This was supposed to be a well-check, so why is APS still around?

From my experience, those APS visits and investigations are triggered when you change nursing agencies, or you fire or stop using a private duty aide. If they seem intrusive you can call the case workers's supervisor and complain, and that may help. APS here in Virginia Beach has the philosophy that every elderly person with dementia needs to be in a nursing home. They have been after me for years to put my mom in a home, but I have 4 excellent caregivers who take care of her 24/7, and love her and she's happy, well fed, laughs a lot, and the live in aide has 2 dogs and a cat, which is great for my mom. If my mom was in a home, I would still need to pay people to be with her during the waking hours to give her the love and attention she deserves. Don't let APS get you down. Enjoy the time you have left with your dear mom, and say everything you want to say to her, and love on her every chance you get!

From my experience, those APS visits and investigations are triggered when you change nursing agencies, or you fire or stop using a private duty aide. If they seem intrusive you can call the case workers's supervisor and complain, and that may help. APS here in Virginia Beach has the philosophy that every elderly person with dementia needs to be in a nursing home. They have been after me for years to put my mom in a home, but I have 4 excellent caregivers who take care of her 24/7, and love her and she's happy, well fed, laughs a lot, and the live in aide has 2 dogs and a cat, which is great for my mom. If my mom was in a home, I would still need to pay people to be with her during the waking hours to give her the love and attention she deserves. Don't let APS get you down. Enjoy the time you have left with your dear mom, and say everything you want to say to her, and love on her every chance you get!

APS harasses families while the nursing homes have free reign. Go figure.

Wisdom in those words jeannegibbs :-)

It wasn't extremely early by elder standards. Countrymouse is again spot on.

First, my heart goes out to you, Misty. It is such an emotional time when someone we love is dying. Any small event can take on disproportional significance. I can imagine how upsetting the APS incident has been for you.

Someone reported a concern to Adult Protective Services? Who could this have been? If it was one of your siblings or even a neighbor perhaps they were worried about the pressure sore. It may not have been that the person thought you were doing anything wrong but that not enough was being done for the painful sore. (Unless you can think of someone who just wanted to make trouble for you, I would assume good intentions.)

APS is mandated by law to investigate reports of concern about vulnerable adults. So they were doing their job. (At an ungodly hour, for sure!) When they determined that all was well except a pressure sore their protocol probably required one of their nurses to verify it was being cared for properly. The nurse came, quickly verified that all was good, they left, and checked it off on their list. I think that if it hadn't been good APS would be looking at the hospice service for neglect.

When my husband was on hospice care in our home he had a pressure sore on his backside. The nurse checked it on every visit and I did as she instructed between visits. Still, I worried about that painful sore. If a nurse from another agency came in and checked it and said all was as good as it could be, I would have been relieved. My confidence in the hospice nurse would have been affirmed.

This was upsetting to you. That is understandable. But the outcome was that your caregiving was approved and the care of the pressure sore was found to be appropriate. Those are two good things. Be proud! Be grateful that the hospice nurse does a good job!

The hour was unfortunate, and perhaps the demeanor of the investigators could have been more compassionate. But they were doing their job.

You've got other things to focus on now. I suggest that you wait a couple of months after Grandma passes to decide what, if anything, you want to do about this.

To others who may be reading this: not allowing APS in to investigate suggests you have something to hide. That really does nothing to convince them that all is well. They do get crank complaints, and they know that. They would be as happy as you are if they can just confirm that all is well and close the case. Give them the chance to do the job the law requires them to do. Cooperate. Be as friendly as you can be under the circumstances. At the very least be polite. They'll do their job and close the case.

APS I gather is like my Office of the Aging. Neither would I appreciate a 7:45 visit. But, they don't need to call. They don't want you ready. I would have been mad too. Once you have them the hospice info that should have been enough.

If they come around again, set them straight. Absolutely no visits before 9am ever again, ask why this is really necessary since your grandmother is in hospice and dying. If they persist, let them know that all communications and more is going through your lawyer from here on in because this is becoming harassment.

Make all the excuses you want . I'm getting so filled up just reading this. My heart goes out to you . Been there,done that . Aren't those people suppose to be trained to have compassion and respect ? I'm from old school and they should have known better. They could have come later . God walk with you and your family during this time my Dear .You are in my prayers.

Gelleng, that is exactly what I finally did.
After basically harassing my Dad, who didn't really understand anything going on, I told them to call the family lawyer. Any further contact would be exclusively arraigned with and thru the family lawyer. And continued harassment by any of their personnel would likely be met in the future with legal steps.

