed us to keep the TV volume down and filter out "company" noise. Buy them now and get your Mom to use them so she is comfortable using them during family visits. Either/both daughter(s) can bring iPads to your home to keep the kids occupied. Keep visits shorter or structure them when weather permits some outdoor activities to break up the day. Ask daughter who lives nearby to host some time in her home. As I said, compromise by EVERYONE.
Mend your fence with distanced daughter, acknowledge her hurt feelings but carefully explain why your Mom needs to remain in LR. Express your desire to see her and grandson and brainstorm other ways to make the visits work. Younger daughter needs to cooperate also. Life is short. Time flies and I think as the children get older, this dilemma will become a non-issue.

Do nothing different.

Have your other daughter stay with mom while you meet with the other daughter outside of the home..

you and husband meet daughter and Grand fir lunch,, movie, Zoo, ect
If she comes back for a visit and she and Grandson can stay at the other daughter's house or a motel..

or hire a Sitter to stay with mom while you and hubby visit at your in town daughter's house.

Your daughter has not accepted that you probably did "the best you knew how to do" in bringing her up. Maybe there were some mistakes made, but all parents make some mistakes. Don't try to defend yourself; that just escalates the argument. You did your best. Right now you have arranged your house and your mother's care and do not need to tolerate the noise and disruption of rowdy grandchildren. It will be much more peaceful if your daughter stays away. She and the boys can come back when the boys are better behaved and when your daughter has grown up enough to honor your home however you choose to keep it

Kids ARE noisy; it is part of their nature.

However, I can see how this wasn't the best family gathering. She had expectations that apparently were not met - not your fault. It also seems she has some unresolved issues from the past - not your fault. You have expectations that might not have been met, but you made the best of it because you love all those people.

I am having similar issues with one of my adult daughters; she is a perfectionist, hard to please, and tends to hold grudges. I am working at trying to praise her for all the good she does. She is seeing a counselor. I am looking forward to several sessions of discussing expectations. Communicating lovingly about expectations is what is truly needed in our relationship, maybe yours too.

First, honor YOUR needs and those of your husband and mother. Second, accept that you daughter’s issues are HERS to fix, not yours and don’t waste energy stressing over a grown woman’s issues. Most kids think their parents made huge and numerous mistakes when raising them. Truth is, we DID make mistakes because we are imperfect human beings. But mostly our mistakes are relatively low impact. We do the best we can at the time, we correct the mistakes that we can and that is as good as it gets. Clearly, child rearing doesn’t end at 18 years. After that, it’s life rearing. Your daughter has a lot of growing and learning left to do and as an adult, that’s on her. No doubt, she will have a different perspective when her son grows up. Until then, I would focus on my life with my in-house family and those who add to your peace and joy. If she can’t do that, leave her to her folly and keep a light on in case she finishes growing up. Best wishes.

Cut off contact with her and don’t let her push you around .

I would tell her here are the house rules and I am the mother so that is IT. The ten yr old boy needs help with a psychologist because with him hurting his nephew that isn't right. It will only get worse if they allow it to continue. If your daughter can't abide by house rules then there isn't too much you can do. Where is the respect from your oldest I don't see that. I would tell them both we don't do that in grandma's house. I can see the 5 yr old being loud but not a 10 yr old where is his respect of your house.

We never did that in my grandparents home being wild or loud that isn't respecting our grandparents.

Sounds like she is projecting her frustrations on to you. There are calm ways to discuss past issues of treatment ( my mother and I have had many talks like you described ) I finally sought help for trauma I had and found that in the past I didn't deal with my close family the best.
It's your home, YOUR RULES. Her home, her RULES. Don't let her use children as bargain chips or emotional blackmail. Ahhh She will get old one day or suddenly disabled like me at 36 and man will her perception change about family and caretakers....Love to you

I read this as older daughter being selfish and a bully and the behavior has filtered down to and manifested to the insecurity of her son.
Why's a 10yr old jealous of a 5yr old cousin he presumably doesn't see often?

I think it's mean of her to want grandma shut away in another room away from the family. That I don't understand.

Maybe ask your younger daughter if she has any insight to what's going on with her sister? It sounds like deep seated something she's been dwelling on for years.
I have a sister like that - jealous of another sister to the point of very ugly expectations.

Before I read other responses I will share my thoughts.

I am sorry you are going through this. I think if where your mom is in your home is what works for you best then you do not change it (since it is not an easy move). If you don’t think there is an easy solution to move mom then she should respect that.

I would suggest maybe trying some noice canceling headphones for mom to try maybe when the kids come over as I don’t want you to sacrifice your time with your grandchildren - as you deserve that.

My mom is also in the middle of my home - so I know it is not easy to move them. I’m in Florida so it is much easier to have gatherings or do things outdoors - so as I said maybe trying some headphones for mom so it can give her a break from the noise? See if that helps.

