My 86 yr old Mom still writes her own checks and oversees her bank accounts (I know it's ridiculous; she refuses to relinquish control and she cannot be declared 'incompetent' per California state law even though she has dementia,
She doesn't drive so when AL can't take her she'll ask me to deposit a monthly check she receives for $400. I don't keep the receipts the bank gives to me (there is just no need) and she requests that I make a copy of the check that I deposit- again no need. My Mom is a paper freak- keeps literally everything- her place is cluttered with paper - she can't find things because of it and when I do help clean up she accuses me of throwing important papers out (which I don't - I trash the gazillions of solicitations she receives and the expired promotions for Macys & kohls). I told her I was saving all this bank crap to get her off my back; and said that I didn't feel compelled to give it to her because she has enough paper! I know I shouldn't have lied but I did and well here I am two weeks later with a voicemail from her asking for the receipts and such! What do I say????? This is so stupid- 50yrs old thinking about how to get myself out of a situation with my mom!
I had a mom pretty much like your mom. Wanted all her financial i's dotted and t's crossed. In a million YEARS I wouldn't have disregarded her wishes as you did. Probably some passive-aggressive stuff going on.
WHO THROWS OUT DEPOSIT SLIPS??
Without either, you have no proof other than the checking account statement that the checks were deposited as your mother requested. And it's not impossible for banks to make mistakes.
I'm wondering why though is she receiving $400 checks while she's in AL. It would be easier and safer to have them deposited directly with the bank - then you don't have to deposit them.
By your definition, I would be a paper freak too because not only do I keep financial data, I keep legal data as well.
Your false statement that you were saving "bank crap to get [her] off [your] back" when you weren't doesn't really suggest to me that you're the best person to be handling any aspect of your mother's financial affairs. It may seem like a little white lie, but it's a lie nevertheless. There's a big difference between junk mail and legitimate financial data.
How do you get out of the mess you've made? You go to the bank and pay to get a duplicate receipt. And you pay for it yourself; don't take it out of your mother's account. It's your mother's money, not yours, and she has the right to have the receipts.
Frankly, I think there's something else going on here.
And I would discourage my mother from wanting them. But if I couldn't talk her out of it and that is what she wanted, I'd save them for her. Copying her check before depositing it? I think I would encourage auto deposits if that is at all possible. So she wants you to copy the check, deposit it, and save the receipt ... so she can compare them later? And catch the bank in a mistake? Lordy, what a pain when you've got a million other things to do!
For now, sit down with her and the bank statement and go over all the deposits with her. Tell her that you'll start keeping the receipts for her. Go with her to the office and ask if it is OK for her to bring her checks in to have them copied. Let her be responsible for that end of it. (At least that is what I would do. Or you could say, politely, that beggars can't be choosers, and you'll deposit her checks for her but you'll do it your way.)
And really work on the direct deposit angle!
Clarise-I feel bad for you too, because you will be damned if you do, and damned if you don't. If you do keep the receipts, good luck finding the statements to match them to when a question arises. Your Mom won't be able to either. It is a good thing to try to help someone who has hoarding issues, however, many of us go about it in the wrong way. Persons doing finances on our behalf, whether paid or unpaid caregiving should do it the client's way to build trust, then make su
ggestions later to streamline the bookkeeping. Use the easy shoebox method.
Out of respect for anyone, do their stuff their way.
If you still want to throw everything away that is yours, consider this scenario:
An organizer-type person was hired to place all the resumes in the bottom drawer for the boss. Then the boss was in a throwing it away mood, so demanded all that be thrown out. The employee, knowing not to cross the boss, threw them all out. Later, the boss remembered he had quickly placed cash in there to hide it.
Gone. Boss needed a keeper!
I keep financial receipts, especially cashier's checks. I review them to remember how much money was given away to my family so I won't make that mistake again.
Clarise, if there is anything going on, maybe it is just worry that Mom acts like she doesn't trust you, and does not respect you for the limited time you do have to give to her? Hoping that if she sticks to her old-fashioned ways of banking that you can accommodate her wishes, at least as long as the banks will allow it.
Please don't take it personal, it's not you, it's her. Neither is wrong.
Anyone banking where they are charged fees for everything is just banking at the wrong bank. Have the transactions duplicated, please.
Clarise should be fired too!
Can we be fired if we're not getting paid? I guess so, hope so, soon would be good.
So I am afraid you are going to have to grin and bear it and either tell your Mum you trashed them - which quite frankly I would do - that's the most honest route and to quell her subsequent wrath - because you just know that is going to come - you will have already gone to the bank and requested duplicates.
They should be quite helpful if you explain that she is elderly and has dementia and is now fretting because she doesn't have them. She is going to be a hoarder of paperwork and there is no way round it hun so just grin and bear it and be good girl!!!!!!
I am Mum's POA and it is a REQUIREMENT that I keep every receipt known to man and then some so be warned if and when that time comes for you will be required to demonstrate above and beyond all reasonable doubt that you have acted in her best interests at all times. That is not saying you don't now but just a caution for the future. Good luck - let's hope she doesn't spank your bottom!