I

I would be incensed about this. Who would have contacted them? That would be important. Why couldn't they first contact Hospice and the professionals already overseeing her care? No way would I let this stand. You may have to wait until your grandmother passes to deal with it, but I would get to the bottom of it. In the meantime, I wouldn't open the door to them and would have my attorney contact them.

Been there. Do not do anything that could be perceived as you hiding something! That attitude will only raise their suspicions and give them reason to obtain a court order to remove grandma from the home. You DO NOT want to go down that road!

When APS showed up at my door I was shocked and hurt and knew immediately who had requested the investigation. Aren't sibs wonderful? APS has a very important job to do, the more difficult you make it, takes time away from other cases that NEED their attention. Stop taking it personally and realize the person that requested them to check on Grandma, maybe in their brain, was doing what they thought best for her. And be proud that the care you are providing is good and for now they are finding grandma in good hands.

The quickest way to change that is to not answer the door, to not let them in, and avoid their questions. You will be much more comfortable with their inquiries if you cooperate.

It is stressful, but imagine how much more so if you were to try to keep them away.

Ah. If you shut the door in their faces APS can and probably will call the police and order your grandmother removed from the home. Plus their report will state that YOU didn't let them in. Go with "any more harrassment your lawyer will be actively involved". Let it spread through the NINE that you have a lawyer investigating who made the claim. If its one of them, the problem will cease immediately. Say only that to the family until the culprit is uncovered.

I know from experience, these people deliberately show up at odd times to "check" what is going on. If you don't let them, thing will go down hill as they think you are hiding something. Unfortunately, they will never tell you who filed a complaint or why and, quite frankly, they are not the most warm, courteous, compassionate people you would hope hold these jobs. Be careful what you say - the less you say, the better for you. Good luck.

You do not have to let them in

Any knock on my Mom's door before 9am can stand there till a decent hour comes round.

I have a very bad attitude about APS. They came right up to the point of accusing me! The family lawyer set them straight.

APS may do good for some people...but they are mostly on a witch hunt. If they can get into the middle of your families business...they can take your loved one away, take your love ones assets...and move your loved one to a facility that you will never find them. It is totally anti-family, anti-caregiver. Yeah, I had to get to the point of having the family lawyer make their bosses know a lawsuit would soon follow.

Beware. These people are only looking to make themselves look good in the eyes of their department regardless of what relationships they destroy in the process.

From what I've seen, it is the norm, at least in America that most adult children ignore their ailing parents and are poor to worthless as caregivers. Too much work, they don't care. Just collect the parents' social security check. I recently was treated horribly when mom had an infected pressure sore. I raced her to the emergency room after I found it on the weekend. Her medical issues literally come up suddenly. The ER nurse made me explain over and over and over again what happened and exactly when I found it. Was it an accident? No Moron, her pressure sore was not an "accident". What a stupid question. My mom's doctors know I give her the finest care. The ER does not. Specially built suite in my home, silk drapes, special bed, heat and massage recliner, fireplace mantle, flat screen tv, the finest doctors and specialists, designer clothes, Godiva chocolates. Frankly, I was offended. Greatly offended. I have the top lawyer in the state on retainer for mom. She recently was diagnosed with cancer. From what I've been told by many, Hospice completely takes everything out of your hands. You are out of the loop and at their mercy from then on. If my mother needs Hospice, I will work with mom's doctors and do it myself. Medicare has been more than happy to take their large sums from my mother and allow me to do all the work for free because they deem me quite capable. They don't put her in the hospital or nursing home to recover because I'm quite capable. They have "capabled" me into physical exhaustion and nervous collapse. I am recovering from cancer myself. I find it odd though, that APS is visiting a hospice patient twice, even once. I was told that there has to be a complaint for APS to come out. Its time to get tough. You haven't done anything wrong. If they come back and you get the impression they have a problem with you, make a strong statement in the form of a question. Do they have a problem with your care? If so, you demand a copy of the complaint for your grandmother's lawyer to review. You probably won't get it, but it shows them they can't take advantage of you. Witch hunt behavior goes on with hospice. It is unacceptable for both the dying and bereaved. If you are her legal guardian, determine whether you need hospice for her. At first blush, it appears someone has made a complaint or APS wouldn't be coming out. Family member? Is a Will involved? Or someone on the hospice team is not fond of you? What do they expect could have happened during the time of the first visit and the early morning vist? Was anyone on shift that night? There could have been a complaint about one of your nurses or hospice workers from possibly another patient's family. APS could be checking on all the patients cared for by this professional which is why they aren't telling you anything. It could jeopardize their case. Keep your eyes open. Any more problems, call her doctor and enlist his help for advice.

