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They refuse to leave their home and depend on us to care for them. We need a third party to have a discussion with them because I have tried and they just get mad and yell.
keepthefaith, so many of us on these forums have gone through the same thing with our parents. As for a 3rd party to talk to them, it would need to be someone whom they would take such advice. Such as someone from the church/temple.... an Elder Law Attorney... a close friend. Parents usually don't listen to us, as we are just the "kids" and what do we know... [sigh].
By the way, if your parents are still of clear mind [no dementia], then they can do whatever they want to do. They can stay in that house forever.
Gather the sibling(s) and everyone write down what they do for Mom and Dad, and I mean everything. Now take that list and cross off half the items.... now cross off a couple more. Stick to the items remaining on the list, don't budge. If your parent ask for something not on the list, say "sorry, I cannot possibly do that". Yep, you will feel guilty. But it's a project to get one's parent to see the reality of their life. Especially if they can afford to move to Independent Living, which is around $5k per month, depending on where you live. Or your parents hire professional caregivers to come to the house to help. My own Mom refused them.
What is currently happening is that you and your sibling(s) are enabling your parents to remain in their house. Why should they move??? They have their children helping out with everything. And they don't see us being tired and overwhelmed. They see us as being in our 20's with a ton of energy.... not someone who is also aging with our own health issues.
My parents were in their 90's and still living in their house. One has to wait for a medical emergency to happen where the parent goes to the hospital via 911, then into rehab, and then into senior living. But, like I said, if your parents are of clear mind, they can go home, and one spouse will claim the other spouse can take care of them. Yep, that also happened to my parents. It wasn't until another medical emergency happened that changed everything.
keepthefaith, now if your parents refuse to have strangers in the house, I had a light bulb moment with my parents on how to get tradesmen into the house to do work.
I remember my Dad needed a new florescent ceiling light. Nope, no more climbing ladders for me, told Dad he needs to call an electrician. Oh no, no strangers in the house. No, nada, never.
Well, I remember a few years back my parents liked the painter I had recommended, perfect match. So I called the painter and asked if he could recommend an electrician. Bravo, I have a name.
So I called my parents and said "Mike recommended Joe at ABC, he is excellent". Next thing I knew when I drove past my parent's house, there was the truck in the driveway :) Got another perfect match.
How old are your parents? How much care do they need? Housekeeping? Meals? Transportation to appointments? Medication management? Do they have any signs of dementia?
If they were to sell their house and move into some level of care community, how long could they afford to pay their own way? Do they have lots of assets besides the house? Do they have a decent income (pensions, etc.)?
Somehow what they want, what they can afford, and what they really need, have to be balanced out.
Could they stay in their home longer (maybe not forever) if the care you and your sibs are providing were obtained through agencies or other sources and paid for by your parents?
It is true that your parents can choose to live in their house as long as they want. And you and your siblings will need to set boundaries of what you can and cannot do for them. My 90 year old mother is living somewhat independently in her apartment with my help, and a friend who she pays for extra days she "wants more contact." I have spoken to her doctor privately, since I am her POA and she is getting to the point where she will need to allow extra help if she is to stay there. Of course, it will not be easy, as I have been down this road with her sisters and now her. But you have to be firm, and will feel guilty that you can't do everything your parents want. But you have to be realistic, too, about what they can expect from you. The transition is different for each family, but you and your siblings need to work together to help your parents stay safe and healthy. There is advice about how to broach this delicate subject with your parents, because when it comes down to it, you and your siblings should be a part of the decision making process since they depend on you. For example, until recently my mother would not allow me to go in to her doctor and dentist appointments. Then she would confuse and/or complain about them. I said, "Mom, I can't be a part of this conversation if I'm not a part of your appointments and care." She didn't like that, but after a few days to think about it, she relented. Now I'm allowed in, and she is much less fearful and the results are much more productive. It has to be simply stated in a way they feel included, given time to think about it, and realize and accept your role in their care and safety. I wish you the best!