Send you're naughty!! AGAIN. Think it is easy to judge others without knowing the full facts and I am as guilty as everyone else of so doing but a lot of us on here are POAs so we KNOW how much paperwork is involved.......PS you don't have to be a POA..... if you don't like paperwork Clarise I would weigh that up before saying yes. I do all Mums banking on line now with the exception of deposits so I only have to do a print out but I do keep copies of deposit slips and receipts..... I have found the banks really helpful
As for keeping statements, I am slowly adapting to the paperless society, but I have always kept things until I reconcile my books at tax time. Of course, then I have to sit and shred everything at once, which is a pain.
It took me an entire summer to help my mother in law clean out her paper hoarded bedroom so she could see the bed and sleep in it. Sometimes you have to prioritize on thing over another. Even if she was the unluckiest person in the world and the bank messed up every deposit (though it's incredibly rare for it to happen even once), it wouldn't be the end of the world. I'm sure you're just doing the best in a very difficult situation, and I wish you peace.
I keep NO bank deposit slips; everything is online,and can be printed off if necessary. Can you get set up with online banking? Direct deposits, and online copies of all checks? Could you get someone at the bank to explain it to Mom?
Mom wanted me to run her to the bank every other day to make deposits and withdraw cash to give to me to run errands for her. She didn't believe in ATMs. I don't know how quickly your mom moves about, but my mom was slow as molasses in winter so any trip with her took 2x longer :) I just didn't have the patience for that on top of everything else. I was caring for her at home. It was a 24 hr job, so every task had to be done quickly & efficiently. I told her I needed an ATM card to make deposits for her and took her to the bank to get one. When I used the ATM to make deposits for her, I selected the 'receipt with copy of check image' option. Don't know if that's an option where you are - but it's nice. A scanned image of the check is on the receipt.
I think mom liked the junk mail addressed to her because she was losing responsibilities and it gave her something that was 'hers' - a feeling of worth? I can understand that. She had a small stack in her room and every now and then, I would pull a few from the bottom of the stack to throw out. She never noticed.
Caregiving is difficult. I tried to take her psychological needs in consideration and find methods that worked for both of us. Don't beat yourself up. Believe me; when she lies there dying - check receipts will no longer matter.
O get a paper statement sent to your home in large print just as longe as the bank knows it for a senior with bad vision then you can sit down with her and place it in aabinder and leave it where you cand keepit safe oh sorry you dont like paper money is paper that ck of ypur moms is paper and yes her junk mail is paper too and it seems pretty sad most older foke like me l9ok forward to that junk mail as no one has time to write but them and oh yes the banks you see to be an only child i say this becouse my brothers and sisters would have a fit if i did not do a simple thing like your mom asked of you
So just make it right and agree with Mom on the system she wants used.
I thought my 85 yo mom was the last person on earth who actually balanced their checkbooks to the penny every month. I have used online banking for ages...BUT, I respect my mom's desire to have written proof of whatever financial exchanges have transpired. I do keep deposit slips until I see on the computer that the deposit, or payment, whatever, has truly transpired and then I shred them. Mom keeps everything, as is her right. It's HER money, and we all respect that. whatever our particular feelings about paper clutter may be. She grew up in a time when you didn't trust banks and she never got over it. She does not have anything but her SS payments and ever penny of that needs to be accounted for. Also, with dementia, she may likely be feeling a little minimized and disregarding her wishes may make her feel less in control. I feel your angst at having a lot of paper "junk" around, but that is how my mom was raised, she has bank statements and tax returns going back 40+ years. It's a quirk and certainly not the worst thing she could be doing. Annoying? For sure, but not worth the stress. Do what you can to keep her "happy"...and hang in there. She can't have that many bank transactions if she's living in AL? Good luck!
Is it just about the paper, or does she think you didn't make the deposits (obviously if you hadn't her checks would have bounced)? I had this argument when I moved my mom in with me…she had tax returns, utility bills and bank statements going back 30 years. I told her if she wanted to keep them, she would have to rent a storage unit and hire someone else to take them there, along with her old training manuals from the early 1980's when she worked (the industry ceases to exist as she knew it then). The statute of limitations on a tax return is 7 years, and she hasn't worked or had taxable income in 10. We simply don't have room for that kind of tinder. I don't see the need in turning yourself inside out to appease her anxiety…that may sound cruel to some, but perhaps they don't understand the anxiety we feel being surrounded by mountains of useless (and I DO mean USELESS) junk and paper. Can you imagine having to go through all that stuff when she's gone to find something important? Also, if it's not the papers, it's the tupperware or ice cube trays or paper plate holders or seventeen shampoo bottles with 1 oz left in them. If we weren't here and they had to move to AL and had no other home, where do they think all that stuff would go? I feel for you…good luck!
If you deposit money in a machine the receipt will show the amount you claim to be depositing. But I know from experience that you may get a correction letter from the bank saying your account was credited $49.38 based on your input, but they found the deposit to be $49.83, and they are crediting the difference to your account.
Keep all the paper you want. No problem by me. But, please, stop being so judgmental about someone who has a different attitude and different behavior patterns. Clarise asked for advice on how to get out of a jam she got herself into. She didn't need her motives or her competence questioned.
Early in his dementia my husband went through a very paranoid period, especially about money. One day I have him the full bank statement and asked if he wanted me to go over it with him. No, he could do it himself. And he did -- with the papers upside down!
If you are dealing with someone not fully able to reason, you often have to come up with ways to satisfy them, even if they aren't efficient for you. Come here and vent!