If you want to ring huge cathedral sized alarm bells in a CPS or APS person's head, just don't let them in the house. Suppose your grandmother was being abused or neglected? They don't know and they HAVE to check it out or they could go to jail. Look at it from their point of view. If you have nothing to hide, for god's sake, let them in. As for calling the cops, they would have the cops let them in. I have social workers in my family, and they have a job they have to do. It is not fun for them. They don't do it to entertain themselves.
Suppose someone was stealing her pain meds, or not changing her diapers, or letting the bed sores go? How do they know?
You are emotional at this point, I understand, but you sure as hell don't want to cause yourself more grief by getting on the bad side of a government agency for nothing. How about you sitting in jail while your grandmother dies?

7:45 AM would find everyone still asleep after a bad night! I, too, would be unhappy with both me being wakened, and the one needing sleep the most, and maybe needing a bath and change at that hour. I would protest the early hour. Yes, they need to check, perhaps without notice so they can see how things really are. But the our is unacceptable.

I like the first couple of responses in the thread. I would find myself more upset by having a confrontation in my gram's room or even out in the hallway with the intruders. And in the end it would probably escalate an alert issue causing even more unwanted "visitors". What I would like to suggest is that you write a letter to them. For one thing your position is made clear in writing and you would likely find yourself feeling calmer after you've written it down, much like journaling.

When APS showed up at my house, I informed her she was always welcome to check on my Father, but requested that she inform whomever made the anonymous tip that I would pursue them legally for making a false statement, which is a felony. I also informed her that upon the next visit, I would be contacting my lawyer for this matter to be handled.
Needless to say, never saw her again. Found out through the grapevine it was my Sister causing the problem. You know the Sister who didn't visit or lend not one minute of her time to help. I would assume it is one of the NINE, so that is your problem. Start asking them to help and see how soon the "wellness checks" stop. Ask them to start taking turns to stay with her, so that APS can visit with them, too, again, and it will cease.

I was once told by an APS person that typically when they visit they finds the situation either much better or much worse than expected, but seldom right where they expected. Hopedly your situation fits into the first of these three so they'll be satisfied and stay away.

One day I got a call from the aide that said APS was at my house asking questions. Of course, the aide had already answered most of the questions prior to notifying me, which is not cool but is what it is. Initially I was upset because there was no reason, my mom is being taken care of very well, there are no open sores, just issues with falling. Well the next visit was a scheduled visit with me so they could ask more questions to follow up with the report from whomever. They can't tell you who filed the report but they did read the report that was filed. I knew from the report that it was mom's doctor. Now, I'm livid!! Anyway, after several more visits during the times that different aides were at the house, they ended up closing the case.
Although I was upset, I didnt' have anything to hide. So I had no problem with them doing their job. It was the case worker that, off the record, recommended that I change mom's doctor, which I did. At the end of the day, I was more upset with her doctor.
Although I completely understand that the APS intruding at such a time in your grandmother's care while in Hospice is disruptive, the report was filed and the case workers have to do their job. No doubt they probably could have shown more compassion toward you and the family. But avoiding and ignoring them will not make them go away. They have to follow through with their procedure and you don't want them to think that there is something going on. Once they investigate the sore and find nothing wrong, they might make one last visit or phone call to close the case out but that should be it. I know here in New York the case is open for 60 days. I think the case worker came out 3 or 4 times on different days and times and found nothing wrong. Mom is happy and taken care of in a clean and loving environment. It didn't take a genius to figure that out :) It will add that the case worker ended up being very helpful in providing a list of doctors who work with dementia as well as contact for applying for VA benefits. I try to turn every incident into an opportunity.
Good luck. God Bless. My prayers are with you, your grandmother and family.