I agree with the replies about cutting back so you're not enabling! The agencies that provide CNAs and nursing assistants come the first time for a free in-home evaluation. Perhaps you can talk to a few of those companies and see which are willing to help with a judgment call about whether they're safe without 24x7 care, i.e., should be living in assisted care, and bring them out.
ok so they need a caretaker because you/ the others do not want to take care of them and you believe they'd do better in a care center that would use up all the money from selling the home or something else ? What are the exact reasons besides you don't want to have the burden ? As they took care of you and the others throughout life most likely I am sure it was not always convenient and not always financially possible . What did they do with their parents ? These are thoughts to be honest with yourselves on and to remember you are teaching your own kids how to treat you as you grow older .
Sorry but not everyone had nice upbringings. I was neglected and suffered domestic violence from my mother. My father turned a blind eye. I do what I can. They have used there money to do what they want and have always been self absorbed. They ignored their ageing parents. I do loads for them but will stop when enough is enough. They are 96 for goodness sake. Should be being cared for professionally
My MIL was 92 and living alone in a second story apartment that she could no longer get out of. She kept telling us that she was independent and didn't need any help. The truth was that she was completely dependent on her son who lived an hour away in snowy Pennsylvania. He had health problems of his own. It took a broken ankle, which remarkably she recovered from, and the state to say she was no longer safe in her apartment. We called hospice nurses for some advice on nice care homes and got an excellent referral for a home she can afford with a little help from her children. She is very happy there and her son can visit and be her son rather than her caretaker (which wasn't going well cause he was too "bossy"). Anyway, most people don't like the idea of going into assisted living but when someone else it cooking their meals and cleaning their apartment and they get lots of attention they love it. Change is scary for both parents and their children.
I am 67 yrs old and the oldest of 4 children, one deceased. It has always been me. I amvthe one whocwas able to stay in the same town as my parents. I dealt with every hospital stay and was there for my Dad, whom Mom spoiled, when Mom spent 8 months in another state to care for my sister who had Cancer. When Mom could no longer drive I was her chaufer. I went from babysitting an infant for 18 months right into 24/7 care for Mom. The only time I got out was when my husband was home and then justvto shop. There were things he couldn't do for Mom. I am 67 years old and 5' tall. Doing for Mom was exausting. Daycare was a help. But that was only 3x a week from 8 to 2:30. Siblings, both and wives worked and one lived 7 hrs away. I hate the phrase "they did for you". They chose to have children. And I feel I have given back and more. For one thing, they had a free babysitter. With seniors living into their 90s the children are seniors too. We have worked as hard as our parents, raised our kids and sometimes our grandchildren. Retirement is our time. Our parents have to realize their limitations. That their children cannot be expectedto do it all.
OP, not sure if ur question was answered. Call ur county office of aging. Tell them about what ur parents are no longer capable of doing. Has a pan been left on the stove to burn. Falling, forgetting meds, not eating. Ask if someone can do a home eval. Maybe they can sit with parents and explain that they no longer can care for themselves and children r limited in what they can do.
Someone on the forum said she had asked her parents if they wanted someone who wasn't trained asca caregiver and other things they expected out of her. They said no and she said then u don't want me. Our parents weren't everything to us, we can't be everything to them. We all have limitations. I feel our responsibility is to make sure our parents fed, safe, clean, etc. If we need help to accomplish this, get it.
LynninIowa, the two situations are entirely different. When my parents had us, they were young and healthy. They were only responsible for care of our little family, as their parents were taking care of themselves.
But now, we are seniors too and caring for our parents is not our only responsibility. Unlike our mothers, we have fulltime jobs. Our spouses have elderly parents needing care, too. And we and our spouses have our own health problems that limit our abilities and command our daily attention. And....sometimes our kids and grandkids need us. You ask why the poster doesn't want the added burden? Perhaps because s/he already has a full plate with her own family and cannot added 24/7 hands on care of two elderly parents.
I am chopped liver, LOL, but my mother tends to listen to her doctor. I've had him slip in an opinion or two when she has an appointment. Then she comes out of the appointment with an idea she thinks is her own. It doesn't always work, but when it does it's heaven! Hope that helps.