Now in regard to the things your daughter said to you - in the past decade I have learned that just because I didn’t think i did anything to hurt someone doesn’t mean that wherever they were in their life - their day - etc that they were not affected by something I might have done. It doesn’t mean I wanted someone to feel the way they felt nor does it mean I did anything purposeful - but in life we can never tell someone what they felt - I have learned to validate someone’s feeling - I try my best to see if I did something I was unaware of or if maybe that person was in the midst of something that it just felt that way to them.
Put 10 people in a room and read a statement - every person will read the statement or process it in a way that reflects where they are in their day - their life - usually not one of us is the same - this is how relationships get hurt and then these blow ups can happen. Years back when a best friend told me I hurt her - I thought no way - “I adored her - “she has and still is my best friend since I was 5” but fact is in my crazy life and busy days she started getting hurt - she didn’t feel important to me - I had to put myself in her shoes and say “I know I never thought I was hurting her but in that moment she did feel that way” - I validated her - she realized I never saw it - it doesn’t mean she was right nor I was right - it just meant she needed more from me and I wasn’t seeing her enough that she felt hurt. Now we communicate better - but it made me realize all the times I felt hurt by someone - and they honestly probably didn’t see it - we are all so very different - we all have different ways we love and see each other - I now give people the chance to say “oh my I had no idea you felt that way” - the brain and heart can confabulate our feelings. It can fill in things that didn’t happen just by what and where we are at in our lives that day - it’s why the game telephone always ends up with the wrong ending - our brains can place things in there based off of our emotions. So just breathe - maybe reach out to your daughter and ask to talk. Explain to her that you love her - you are not in denial - you never meant to hurt her and if you did - you were u aware. Wishing you better days - better communication and peace for all of your relationships - also keep yourself happy in the mix as you and your thoughts and feelings matter as well- try to find a compromise with your daughter - tell her you understand that it’s not ideal and maybe things like getting a hotel - getting your mom some headphones - planning an outing to burn energy of little kids so they are not cooped up the whole visit - trips to a playground - hiring a friend to even entertain/sit with ur mom a few hours - so your daughter feels like she gets time with you - etc - don’t give up on the relationship and get angry - just tell her that you hear her - but she also has to hear you and that your open to additional things but it is too much to move your mom every visit. 🦋

Adding if your other daughter of the 5 year old lives near you why not have the celebrations at her house. Mom can see everyone there for an hour or so and go back home to the peace and quiet.

What do people expect children to do just sit there and watch tv? Not much fun for kids 10 and 5. What types of entertainment did you have ready for the kids? At that age they need to do fun things. Now the 10 year old hurting the 5 year old is an issue but most parents just turn a blind eye to said issues when the chip is young and can actually be helped. This happens more often than not in families.

I can see that you’re frustrated with your daughter.

However, it appears that both of you are shouting at each other, and neither are listening. If you really are invested in solving this problem with her, you have to validate her feelings. You do that for her, and she will do that for you. Someone has to be the grownup and do it first, and since you are older and wiser, it should be you.

Perhaps I’m biased because I too am a mom with young kids (aged 5 and 7). Yes, they’re noisy and rambunctious, but children are. The sad truth is, you don’t want to deal with it, she won’t come back. It’s hurting your daughter’s feelings by you criticizing her children. It implies (true or not) that she is a bad mother. This is what she hears.

Successful relationships are all about compromise. How can you compromise so that you do not damage your relationship with your daughter and you can both be happy?

If your daughter feels so strongly about this, then it is on her to pay for separate accommodations for her family. And it's on her to get her two children to act respectful to you and the elder.

Nothing like a daughter who cannot control a 10-year-old (where's Dad?), doesn't like to see Grandma because she's icky, and then decides her failures as a decent human being are your fault.

If her upbringing was so terrible, then she could make lemonade from those lemons, but she's a weak person who doesn't take responsibility for her own life and decisions. Her maturity is stunted, and that's not your problem.

I recently heard that the latest thing for young people is to sever ties with their so-called "toxic" parents rather than act like adults and seek a solution to problems. It's a childish approach, but everyone's decided their own mental health is far more important than family so there it is. Sounds like you have one of those silly, woke children. Again, not your fault, so just let her have her little tantrum, and don't change a thing about YOUR home.

I would be asking her what is wrong with her life and if she has sought out any help. To behave this way and the way her son is behaving is acting out and is usually caused by big life problems. Is baby daddy around at all? Does your grandson have any medical issues? Is she having difficulties dealing with his behavior?

Not being able to trust him with his cousin is a HUGE warning sign of things not right. This is more then jealousy.

I tell my family, my house has rules and your children know them, you know them, if you don't correct them, I will and I guarantee that you won't like it and neither will your kidlet. I actually put one nephew out the front door in the rain because he didn't want to follow the rules and tried pulling a screaming tantrum to get his way. Didn't take long for him to apologize and get to come back in. Mom was mad but, oh well, she didn't deal with it so I did.

There is a time and place and holidays at grandma's house or anyone's is not one of them. If you need to burn energy, outside.

Inside voice or outside voice apparently doesn't exist anymore? Kids need to be taught that they don't get to behave in a way that negatively impacts others. That's life and applies in every situation.

Letting kids behave like little monsters isn't doing them any favors and it makes life for everyone harder then it has to be.