What you're probably going to have to do is just not answer the door next time they come around. After all, it is your home and you must set some boundaries. Businesses are not really supposed to be bothering you before at very least 9 AM. Next time they come, just don't answer the door plain and simple, problem solved. Keep your curtains drawn and your doors locked. Just stay very still and quiet until they leave next time they show up unannounced. You don't have to open your door and let them in, you don't even have to acknowledge them. No answer is a hint to go away, and if they don't just digging your heels and still not answer the door. They can't stay there all day you know, just let them knock or ring the doorbell and they'll eventually leave when they get no answer. If they become just as stubborn, just call the cops and remove them from the property, but don't answer the door and tell the cops you was trying to send a strong hint to leave you guys alone by just not answering the door because your family does not want to be bothered especially that early. By just not answering the door because your family does not want to be bothered especially that early. Just explain to the responding officer that your family really needs to be left alone and that your grandmother is dying. Explain that your family is very upset during this time and these other people are making matters worse. The officer should then tell the unwelcome visitors to leave. If they don't leave, they should be arrested. Another thing you could do is put a do not disturb on your main entrance where they're showing up, but best yet, put one on each door with a go away mat at the doorstep. You can also leave a note that says "leave us alone" on your door. It would be a good idea to call the cops now and at least let the police station know what's going on and that you may need some assistance. If you give them a heads up right now, they are more likely to be on your side because they can advocate for you during this time. Just call them and tell them what's going on and that you don't want these people showing up on your doorstep no more because your grandmother is in the dying process and very close to the end, and that the family does not want to be bothered by the APS or the uninvited nurse who is not your grandma's nurse. Let the cops know now while you have a chance before these people have a chance to show up on your doorstep again that way they'll at least have a record of it and they can act accordingly.

Now as for your grandma, what I would do before letting her go is lead her to Jesus because she will face him as soon as she dies, I can promise you that! She will be in eternity, and her decision will seal her fate or eternal life. They say the last thing to go before someone dies is your hearing, also talk to her about facing eternity. Encourage her to seek out Jesus because he's the only one who can save her and let her into heaven. She can still make a conscious decision even in this state if she happens to be conscious. There is life after this one, there's a world we cannot see in the physical realm with our physical eyes. We can only see the other world with our spiritual eyes, so while your grandma is transitioning from the physical life to the spiritual, don't be surprised if she sees something or seems to react to something on the other side

Way to go. Slamming the door in their faces would be sure to allay any concerns about your grandmother's welfare and get APS off your back.

The idea is to keep things under control and make the problem itself, not so much the people, go away. Any complaints or queries about their processes or their attitude can be dealt with later if anyone's got the time or inclination to bother; but right now they are just not what matters.

If the APS representative had no information and did not/would not tell you the reason for their visit, you shouldn't have let them in. I wouldn't have. I wouldn't have answered any questions, I wouldn't have given the rep the phone numbers of any of grandma's caregivers---NOTHING. Showing up--no matter if it is 7:45am or 7:45pm--unannounced is unacceptable. I wouldn't have answered the door, and in the case that I did, I would have told the social worker & VNS nurse to call and make an appointment. If they "had a question", they could have called and asked you the question. There is no reason for the air of suspicion---your grandma is on hospice, unresponsive and she is going to pass in the near future. She has a bedsore likely because she is unable to reposition herself, she's lost weight due to her unresponsiveness & her bony prominences have gotten more bony.

This really has nothing to do with your grandma & family's "sacred time"---it has to do with the unannounced visits, not giving you any reason for the initial visit & the second 7:45am visit of 2 people "because they had a question". If APS cannot give you even a hint about the reason for the visit, they shouldn't have been allowed in the house. That's how I would have dealt with it.

Thank you for letting us know that this can happen. My mom is just starting hospice care and I need to be ready for whatever anyone throws at me.

Extra people can feel very intrusive when you're spending the last hours with a loved one.

Vent away, and hugs to you. It was probably the pressure sore making some computer far away in some back office go into a paddy and keep raising alerts, and maybe the only way to shut it up was to visit?

I know that they're doing their job. 100% I know that, what I'm more upset over is the disregard for my grandmother's peaceful and restful state. That she wants to go Home and her NINE children are coming in and out to say goodbye and hypothetical after one of us have had our moment with my gram there's a knock. That is more than invasive. I know I'm taking better care of my grandmother than anyone else ever could. I have been her voice since day 1. Someone checking on me is annoying, someone disturbing her is uncalled for.

She has talked to everyone that is in our home almost daily, there is no assumption my gram is ok. She's being told she is fine.

I don't expect and I didn't ask who reported this. I asked why. if she doesn't know then what is she looking for?

Maybe I'm just venting! *sigh

I'm sorry for the fact that you grandmother is so ill and that you are facing her loss. I'm very glad that you have hospice involved!

APS has a duty to investigate when they receive a call of possible neglect or abuse. For very good reasons, they can't tell you where the concern came from. I wouldn't dwell on that. They've done their checking and found nothing amiss. They need to be able to check all their boxes so that there is no question about grandma's care.

I think many people in your situation become incensed that someone is checking up on them. Of course you're taking good care of grandma! Who would question that! But if you think about it, you can be glad that your local APS is diligent enough to check out every situation. I understand and empathize with your upset. But try to let it go.

Again, I'm so sorry for grandma's decline. I hope that she's at peace.