We were not obligated to be born We were not obligated to becomes parents. We should not be obligated to become caregivers to our parents. Those things are choices to be made freely. So those who think we are required to care for our elderly parents because they did it when we were little needs a reality check.
My mother came right out and said she never cared about me. As she put it herself, she only took care of me until my dad got home from work. When he died in 1974 I promised him I would take care of her. It didn't mean I had to do it all myself. It meant I would see she had a roof over her head, food, and medicine. Not all of us had parents who "took care of us".
I have my own caregiving agency here in Chicago. We see this kind of problem often. All the children have to have a talk with the parents and agree and what they can do and what they can't do (freqflyer is correct). I usually go to the house and talk to the parents and children (most often the one child that the parent listen to and feel confident with). We then can go over the list of what the children can do and what they can't do and let them know we can provide the rest on the list and the rate of our services. We often do a trial but usually it is not a problem since once they start the care they do see the benefits and realize that they need the help after all. If you want them to move into an assisted living facility it would be because they require a lot of help and a lot of people in their 80's or 90's only require so many hours per day or week. My own mother moved into a facility not because she had medical problems but because my father passed and she was lonely and wanted to be around people. When you parents are ready is when they are not able to care for themselves or are alone without the other spouse. Good luck!
Have your parents been evaluated for competency? If so, are they competent? If so, then they can stay in their own home if they choose. What you can do though if they're competent and still choose to stay home you can suggest they hire an in-home healthcare aid or other alternative health. Explain to them that you can't take care of them anymore and that they will be other arrangements.
If by chance they're incompetent, they'll most likely need a guardian
The "they took care of you when you were a baby" argument mixes applies and oranges. Assuming they DID take care of you, unless you were disabled, you learned every day to do more and more for yourself. And you parents were younger. And likely your mom was a stay at home mom not in the full time workforce to support the family. And remember not so long ago, "old" people were okay til one day they had a stroke or heart attack and fell dead. Not so much this long slow decline with mounting medical problems into their 90's. Very different considerations apply here. After all, if your parents had some retirement years that they enjoyed then why it is unreasonable for their kids to want the same?
I'm confused, how bad are you parents? If they are still in there right mind and just need help with getting around and taking care of the home and or running errands, then maybe it's more of a caregiver burnout, which we all go through. If its more than what I listed and you parents are need more help, then yeah find someone like their preacher or a life long friend etc. I'm taking care of my mother and yes it destroyed certain dreams I had, but theres not a chance in you know what that I'll put her in a home, that is unless she needs more help than I can provide with assistants from outside agency's. State ran homes suck and I don't want to go that route if I can help it. I agree with lynnniowa, they took care of us and yes it's a diff situation but it's also our family so we have to find a balance if that's possible.
I think Lynn and Roger do not understand the strain taking care of an elder causes. Sure they took care of us as children but taking care of a child is entirely different than taking care of a 150 pound adult who still thinks they are in charge. A child will learn and become more independent but an elder will become more childlike and helpless. There is no shame in not being able to be everything to one's parents. I'm sorry but no parent should take away their adult child's future (or dreams).
I do feel we owe something to our parents but not our entire lives and future. You need to see that they are in a home and are safe. However that does not mean you have to give up your life so theirs remains the same. That is the key.
To the OP, decide what you can continue to do and do that and only that. If they want to be independent let them....on their own. Let them really see what being independent is. My father was not nearly as bad as some of the elders on here but he still wanted too much and more than I could do. He ran me ragged with constant doctor appointments often over NOTHING until I finally put my foot down and said no more. I found that he wanted everything for his convenience and somehow had it in his mind me taking time from work to run him to a doctor's appointment was some sort of treat for me. I compromised with him and told him tot take a taxi to a late day appointment and I would pick him out and get him home. Even though it was out of my way I was willing to do that. His counter offer was to make the appointment after I got off of work. What he did not get was that I did not have the time to waste sitting in a waiting room for him because he didn't want to make the effort on his own.
Every time I took him out of AL this year he would mention wanting to go to the ER on our way home. He would prefer I sat with him in the ER for 6+ hours over something minor so he had an immediate ride home rather than being set over by AL and having to wait for a ride back provided by medical transport. He forgets I have work and other responsibilities.
Bottom line is. Decide what you can do and that is it. Let them figure out the rest. Maybe they will see the light of assisted living. There are many nice places, they no longer look like psych wards.
I do understand the strain of taking care of a parent. You dont know me so please dont say you do or imply you do just because we have a difference of opinion. When nobody else will step up to the plate you do what you have to do. Reread the first part of my post, there is a time when alternatives are needed, but not because it's inconvenient. I won't pass off my parent to a crappy state ran home, just because it's not convenient. I want to stress, stress, stress, if people are wanting to find a home someone because they need more help than you can provide, like medical help the yes! By all means get some help. I once talked to a lady who's daughter told her she had to go to a home just because of her age and she was no longer able to drive, this is the type of situation I'm referring to when I say step up. I'm also the type who tries to help others when I can.
Please let's note that close to 40% of primary caregivers who are taking care of their parents or another family member pass away leaving behind the person they were caring. Those are NOT good odds. Ok, now what?
Chances are that parent or family member will be placed in Assisted Living or into nursing home where they will continue to thrive for many more years. If this was done earlier on, that caregiver would be alive today.
You never hear of 40% of young couples die caregiving babies, toddlers, grader schoolers. Not even 20% or even 5%.
I've been on these forums for a few years. I have seen caregiver writers here needing to stop taking care of a parent because they themselves had a massive heart attack, had strokes, several had stress related breast cancer, breaks from falls, etc.
My cousin was taking care of his Mom who refused to move from her house until she was 98. And his MIL also in her 90's, refused to move from her own house. My cousin and his wife had to give up their dream home and THEY moved into a senior community condo because he could no longer maintain 3 large homes plus cutting the lawns for the past 30 years. His Mom passed at 99. MIL, who is 100, recently sold her house and moved into the condo with them. The kicker here is, he is now developing dementia. Good-bye to their plans of world travel that they saved decades to enjoys.
Sadly, they may not listen to anyone. Like many of us you might have to wait for a crisis. After several falls, broken hip and arm, rehabilitation at nursing home three times in two years, I said enough. You cannot go home and moved her to a nice assisted living apartment. My mother is 92 in poor health and has leaned on me since my father died 18 years ago. It's true, we are seniors taking care of older seniors. My own mother's parents died in their 70s and she had two sisters and a brother who lived close to them. She has no idea what I went through. I received a lot of very good advice here, but it was up to me to follow through and set limits. I won't lie, it was h*ll to go through, but then my life of caregiving was h*llish anyway. It got more intense for a while, but it is better now and my mother has adjusted. Good luck to you.
Its true we go through a lot with our parents. My advice to you would be get a private caregiver to look at your mom in the comfort of her own home if thats what she want and can afford. Don't work yourself so hard it will destroy the pure love you have for your mom while you should be enjoying her golden years.
I say private caregivers if possible because in my experience they care from the depth of their heart, well caregivers from agencies still do good job but not like private caregivers.
I just had "the talk" with Mother two days ago. She NEEDS to go into assisted living, but that's not happening. I am going to set up a 3-day a week aide system for her. (This is what I did for a career, for several years, and this is the company I worked for, so hopefully we can find someone to help her, whom she will get along with and enjoy). It was HARD telling mother that we simply can't do for her any more. She just requires so much care, and tho she lives with my brother's family in her own apt., it's not their responsibility to care for her 24/7. In fact, my brother just had major back surgery and will never be able to lift her again. I was kind with her, but told her to choose between the ALF or an aide coming in. She was happy to try the aide and we'll see how it goes. I am the only one of 5 siblings who will deal with "mom issues" head on, the rest just go MIA. So I get all the grief and pushback. Drives me crazy, but it comes with the territory of having elderly parents.
Hopefully this will work out and in the end, the time we spend with her can be quality time, not "cleaning and running errands" time, which is what she needs us for. I'm cautiously optimistic.
Being honest with her was helpful, I think. I didn't sugarcoat anything and told her that she may not have the option of always remaining in the relative comfort of her own apartment. She knows that, but actually saying it to her--it was hard. I wish my sibs would stand up and help me, but they never have and won't.
I agree with the 3rd party talk. My suggestion would be to call in a neutral professional. Calling in a home health care or senior facility to talk with your parents for the purpose of conducting an assessment might not be the most "objective" (not that anyone's not to be trusted or has underhanded intentions.) But, calling the county (DHS/their Area Agency on Aging) and asking if they could conduct a home assessment - under the "guise" of making sure there aren't home enhancements that could increase their safety. Coupled with the list suggestion (very savvy!), everyone should be present - ala family meeting - when this assessment occurs so that the end result is assessor's opinion based on fact and not on what skewed information your parents may provide if you weren't there to speak up. Perhaps this person can help determine that whether home health services are appropriate or moving out of their home...They then can answer questions, I'd expect, with regard to what that would look like, how much it would cost, how to fund their options, etc.
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By the way, if your parents are still of clear mind [no dementia], then they can do whatever they want to do. They can stay in that house forever.
Gather the sibling(s) and everyone write down what they do for Mom and Dad, and I mean everything. Now take that list and cross off half the items.... now cross off a couple more. Stick to the items remaining on the list, don't budge. If your parent ask for something not on the list, say "sorry, I cannot possibly do that". Yep, you will feel guilty. But it's a project to get one's parent to see the reality of their life. Especially if they can afford to move to Independent Living, which is around $5k per month, depending on where you live. Or your parents hire professional caregivers to come to the house to help. My own Mom refused them.
What is currently happening is that you and your sibling(s) are enabling your parents to remain in their house. Why should they move??? They have their children helping out with everything. And they don't see us being tired and overwhelmed. They see us as being in our 20's with a ton of energy.... not someone who is also aging with our own health issues.
My parents were in their 90's and still living in their house. One has to wait for a medical emergency to happen where the parent goes to the hospital via 911, then into rehab, and then into senior living. But, like I said, if your parents are of clear mind, they can go home, and one spouse will claim the other spouse can take care of them. Yep, that also happened to my parents. It wasn't until another medical emergency happened that changed everything.
You are not obligated to do what it takes for your parents to stay "independent". You do what you have time to do. The rest?
" I can't possibly do that,dad. You'll have to hire someone".
I remember my Dad needed a new florescent ceiling light. Nope, no more climbing ladders for me, told Dad he needs to call an electrician. Oh no, no strangers in the house. No, nada, never.
Well, I remember a few years back my parents liked the painter I had recommended, perfect match. So I called the painter and asked if he could recommend an electrician. Bravo, I have a name.
So I called my parents and said "Mike recommended Joe at ABC, he is excellent". Next thing I knew when I drove past my parent's house, there was the truck in the driveway :) Got another perfect match.
If they were to sell their house and move into some level of care community, how long could they afford to pay their own way? Do they have lots of assets besides the house? Do they have a decent income (pensions, etc.)?
Somehow what they want, what they can afford, and what they really need, have to be balanced out.
Could they stay in their home longer (maybe not forever) if the care you and your sibs are providing were obtained through agencies or other sources and paid for by your parents?
I am 67 yrs old and the oldest of 4 children, one deceased. It has always been me. I amvthe one whocwas able to stay in the same town as my parents. I dealt with every hospital stay and was there for my Dad, whom Mom spoiled, when Mom spent 8 months in another state to care for my sister who had Cancer. When Mom could no longer drive I was her chaufer. I went from babysitting an infant for 18 months right into 24/7 care for Mom. The only time I got out was when my husband was home and then justvto shop. There were things he couldn't do for Mom. I am 67 years old and 5' tall. Doing for Mom was exausting. Daycare was a help. But that was only 3x a week from 8 to 2:30. Siblings, both and wives worked and one lived 7 hrs away. I hate the phrase "they did for you". They chose to have children. And I feel I have given back and more. For one thing, they had a free babysitter. With seniors living into their 90s the children are seniors too. We have worked as hard as our parents, raised our kids and sometimes our grandchildren. Retirement is our time. Our parents have to realize their limitations. That their children cannot be expectedto do it all.
But now, we are seniors too and caring for our parents is not our only responsibility. Unlike our mothers, we have fulltime jobs. Our spouses have elderly parents needing care, too. And we and our spouses have our own health problems that limit our abilities and command our daily attention. And....sometimes our kids and grandkids need us. You ask why the poster doesn't want the added burden? Perhaps because s/he already has a full plate with her own family and cannot added 24/7 hands on care of two elderly parents.
My mother came right out and said she never cared about me. As she put it herself, she only took care of me until my dad got home from work. When he died in 1974 I promised him I would take care of her. It didn't mean I had to do it all myself. It meant I would see she had a roof over her head, food, and medicine. Not all of us had parents who "took care of us".
If by chance they're incompetent, they'll most likely need a guardian
I do feel we owe something to our parents but not our entire lives and future. You need to see that they are in a home and are safe. However that does not mean you have to give up your life so theirs remains the same. That is the key.
To the OP, decide what you can continue to do and do that and only that. If they want to be independent let them....on their own. Let them really see what being independent is. My father was not nearly as bad as some of the elders on here but he still wanted too much and more than I could do. He ran me ragged with constant doctor appointments often over NOTHING until I finally put my foot down and said no more. I found that he wanted everything for his convenience and somehow had it in his mind me taking time from work to run him to a doctor's appointment was some sort of treat for me. I compromised with him and told him tot take a taxi to a late day appointment and I would pick him out and get him home. Even though it was out of my way I was willing to do that. His counter offer was to make the appointment after I got off of work. What he did not get was that I did not have the time to waste sitting in a waiting room for him because he didn't want to make the effort on his own.
Every time I took him out of AL this year he would mention wanting to go to the ER on our way home. He would prefer I sat with him in the ER for 6+ hours over something minor so he had an immediate ride home rather than being set over by AL and having to wait for a ride back provided by medical transport. He forgets I have work and other responsibilities.
Bottom line is. Decide what you can do and that is it. Let them figure out the rest. Maybe they will see the light of assisted living. There are many nice places, they no longer look like psych wards.
Chances are that parent or family member will be placed in Assisted Living or into nursing home where they will continue to thrive for many more years. If this was done earlier on, that caregiver would be alive today.
You never hear of 40% of young couples die caregiving babies, toddlers, grader schoolers. Not even 20% or even 5%.
I've been on these forums for a few years. I have seen caregiver writers here needing to stop taking care of a parent because they themselves had a massive heart attack, had strokes, several had stress related breast cancer, breaks from falls, etc.
My cousin was taking care of his Mom who refused to move from her house until she was 98. And his MIL also in her 90's, refused to move from her own house. My cousin and his wife had to give up their dream home and THEY moved into a senior community condo because he could no longer maintain 3 large homes plus cutting the lawns for the past 30 years. His Mom passed at 99. MIL, who is 100, recently sold her house and moved into the condo with them. The kicker here is, he is now developing dementia. Good-bye to their plans of world travel that they saved decades to enjoys.
I also had to toss away my bucket list, too :(
I say private caregivers if possible because in my experience they care from the depth of their heart, well caregivers from agencies still do good job but not like private caregivers.
Hopefully this will work out and in the end, the time we spend with her can be quality time, not "cleaning and running errands" time, which is what she needs us for. I'm cautiously optimistic.
Being honest with her was helpful, I think. I didn't sugarcoat anything and told her that she may not have the option of always remaining in the relative comfort of her own apartment. She knows that, but actually saying it to her--it was hard. I wish my sibs would stand up and help me, but they never have and won't.